Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    Blehhhh.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to craze4sox's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to mrmojo1120's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ken RosenthalVerified‏@Ken_Rosenthal

    Source: #RedSox, Dempster in serious discussions. No deal yet; still possible he could sign elsewhere.

    [/QUOTE]

    If Mr. Henry allows a Dempster signing and we don't look to improve any further in the starting rotation he may as well sell the team.  This would certainly convince me anyway that this team may never get  back on track.

    [/QUOTE]

    Hyperbole much?

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    Please, no.  Please.  

    I mean, why put chips in on an A.L. battle tested gamer who comes at good value (McCarthy) when you can overpay for an overthehill NL softy who is sure to be more dead weight?

    I was good with the overpays for Napoli, Victorino, even Gomes.

    But I would just assume they stand pat on a starting pitcher than throw money at Dempster.  We have a plenty of options as shaky as him, only with more potential upside.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    +!

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Please, no.  Please.  

    I mean, why put chips in on an A.L. battle tested gamer who comes at good value (McCarthy) when you can overpay for an overthehill NL softy who is sure to be more dead weight?

    I was good with the overpays for Napoli, Victorino, even Gomes.

    But I would just assume they stand pat on a starting pitcher than throw money at Dempster.  We have a plenty of options as shaky as him, only with more potential upside.

    [/QUOTE]

    Aceves and Morales could both do as well as Dempster. I actually would like them to give Aceves a shot.  I like crazy people with unharnassed talent.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Little midget Rosie on top of things. What a disaster contract to a bum if this ends up with Dempster joining Lackey on the 2nd rate bums with 1st rate contracts Red Sox liability list.

    [/QUOTE]  Softy,  We could use another "old underperforming twilight type pitcher looking for last call/stop !!!!

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from charliedarling. Show charliedarling's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    Give Aceves the 30 starts you hope to get out of starting pitcher over the course of the full season and he will clearly outperform Dempster in Boston.

    Lots of other choices out there before grossly overpaying for another older free agent unless it is a one year deal.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Please, no.  Please.  

    I mean, why put chips in on an A.L. battle tested gamer who comes at good value (McCarthy) when you can overpay for an overthehill NL softy who is sure to be more dead weight?

    I was good with the overpays for Napoli, Victorino, even Gomes.

    But I would just assume they stand pat on a starting pitcher than throw money at Dempster.  We have a plenty of options as shaky as him, only with more potential upside.

    [/QUOTE]

    I've been crying for top starting pitchers for about 6 years now, but I have to agree with you on this. I mean Tazawa has a better chance at success here than Dempster. Certainly between Tazawa, Morales, de la Rosa and Webster, one will do better than Ryan here in Boston.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

       The "BIG O" is all for your last contract being based on what you did at age 26-29...... The fact that your now 34/35 means "good for you"........  The "BIG O" AND THE UNION APPROVES OF THIS MESSAGE !!!

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    I am pretty sure Softy should save this Post.....I can't recall any time when everybody agreed with him.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to charliedarling's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Give Aceves the 30 starts you hope to get out of starting pitcher over the course of the full season and he will clearly outperform Dempster in Boston.

    Lots of other choices out there before grossly overpaying for another older free agent unless it is a one year deal.

    [/QUOTE]

    Great! Let's destroy another fine reliever by making him start. (See Bard)

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from RickEO. Show RickEO's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    Thats fine if he is our 5th pitcher for 1 yr and 10 mil and ... we sign Hamilton.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

     

    Instead of getting a younger and better McCarthy (who went to Arizona for only 2 years, $15 million), the Red Sox are going after a 35-year-old who got beaten up this season pitching in the AL?!?  

     

     

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to RickEO's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Thats fine if he is our 5th pitcher for 1 yr and 10 mil and ... we sign Hamilton.

    [/QUOTE]

    It's not a 'serious discussion" if one side laughs at you and walks away from the table, but then again word definition was never softy's strong suit.

    (His strong suit is a clown's uniform.)

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to hill55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to redsoxpride34's comment:

    dempester would be a terrible signing, without question, did the sox fo not see how hard he got hit while he was on texas? he is a NL pitcher, he does not belong in the AL. This is a joke, anibal sanchez is still on the board and yet we are trying to sign a 35 yr old NL pitcher who got destroyed in the AL last year.

     

     

    Ryan Dempster went 7-3 with a 5.09 ERA and WAR of 1.2 in 12 starts for the Texas Rangers.

    Last season Jon Lester posted a WAR of 3.3 in 33 starts, Felix Doubront a WAR of 2.1 in 29 starts, Clay Buchholz a WAR of 1.9 in 29 starts and Josh Beckett a WAR of 1.8 in 21 starts for the Red Sox.

    [/QUOTE]


    Exactly. We have enough Dumpster clones already on the staff. The ONLY circumstances we should be signing him is if he comes very very cheap, as depth. We do not need Dumpster; we need an ace. Or excellent prospects. And I do not see that happening this year.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to charliedarling's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Give Aceves the 30 starts you hope to get out of starting pitcher over the course of the full season and he will clearly outperform Dempster in Boston.

    Lots of other choices out there before grossly overpaying for another older free agent unless it is a one year deal.

    [/QUOTE]

    Great! Let's destroy another fine reliever by making him start. (See Bard)

    [/QUOTE]

    2 points.

    Aceves has started in the ML in 2008, 2009 and 2011.  Bard had not started since 2007 in class A ball. Bard had an ERA of over 7 runs a game in that one year he started as a pro.

    Aceves had an ERA of 5.36 last year.  I am not sure how much more he could be "destroyed" by starting.

