With all Due Respect ...

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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/NoHiCapChemSpray.pdf

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

    More than 3000 people died in this Countries largest mass murder on 9/11/01...

    Taken down by evil and box cutters.

    You can ban guns if you wish...but you will never ban evil.

    People who use the death of children to push their anti-gun agendas are truely pieces of S,,T

     

    Nothing more...nothing less



    And more than 30,000 die every year thanks to gun violence.  That's the equivalent of ten 9/11s every single year.  If Americans were logical they'd understand that 9/11, while dramatic, was nothing like the annual slaughter that takes place in America thanks to easy access to firearms.

    And it is odd, isn't it, how Americans after 9/11 were all okay with restrictions on the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 8th amendments in the interest of public safety, but seem to think the 2nd amendment is somehow inviolable.  

     

     

     

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    Let me know how you would ban evil and box cutters and I'll work with you to get it done....

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    It's impossible to ban evil. It's not so hard to make high-capacity weapons less accessible to evil people however.  Dozens of other civilized countries do it. That's why most other advanced industrialized counties have far fewer deaths from firearms than the US.  

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1246426--anders-breivik-jailed-indefinitely-for-2011-norway-massacre

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

    http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1246426--anders-breivik-jailed-indefinitely-for-2011-norway-massacre



    There's a reason these kind of killings are much rarer in Europe than in the US.  Sure, any determined nut can succeed if he works hard enough at it.  But it took Breivik years of planning to pull off his massacre.  Much like it took years of planning for Al Qaeda to pull off 9/11.  The easy access to high-capacity guns in the US, however, allows for massacres to be planned and executed easily and quickly. That's why there are many more of them in the US than in other advanced nations. 

    Norway, by the way, has a firearm homicide rate of 0.05 (per 100,000 people), compared with 2.97 for the US.   

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    It ain't about guns. It's about parents doing their due deligence and getting their children help when they need it. In the old days this kid would probably have been in an institution and never had the chance to walk around in society and commit the heinous crime. But nowadays the liberal thought process is let everybody have a chance and win a trophy for coming in 5th place. People today are afraid to ring the alarm bell when someone needs help and then should not be roaming the streets .

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    Evil is evil...

    Killing is killing....no matter the rate of occurance....

    Why would you seek to rationalize the difference between the two....

    Boggles my mind...

    I'm done with this.

    I broke my promise to myself to only talk football here...and until today was able to do that.

    As old as I am I have still not learned to resist confronting stupidity...

    My bad....

     

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to Quagmire3's comment:

    Cap your obviously more informed on football than gun rights, so stick to football! Guns dont kill people any more than cars kill people (when driven by a drunk) or forks make people fat. Evil people kill people. P.S. I dont expect my answer to be very popular in the liberals lair of "The Peoples Republic of Massachusetts" but its one gun owners opinion. P.P.S no assault weapons were used in Connecticut, 2 handguns a 9mm and a glock 40.



    Q - I agree with you. How about we talk about raising good kids. Slow down America and spend time with your children. Guns do not kill people! 

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to Casportsfan's comment:

    In response to Quagmire3's comment:

    Cap your obviously more informed on football than gun rights, so stick to football! Guns dont kill people any more than cars kill people (when driven by a drunk) or forks make people fat. Evil people kill people. P.S. I dont expect my answer to be very popular in the liberals lair of "The Peoples Republic of Massachusetts" but its one gun owners opinion. P.P.S no assault weapons were used in Connecticut, 2 handguns a 9mm and a glock 40.



    And why does any person need a glock anyway???  To go hunting Deer??  Yes guns don't kill people.  People WITH guns kill people.  Explain how this guy was going to kill 27 people with a FN knife or a pipe.  It's not a liberal thing.  It's kind of a common sense thing.  Love to hear your answer to that question.

     




    Do you REALLY think if somebody wants to kill a whole bunch of people they couldn't do it without guns? You've GOT to have more common sense than that.



