Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    http://blog.masslive.com/patriots/2013/11/patriots_mailbag_what_kind_of.html

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    No simply because Gronk is an animal.  Vereen will have a positive impact not just because of his skill level, but because of the position he plays.  He is by far the best 3rd down back on this team and I think we'll see Brady hold the ball less if guys aren't open down the field when he comes back.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    Gronk is one of the best players in the NFL... he's virtually impossible to defend.

    Vereen is a solid/good player and his return will help, but not to the same level as Gronk.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    I'm going to go ahead and say it is closer than it appears.

    NE has been operating without a 3rd down back. This is a position that isn't even optional in the modern NFL. They've compensated by removing the difficult patterns and using other RBs who aren't very good at catching the ball, holding the RB back in protection (not the best idea imo), and simply using other packages ... but none of that is the same. 

    It's not so much that Vereen is going to cause a sea change in how teams can cover other players, but that he is going to help keep the chains moving every now and again and give the rest of the players another crack at a big play. 

    Bit by bit, as they get pieces back, this offense is going to look more like what it should have been from day one, and how they likely imagined it from the outset. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Gronk is one of the best players in the NFL... he's virtually impossible to defend.

    Vereen is a solid/good player and his return will help, but not to the same level as Gronk.

    [/QUOTE]


    I do not 100% agree. Yes, Vereen is a solid/good RB, maybe if given health, he could be more. But coming out of the back field with a LB covering him is just as much a mismatch as a S on Gronk. There is not a LB in the league that Vereen does not have a decisive advantage over.

    I like Bolden out of the back field on screen and check down plays, but I sense he is opeating at 80% with the knee. A healthy Vereen imo will be night and day difference for this offense

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    No simply because Gronk is an animal.  Vereen will have a positive impact not just because of his skill level, but because of the position he plays.  He is by far the best 3rd down back on this team and I think we'll see Brady hold the ball less if guys aren't open down the field when he comes back.

    [/QUOTE]

    That's what I'm saying. 

    The equivalent would be playing defense without a dime corner/safety. Yeah, you can use a Lber. And getting your star corner back might be a bigger overall gain. But based on the fact that you were playing without a whole, valuable position in your arsenal, even getting an average player back who can fill that role adequately is a huge lift to your game plan. 

    Add to that: Vereen has well above average talent. 

    No he isn't Gronk, but he adds a position to the offense they simply didn't have prior to his return. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to anonymis's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    http://blog.masslive.com/patriots/2013/11/patriots_mailbag_what_kind_of.html

    [/QUOTE]


    I def. dont think his impact will be felt as much as Gronk was BUT he will actually open things up for Gronk even more so. As it stands now any opposing team has to dedicate their best coverage Linebacker to Gronk. Most teams only have one. (We have none on our starting defense) so when Vareen comes back, that coverage linebacker HAS to be assigned now to Vareen in case he splits out wide which opens up the middle for Gronk as well as puts a lesser defender on the best tight end in the league. Its gonna allow for mismatches on every snap like weve seen the past couple years when we had Gronk and Hern on the field together(the little time they were)

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    My fear with Gronk and now Vereen is how they each represent Brady's giddyness to want to throw more.

    Clearly, Vereen has nice skills and will be a welcome return, but McDaniels/Brady need to stay disciplined with balance.  Subbing Vereen in and off to run a pass play will be disastrous.

    [/QUOTE]

    hmmmm..  It is "Brady" that wants to throw more?  How do you know?  Isn't it one of your tenets for the team to continue to go with what works until it doesn't?  Yes, you can have some balance, but, if the other team can't stop the passing attack, why eschew it just to throw in some run plays just for the "balance"?  Yeh, I know, "Got to keep the other team honest."  you'll say.  Considering the Pats are one of the league leaders in rushing TDs, your thinking that all Brady wants to do is pass for TDs etc is rather shallow.

    I can just imagine you being a Broncos fan and how you'd react to Manning and how he likes to pass all the time. 

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to mbeaulieu07's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Gronk is one of the best players in the NFL... he's virtually impossible to defend.

    Vereen is a solid/good player and his return will help, but not to the same level as Gronk.

    [/QUOTE]

    This.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    Yes, put this into perspective. A healthy Vareen means we don't have to rely on stone hands, slowpoke, no real talent Bolden. Vareen is a match up nightmare,  same as Gronk, and seeing how this team could use a 3rd down option since theyre one of the worst teams at it, Vareen's return will be greatly welcomed.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MoreRings. Show MoreRings's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Yes, put this into perspective. A healthy Vareen means we don't have to rely on stone hands, slowpoke, no real talent Bolden. Vareen is a match up nightmare,  same as Gronk, and seeing how this team could use a 3rd down option since theyre one of the worst teams at it, Vareen's return will be greatly welcomed.

    [/QUOTE]


    Agreed, Vereen is something that opposing teams D's have to prepare for.  He is a big play waiting to happen.

     

    With any luck he is fully healthy and well rested for the final stretch of the season. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from CHAMPSXLVIII. Show CHAMPSXLVIII's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    Is Vereen a good at blitz pick up- I don't remember ever seeing him do it

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Uncle Rico. Show Uncle Rico's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    My fear with Gronk and now Vereen is how they each represent Brady's giddyness to want to throw more.

