wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    well the pats drafted brace in the second rd this past draft.wilfork in the first rd a few years ago.wilfork,s contract is up after the season.and probably will demand some better money,but then again brace,s contract hasnt happened yet either.wilfork has been a huge plus to the defensive line.sure he has some nastiness to him,but that can be a good thing at times.brace is unproven so far.is it worth the gamble to let wilfork walk after the season,and put all the marbles in one bag on brace?

    http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/11/pats-wilfork-have-yet-to-reopen-talks/
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from deluxbury. Show deluxbury's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]well the pats signed brace in the second rd this past draft.wilfork in the first rd a few years ago.wilfork,s contract is up after the season.and probably will demand some better money,but then again brace,s contract hasnt happened yet either.wilfork has been a huge plus to the defensive line.sure he has some nastiness to him,but that can be a good thing at times.brace is unproven so far.is it worth the gamble to let wilfork walk after the season,and put all the marbles in one bag on brace? http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/11/pats-wilfork-have-yet-to-reopen-talks/
    Posted by mosseffect43[/QUOTE]

    Hey Mossman.  I don't see them letting Wilfork walk because they have Brace on board.  I see him as the contingent plan if they can't come to an agreement with Wilfork - which is possible.  If they sign Wilfork, maybe they let Seymore walk and he replaces him.  Best case, is we sign Wilfork AND Seymore and Brace is solid depth that can give these guys a breather every few plays...  Regarless of how it all plays out, he sure looks like a perfect fit for the defensive scheme.  Great pickup!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    Still way to early to tell. I do think Brace will get some time in the DT rotation, if for no other reason than to keep Wilfork rested for the 4th quarter. People seem to think we need the greatest pass rush OLB(Peppers or Taylor) to be successful when you can put out a 4-3 that has Seymour, Wilfork, Brace and Warren; the opposing O Line can't double team all of them and you can still throw in an odd man blitz; that could make the pass rush a little better.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from arodrambone. Show arodrambone's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    I wonder what Wilfork's trade value is right now.

    We've been very lucky that Wilfork has been so healthy over the years, and I like having two nose tackles, but the price tag for Wilfork could be astronomical.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from deluxbury. Show deluxbury's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    Arodamnone:  I wouldn't even think of trading Wilfork.  The NT in a 34 defense is very difficult to find - especially a good one like Wilfork.

    Seymour on the other hand has a lot of trade value and in the last year of his contract.  I'm not suggesting we should trade Seymore but if I had a gun to my head and had to make a decision between him or Wilfork, I would have to say Seymour and then run a platoon of Green, Wright, Brace to replace him.  When Seymour is healthy and motivated he's the best in the business but it's rare he makes it through a season healthy and is on the wrong side of 30 now. 

    Before people start taking shots at me... I"M NOT SUGGESTING WE TRADE SEYMOUR! 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from ShiningWizard. Show ShiningWizard's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    I'd sign Wilfork to a 4 or 5 year extension.  When that runs out, Brace will be about done with his rookie contract and looking for a similar extension.  Why not experiment with both Wilfork and Brace ala Siragusa/S. Adams in Baltimore in '00?  Having Mayo behind them in the Ray Lewis role? 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Evil2009. Show Evil2009's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]well the pats signed brace in the second rd this past draft.wilfork in the first rd a few years ago.wilfork,s contract is up after the season.and probably will demand some better money,but then again brace,s contract hasnt happened yet either.wilfork has been a huge plus to the defensive line.sure he has some nastiness to him,but that can be a good thing at times.brace is unproven so far.is it worth the gamble to let wilfork walk after the season,and put all the marbles in one bag on brace? http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/11/pats-wilfork-have-yet-to-reopen-talks/
    Posted by mosseffect43[/QUOTE]

    How does one compare a seasoned vet who's proven his value with a kid out of college who hasn't played a single down of pro ball. And before camp even opens? Only a fool would allow Wilfork to walk in favor of a question mark.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BrooklineRob. Show BrooklineRob's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    One way or another this will resolve itself.  The Pats will either re-sign Wilfork or Seymour and tag the one they don't re-sign, and then trade or re-sign him.  I hope they learned a lesson from the Asante Samuel situation. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BrooklineRob. Show BrooklineRob's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]How does one compare a seasoned vet who's proven his value with a kid out of college who hasn't played a single down of pro ball. And before camp even opens? Only a fool would allow Wilfork to walk in favor of a question mark.
    Posted by Evil2009[/QUOTE]