    I would think it would be really hard. You can't just walk into a school and set up a bomb - most if not all schools have at least one security guard on duty (many 24 hours a day). Some schools have more security cameras than government buildings. The guy that shot all those innocent children couldn't of walked into that school and wired some pvc piping in the hall and set up his bomb...someone would of seen him.

    The only way to walk into a school and kill innocent children is with hand guns and semi automatic weapons. It happened yesterday, it's happened before yesterday and it will happen again...and it will be from guns.

    I really don't know what the answer is, but something needs to be done. Lockdown for most schools is shutting your room's lighs off, lock the door and getting the children on the floor. Basically what you are doing is playing a game of hide and seek against a guy with guns, it's not like the physco won't go looking in the classroom. And all he has to do is shoot his way in. This to me will only save kids when he runs out of bullets...not good enough. 

    I would suggest government agencies that have experience against these types of situations will have to come up with something. You can't hire a police officer for every school - it's too much money. What if they made it a requirement to have one/maybe two school administrators have to come from law enforcement and be armed? They still would be just a regular administrator, except they would have a gun and be trained to use it under a circumstance like this. This would not effect the school budget one ounce - they would be a normal administer - with the addition of a fire arm. They wouldn't have to create these jobs, just hire someone as administrators retire. The whole process would take two years max.  

    Just a thought...I'm sure they can come up with better, but they had better do something because this will happen again. People need to be trained against this type of thing.

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to Casportsfan's comment:

    In response to Quagmire3's comment:

    Cap your obviously more informed on football than gun rights, so stick to football! Guns dont kill people any more than cars kill people (when driven by a drunk) or forks make people fat. Evil people kill people. P.S. I dont expect my answer to be very popular in the liberals lair of "The Peoples Republic of Massachusetts" but its one gun owners opinion. P.P.S no assault weapons were used in Connecticut, 2 handguns a 9mm and a glock 40.



    And why does any person need a glock anyway???  To go hunting Deer??  Yes guns don't kill people.  People WITH guns kill people.  Explain how this guy was going to kill 27 people with a FN knife or a pipe.  It's not a liberal thing.  It's kind of a common sense thing.  Love to hear your answer to that question.

     




    Do you REALLY think if somebody wants to kill a whole bunch of people they couldn't do it without guns? You've GOT to have more common sense than that.



    I would think it would be really hard. You can't just walk into a school and set up a bomb - most if not all schools have at least one security guard on duty (many 24 hours a day). Some schools have more security cameras than government buildings. The guy that shot all those innocent children couldn't of walked into that school and wired some pvc piping in the hall and set up his bomb...someone would of seen him.

    The only way to walk into a school and kill innocent children is with hand guns and semi automatic weapons. It happened yesterday, it's happened before yesterday and it will happen again...and it will be from guns.

    I really don't know what the answer is, but something needs to be done. Lockdown for most schools is shutting your room's lighs off, lock the door and getting the children on the floor. Basically what you are doing is playing a game of hide and seek against a guy with guns, it's not like the physco won't go looking in the classroom. And all he has to do is shoot his way in. This to me will only save kids when he runs out of bullets...not good enough. 

    I would suggest government agencies that have experience against these types of situations will have to come up with something. You can't hire a police officer for every school - it's too much money. What if they made it a requirement to have one/maybe two school administrators have to come from law enforcement and be armed? They still would be just a regular administrator, except they would have a gun and be trained to use it under a circumstance like this. This would not effect the school budget one ounce - they would be a normal administer - with the addition of a fire arm. They wouldn't have to create these jobs, just hire someone as administrators retire. The whole process would take two years max.  

    Just a thought...I'm sure they can come up with better, but they had better do something because this will happen again. People need to be trained against this type of thing.