    Clearly, Vereen has nice skills and will be a welcome return, but McDaniels/Brady need to stay disciplined with balance.  Subbing Vereen in and off to run a pass play will be disastrous.

    [/QUOTE]

    Praise the lord you aren't the OC. 

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from MoreRings. Show MoreRings's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    You could always find a Jets board Mangione.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to CHAMPSXLVIII's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Is Vereen a good at blitz pick up- I don't remember ever seeing him do it

    [/QUOTE]

    YEs, but none of them are Faulk good. 

    Blitz pickup is valuable, but overrated. No RB is going to be good enough at pickup to merit being a dedicated blocker. 

    When it comes to Vereen, I'd be more comfortbale splitting him to the line where he can negate a blitz by being open and catching the ball. 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    If I look at from a slightly different perspective and ask "If I had both, but was forced to give up one, who would I give up?"  My answer to that would be "I'd give up Vereen before Gronk (assuming both are at full health). However, adding Vereen to this offense will I think add a boost almost as large as adding Gronk did.  What's happening is we're becoming a complete team, and every piece you add to complete the team makes every one else better.  It's kind of a multiplicative rather than an additive effect. 

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    Gronk isn't even up to speed on run blocking.  Getting a fully operational Gronk versus the Gronk of last week is the equivalent of getting Vereen back.   Both would be nice.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    Let's not get silly here. I like Vereen but he has only had a couple of good games as a pro. Gronk on the other hand...

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    "hmmmm..  It is "Brady" that wants to throw more?  How do you know?"

    Because Brady is pass-happy and out of control and even Belichick, the greatest GM/coach of all time, can't control him even though he is the greatest ever. 

    Yes, this is the brilliant argument Rusty uses as the basis for his posts in this forum.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sportswizard1. Show Sportswizard1's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    I like the fact that he is returning and his impact will be immediate. Nice to have a double threat with Gronk and Vereen back together, not too dismiss the effect of the SWR's Edelman and Amendola, and the emergance of Dobson as a downfield threat. The better returnee is Talib,he's the best cover back the Pats have had since Ty Law.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsfaninpa420. Show patsfaninpa420's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    When just comparing their impact on the offense rather than capabilities at their respective positions I would say he will have as much as an impact to the offense with his return as Gronk did. We've only had a one game sampling of him in his second year but he did put up 159 yards combined. Vereen being a legitimate threat in both the run and passing game makes him just as valuable even with Gronk being so dominant in his position. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from agill1970. Show agill1970's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    I believe that next to Gronk he is most certainly our most dynamic and dangerous player.  The very first thing my mind did when Hernandez decided to go Scarface is think, "Shane Vereen's stock just went soaring", as he's the only one on the team that can do the kind of things with the level of versatility that Hernandez could do.  Sure, he's only had a couple of good games, but he's only been fully gamed planned into a couple games as well.  I firmly believe that given more playing time (and week 1 certainly suggests that's the plan), this is a guy that defenses are going to have to game plan for regularly and with a healthy amount of dread.  At the very least, our 3rd down conversion rate is about to go up and that is a beautiful thing indeed. 

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Spetznaz24. Show Spetznaz24's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    What has Vereen done in the NFL to warrant those kind of expectations from him? Comparing his impact to Gronks is silly.

    He has had a few solid games,  thats about it!  In fact he hasnt lived up to his 2nd round draft status!

    He had 250 rushing and 8 receptions for 150 yards   during the entire 2012 season! 

    Jeez, people really need stop being such homers and take the blinders off. 

    He is no Darren Sproles,  he is not even close to Danny Woodhead.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    In response to Spetznaz24's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    What has Vereen done in the NFL to warrant those kind of expectations from him? Comparing his impact to Gronks is silly.

    He has had a few solid games,  thats about it!  In fact he hasnt lived up to his 2nd round draft status!

    He had 250 rushing and 8 receptions for 150 yards   during the entire 2012 season! 

    Jeez, people really need stop being such homers and take the blinders off. 

    He is no Darren Sproles,  he is not even close to Danny Woodhead.

    [/QUOTE]

    When he has been able to stay on the field, he is a difference maker. Other than Brady of course and Gronk, and maybe eventually Dobson down the road, the pats offense is sorely lacking difference makers. Vereen can be a difference maker if healthy....and he will have the freshest legs on the team. Ridley, Amendola and Edelman are solid players, but not difference makers. Every other skill position player on offense is JAG. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Will Vereen Have Same Impact on Offense as Gronk?

    I think Vereen is a very versatile player and used correctly could be huge for this offense.  We all witnessed what he could do last year in the playoffs vs the Texans.  1 rushing td and 80+ yards and 2 td's receiving out of the backfield.  I think it was one of the biggest Patriots coaching blunders ever last year not using Vereen heavily in the gameplan vs the Ravens in the last playoff game.

    Vereen needs to stay healthy of course but yes, I believe if he can stay healthy and they use him correctly then he will be big, Gronk like, for this offense.  I personally can not wait to see him back.

     
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