    They won't let Vince walk because they control him this year and next I believe.  After that, they have the tag.   
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Grogan77. Show Grogan77's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    We need to see Brace play before we can make any comparison to Wilfork. 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]I'd sign Wilfork to a 4 or 5 year extension.  When that runs out, Brace will be about done with his rookie contract and looking for a similar extension.  Why not experiment with both Wilfork and Brace ala Siragusa/S. Adams in Baltimore in '00?  Having Mayo behind them in the Ray Lewis role? 
    Posted by ShiningWizard[/QUOTE]


    I'm not sure.  I think you let him play out his deal and then see what the situation is then.  Will 2010 be uncapped?  Will Wilfork still be effective, will he get hurt?  The life span of a NT with his body type can't be all that long.  And DTs in general seem to go from being very effective one year to being mediocre the next.  I like Wilfork, but I don't see giving him a big guaranteed deal right now as being smart, and BB is nothing if not smart in these matters.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from MVPkilla. Show MVPkilla's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    There is no way we let Wilfork walk, Brace is a great pick up for depth and all that but a Vince Wilfork he is not. Wilfork is the most importent part of our Dline and he has already said in public that he is not a Albert haynsworth, he does not want 100 million, he loves it in NE and his family loves it in NE and he has different prioritys then a guy liek haynsworth and does not needs huge contract just a fair one. I am not worried, we will resign Vince.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]There is no way we let Wilfork walk, Brace is a great pick up for depth and all that but a Vince Wilfork he is not. Wilfork is the most importent part of our Dline and he has already said in public that he is not a Albert haynsworth, he does not want 100 million, he loves it in NE and his family loves it in NE and he has different prioritys then a guy liek haynsworth and does not needs huge contract just a fair one. I am not worried, we will resign Vince.
    Posted by MVPkilla[/QUOTE]

    I'm not saying I wouldn't resign him, just not right now.  I think you play it out and see if he's healthy and effective then.  There's no need to rush into a deal that might not look so good in a year.  I doubt his market value is higher next year, it's pretty high right now.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    Wilforks value is high and the Pats know this.  They needed a safety net in case they couldn't make a deal or feel held hostage.  Now they can go about their business and offer Wilfork a contract that will be fair to both sides.  If Wilfork wants the big pay day it won't be with the Pats regardless if Brace was here or not.  At least we have a body to plug in there if things get out of hand.

    Wilfork has a big decision to make.  Does he want the big pay day or play for a playoff contender.  He won't be able to do both. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

         The Pats' defense was at its' best when it had Vince sharing the NT spot with either Keith Traylor, or "Mount" Washington. Vince and Brace would make a dynamite pairing.

         But, if Vince wants Haynesworth-like money...its' time for him to go. Look for Miami and Denver to be serious bidders for Vince.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Kmaxx. Show Kmaxx's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    Wilfork is gone.  I've herd the same thing before.  We will never let Ty Law go - gone.  D. Branch - gone. Willie Mc - gone. Ted Washington - gone.  A$$ante -gone.

    Everyone is replaceable, Wilfork is OK he not great - gone.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonBobBlowhard. Show BostonBobBlowhard's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]well the pats signed brace in the second rd this past draft.wilfork in the first rd a few years ago.wilfork,s contract is up after the season.and probably will demand some better money,but then again brace,s contract hasnt happened yet either.wilfork has been a huge plus to the defensive line.sure he has some nastiness to him,but that can be a good thing at times.brace is unproven so far.is it worth the gamble to let wilfork walk after the season,and put all the marbles in one bag on brace? http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/11/pats-wilfork-have-yet-to-reopen-talks/
    Posted by mosseffect43[/QUOTE]