    Some people talk about "culture" being the problem.  In a way, I agree.  It seems to me (especially now that I've lived and traveled al lot outside the US) that America is a country that is just full of anger and fear.  I don't really understand that.  America isn't a bad place to live at all.  Why are Americans so tense and angry and fearful nowadays?  It's odd, really.  In many ways, it's the greatest place to live.  But Americans are like the guy in the Talking Heads song: 

    I can't seem to face up to the facts
    I'm tense and nervous and I
    Can't relax
    I can't sleep 'cause my bed's on fire
    Don't touch me I'm a real live wire

    Psycho Killer
    Qu'est-ce que c'est
    fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa fa far better
    Run run run run run run run away
    Psycho Killer
    Qu'est-ce que c'est

     

     

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    It also does NOT help with the media picking up on this Dec 21st crap. Even National  Geographic channel an educational channel has its "Doomsday Preppers", and Mayan Calender specials on the world ending. All this does is set a fatalistic tone, and a timeline for these wackos who believe this crap to "settle" their made up grudges

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to RockScully's comment:

    In response to CaptnFoxboro's comment:

     

    To all the brave Americans who valiantly defend

    the right to own semi-automatic assault rifles :

     

     F the NRA  ( F U too )

     

     




    Agree.  I don't get why anyone needs a military style weapon.  

    Outside of a pistol, shotgun or rifle, I don't see why those kinds of weapons are needed. They aren't self defense or hunting weapons.  They're designed to kill as many people as possible at the highest rate possible. 

    There isn't even a good argument for those kinds of weapons to be on the open market.

    Apparently, that little turd bought the gun legally, but this just proves it goes beyond street/stolen guns where violence occurs in otherwise peaceful communities. It's just sick.

    The fact is, he would have killed less people with a less potent weapon.

    I used to be one that would believe it's the person that kills people, not the gun, but at this point, that statement falls on deaf ears. We have a bigger population, more problems, etc, which just increases the chances for things like this to happen.

     



    Rusty, what's amazing is that it's so easy to legally buy high-capacity weapons in the US.  I'm a hunter, I own three shotguns (and a high-powered air rifle for target shooting), I've done some target shooting with pistols and rifles (though they were friends' guns, I don't own any rifles or pistols), so I'm not anti-gun at all.  But the fact that nearly anyone can purchase high-capacity weapons in the US is just ridiculous.  These are killing machines, pure and simple.  Sure, most people who own them won't use them for their intended purpose (killing people), but why make them easily available so that nuts who do want to kill can do so with ease?  

    Second amendment arguments are ridiculous.  We dispensed with the 4th, 5th, 6th and 8th easily enough when we got afraid of terrorists.  Terrorists are a much smaller threat to most Americans than gun-toting lunatics in our schools and shopping malls.  We have one major terrorism attack a decade at most--and the worst killed less than 3,000 people--a lot of people certainly (and I don't mean to diminish the signficance) but still nothing compared with the 30,000 who die annually by gun violence in America.  It would be very easy to ban (or heavily restrict) the distribution of high-capacity magazines and firearms.  Most civilized nations do so already.  If you think the second amendment is an obstacle, then amend the amendment.  It's possible to do.  All it takes is the will to do it. 

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    I live outside the US and so maybe my perspective is off but I agree with both the sentiment that you can't effectively legislate against insanity but also the sentiment that there's no reason for handguns or semi-automatic weapons to exist, outside of legitimate military use.

    Many people in Canada, myself included, own hunting rifles or shotguns. Tons of hunters up here. But those are weapons with a legitimate purpose in their manufacture aside from killing people.

    Maybe one has to be American to get it but I've never understood why Americans think they need to have handguns for example.

    It would seem faulty logic to assume that there are more crazy people in the US than other countries yet the US has more gun violence. Logically that means the issue is the crazy people in other countries are still there but have less access to items designed to kill.

    In other places where a minor dispute escalates into violence someone gets punched or maybe stabbed but usually the people survive. When anyone can carry a gun it instead results in death.

    In some ways it's the spontaneous acts of violence that make a greater case for gun control than the planned atrocities of crazy people.

    Having said the above my heart goes out to all the people directly affected by such an unthinkable act.

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to IrishMob7's comment:

    Yes, because banning the possession of firearms will surely put a stop to demented individuals who want to kill.  I mean, if possessing guns were illegal, then none of this would have happened, right?  Just like the possession/use of drugs, murder, rape, etc. are all illegal so they don’t happen.