    Are you serious????? Wilfork is a dominating young veteran in the National Football League. Brace is a reach rookie, picked way higher in the draft than any other boards had him, from the Atlantic Coast Conference. Brace played alongside a major force(Raji) who commanded the serious blocking and this allowed Brace to operate one-on-one in a college game. The NFL is loaded with DTs who come in as "monster-sized" collegians and get pushed around like rag dolls. All of this talk about how brilliant this Brace reach pick was (as well as the huge reach tackle in Round 2) is clueless. Pick 40 for Brace? Brilliant?? Ready to replace Wilfork???? Next you will tell me to get all fired up over the free agent QB from Michigan State as a next year back-up to Brady. Scott Pioli, please come back.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriots. Show themightypatriots's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    Better to lose Wilfork than Seymour.  I cannot think of 3-4 DE available to replace Seymour.  But if worse comes to worse you can just plug a big body in at NT.  Granted Wilfork is an exceptional NT, but if you just throw in someone who can hold his own against the Center, it's not that bad to the D.  But it's a lot harder to find someone with the height, weight, strength and and leverage to play 3-4 DE.  And if you can't find an adequate 3-4 DE, there goes your pass rush and run defense.  Seymour (or finding a darn good replacement) should be #1 priority right now.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    The best case scenario is that Brace is as advertised AND they can get a team friendly deal done with Wilfork.

    Big men like that wear down as the game goes on, so having two is just fine and dandy.

    I still maintain that the secret to the Giants defense was the incredible D-line depth. They had excellent players behind hall of famers.

    I would love to see that in NE, man.

    Someone else brought up Baltimore. The Ravens acually run the closest style of 3-4 defense to NE among the good 3-4 teams. They don't blitz often, they contain. They keep a really big front. They rely on great DB play to seal games. I could definitely see packages where they present a two NT front. Why not?

    Mayo can play Ray Lew and Meriweather can play Reed.

    But more to the point. Too many people are too defensive about faces and names. First, no one is letting Wilfork go for an unproven rookie. If any missed it, they play together this season. That means NE will know almost everything they need to know about Brace when any decision is made.

    Hence, it won't be an unproven rookie.

    If by next season Brace is doing as good a job, and Wilfork wants the whole hog contract . . .  why would you shed a tear? Because you like Wilfork? Is there something essential to his name that makes him irreplacable?

    If you can upgrade any spot, or make a lateral move for less salary, you do it. The NE front office has done that time and again.

    All that said, I think Brace will be a great pro NT. He is a brick wall and can totally collapse a pocket. And he doesn't make much money. So keeping two top notch big-men would be ideal.


     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from MVPkilla. Show MVPkilla's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    I agree that I would hate to see Seymore go but if it was between him and Wilfork i would take Wilfork. We wouldnt be able to replace seymore because you cant replace talent like that but we would have a much easier time pluging someone in at DE then we would at NT and Wilfork is the best Dlinemen we have right now.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    [QUOTE]Are you serious????? Wilfork is a dominating young veteran in the National Football League. Brace is a reach rookie, picked way higher in the draft than any other boards had him, from the Atlantic Coast Conference. Brace played alongside a major force(Raji) who commanded the serious blocking and this allowed Brace to operate one-on-one in a college game. The NFL is loaded with DTs who come in as "monster-sized" collegians and get pushed around like rag dolls. All of this talk about how brilliant this Brace reach pick was (as well as the huge reach tackle in Round 2) is clueless. Pick 40 for Brace? Brilliant?? Ready to replace Wilfork???? Next you will tell me to get all fired up over the free agent QB from Michigan State as a next year back-up to Brady. Scott Pioli, please come back.
    Posted by BostonBobBlowhard[/QUOTE] im not compareing the two.right now its wilfork hands down in my opinion.but im sure he is wanting some good money,and the pats dont like to shell out big money.so there contract talks are next to nill.so im wondering if the pats feel by drafting brace this year will cover the loss of wilfork if it becomes his last year.i would love to see both these beasts here on the team for a long time.what a defensive line the pats would have.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    ZB, I agree. Like NT rotation alot. The Pats could put out a HUGE 4-3 front and they can't double team all of them. Or as stated give reps to Brace when Wilfork needs a breather. The 64,000G question is a 3-4 DE harder to find than a 3-4 DT ?
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriots. Show themightypatriots's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    The 64,000G question is a 3-4 DE harder to find than a 3-4 DT ?

    Yes. 

    Adequate NT = 6'2" 320 pound tub who won't get pushed back by a center.

    Adequate 3-4 DE = 6'4"+ 310 pound lean, strong, fast giant who can run on stretch plays, hold his ground on dive/slash plays, and outstep an OT on passing plays.  Seymour is the only one I know who excels at all 3. 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    I disagree, the NT is much harder to find.  A 3 down NT is a rare beast.  Before Wilfork, we had a season with horrible run D, then he came, out run D improved dramatically.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriots. Show themightypatriots's posts

    Re: wilfork or brace who gives the pats the best option?

    Wilfork is a 2 down NT. 
     
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