    What a well thought out, rational post.  Get a grip on reality, buddy.  These events are obviously tragic and cannot even fathom how a person can succumb to such evil, but banning the use of firearms is not going to help the cause.

    I’m all for creating stricter gun laws and banning the possession of semi-automatic weapons, but to sit there and say that banning all firearms is a solution to mass killings is simply obtuse and ignorant.  




     

    I get your post but I firmly believe less guns  = saved lives

     

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to ricky12684's comment:

    for those naive enough to think a) gun laws will keep guns off the street, and b) without guns crimes like this won't happen...

    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/asia-pacific/2012/12/2012121481220620325.html

    nearly 2 dozen children stabbed in attack at chinese school same day of shooting in connecticut.

     




    I did hear this and I haven't heard any of the facts, but I can assure you that if a guy walked into a school in America with a knife he would not be able to kill 24 children...no way. A teacher would put their own life in harms way to stop that - they can't do that aginst a gun unless they are armed themselves. They will to try to stop a guy with a gun, but chances are they will be shot before they get within ten feet of him. I'm not saying we wouldn't die from a knife, but at least you'd have a chance.

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    In response to RockScully's comment:

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

    It ain't about guns. It's about parents doing their due deligence and getting their children help when they need it. In the old days this kid would probably have been in an institution and never had the chance to walk around in society and commit the heinous crime. But nowadays the liberal thought process is let everybody have a chance and win a trophy for coming in 5th place. People today are afraid to ring the alarm bell when someone needs help and then should not be roaming the streets .




    I don't think it's liberal or conservative at all. I think it's bad parenting to some degree.  Just look around at some of these kids today. No manners, no social skills, no balls, no character, no street smarts, etc.

    Not all, but it's true.  There's a marked difference and I agree the "5th place" thing is true.  I think some schools actually took out stuff like dodgeball because of whiny parents. Pathetic. 

    I just had some kid tell me I needed to tell him what I was using at a gas station when I was buying some water and a snack (debit or credit card).  I said, "excuse me"?  He's like "yeah, you need to tell me what it is", after I swiped my card.  Umm, I am pretty sure it's your job to ask me if I am using a debit or credit card, kid.  That's part of YOUR job.

    That, in a nutshell is the difference between Gen X and these younger generations now.  I would have never in a million years at age 16-21 while working minimum wage busting my azs in high school or college have been that rude to a customer and acted unprofessional.  But, we see that kind of stuff all the time. Throw in the social media crap, video games, texting, etc, and it's just ripe for distraction for what is important, no doubt.  All that electronic stuff is fine in moderation, but jesus.  Some of these kids have ZERO social skills or the ability to think normally/critically.  They don't read books. I know that.

    But, that's what  is happening in a lot of cases.  We have morons having kids. But, those morons could work as a janitor or work as a banker on Wall St. It doesn't really have anything to do with political parties or approach.

     



    I was just talking about this yesterday with my baking buddies at school during lunch (about the same time I got a text about the shooting) and we were saying that the smart phone may now be the single most distracting thing in education. This is a relatively new problem and schools haven't yet figured out how to handle it, right now administrators are thinking it can help in the educational process...bull. These kids text in class, video tape, take HD pictures and in five minutes it's on the internet. They look at you while you're up there teaching and their hands are under their desk  texting the whole time. If you try to take their phones away it becomes a major major distraction, plus if a kid has some sort of inapropriate photos on that phone they can accuse you of looking at them...and if the phone gets stolen out of your desk you are on the hook for the 400 dollar iphone.

    If you give a kid a test he can easily take a picture of it and text it to his friend in the next class - they can also text eachother for answers. All they have to do is ask for a bathroom pass - text anything they want about the quiz in there and come back with the answers, because you can't deny a student a pass to the bathroom. It's gotten out of control on so many levels with the youth in this country and this electronic age is making it much worse.

     

     
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    Re: With all Due Respect ...

    As it turns out the rifle was not used.  Without a strong opinion on the matter as I am not a gun owner, we may someday see an assault rifle ban, but you'll never see that with handguns, and that's what this monster used.

     
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