    I don't get this comparison at all.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter55. Show parhunter55's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    Got to believe this is just Rosenthal digging up old info from his files to generate a story on a slow news day.  And god, I hope I am right about that.  The reported deal was made awhile ago.

    Agree with snake, space, and moon.   There are at least 4 guys already on the roster who would do better than Dempster.  Is there anyone in the Sox FO who seriously thinks Aceves could not do better than Dempster has done when pitching in the AL?

    But moon, the Sox would not be "destroying another fine releiver" by making Aceves a starter, IMO.  First, Aceves has never been as good as Bard was for a year and a half.  Second, Aceves was absolutley horrible as the closer.  If last year had been Aceves's first in a Sox uni, everyone would be calling for the Sox to dump his azz.  He was putrid for a good part of the season, with a donut hole during the middle of the season where he was effective.  The Sox lose nothing by making him #5 since Morales can fill the shoes Aceves left unfilled last season, that of a long reliever, spot starter.

    I'd rather the Sox sign Chien-Ming Wang, Derek Lowe and Dan Haren and hope one of the three can contribute to the rotation than go anywhere near Dempster.  In fact, Lowe would make a perfect spot starter/long relief candidate on a one-year, non-guaranteed deal, IMO.

    Please, god, convince Ben and Mark S. to deal Salty for Masterson before he Ben gets stupid and offers Dempster another dime.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to charliedarling's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Give Aceves the 30 starts you hope to get out of starting pitcher over the course of the full season and he will clearly outperform Dempster in Boston.

    Lots of other choices out there before grossly overpaying for another older free agent unless it is a one year deal.

    [/QUOTE]

    Great! Let's destroy another fine reliever by making him start. (See Bard)

    [/QUOTE]

    2 points.

    Aceves has started in the ML in 2008, 2009 and 2011.  Bard had not started since 2007 in class A ball. Bard had an ERA of over 7 runs a game in that one year he started as a pro.

    Aceves had an ERA of 5.36 last year.  I am not sure how much more he could be "destroyed" by starting.

    I don't get this comparison at all.

    [/QUOTE]

    I wonder how the Bard experiment would have gone if Farrell or Nieves was working with him instead of a guy like Bob McClure, who tried to make him a different pitcher.  

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to mrmojo1120's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ken RosenthalVerified@Ken_Rosenthal

    Source: #RedSox, Dempster in serious discussions. No deal yet; still possible he could sign elsewhere.

    [/QUOTE]

    If they sign him i think it's a panic move and just have to hope !!! Hope it's not another Cook move. Is this going  to be the best they can do ? Dempster diving !!!!

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from AL34. Show AL34's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    It would be a disatrous signing, he struggled in the American League. He is a National League pitcher pitching in a league with a weak 7 ,8 , and 9  hitter. Come on Ben stop wasting money on clowns like Gomes, Victorino, and a suspect Napoli, and get Sanchez. Spend some money on a bonafide pitcher who is tested, not a 35 year old pitcher. I said a year ago that Cherrington did not know what he was doing, his moves this off season so far show it.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Iceman4. Show Iceman4's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    I would rather bring back Penny and Smoltz...lol

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    In response to Iceman4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I would rather bring back Penny and Smoltz...lol

    [/QUOTE]


    Paul Byrd, anyone?

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    I am not advocating the Red Sox sign Dempster to a 3-39 deal. However, the only two reasons I would be against such a deal is his age and the spookiness of 3, 3-39's. Having experienced 12-12-12-12-12 today and the Mayan thing coming up in about 10 days, just don't like the numbers.

     

    However, the negativity about Dempster is a bit over the top. So some positives to offset....

    Dempster was not bad this year in the American League. He was 9-4, with an ERA of 4.30. That would have made him arguably the Red Sox best starter. Putting him just behind Morales and clearly ahead of the other 8 starters.

    In the last 4 seasons, he has an ERA against the American League of 4.02. The last 5 seasons, its 4.20. And against the American League East over the last 5 years, his ERA is 3.06.

     

    Whats more is that he has been a fairly unlucky pitcher when it comes to his ERA over the last 4 seasons. So his numbers should have probably been better. For example, after joining the Rangers his xFIP was just 3.86.

     

    His xFIP the last 5 seasons is just 3.73. That would rank him 44th out of 250 starters with atleast 160 inning pitched. And 31st out of 155 starters with atleast 350 innings pitched. That would make him atleast a number 2 starter. Maybe a borderline number 1 starter.

     

    A few others things. He had 4 years as a closer. And over the last 5 years an ERA about .2 runs lower on the road. Both things tell me he has plenty of balls to pitch in Fenway. And Wrigley can be a tough place to pitch when the wind blows out.

    Dempster has been a winner the last 5 seasons. He is 16 games over 500 while pitching mostly for the Cubs. And for those that don't know, the Cubs stink.

     

    A solid innings eater. Has pitched over 200 innings 4 of the last 5 seasons. Very healthy arm during that time. There is something to be said for experienced consistent healthy innings eaters.

    Another good attitude. Doesn't cost us a pick, only money.

     

    He has a WAR the last 5 seasons of 18.1 which ranks 19th in all of baseball for starting pitchers. The players ranked 14th-18th? Josh Johnson, Matt Cain, James Shields, Josh Beckett, Adam Wainwright. Nice company.

     

    Or......you can think he stinks because of his 5.09 ERA with the Rangers.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Iceman4. Show Iceman4's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    no...his 4.30 ERA in AL...and the sad part that it WOULD make him a better starter than any of our other pitchers last year............

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Sox and Dempster in serious discussions

    He has a WAR the last 5 seasons of 18.1 which ranks 19th in all of baseball for starting pitchers.

    What happened five years ago in the NL is irrelevant to what kind of pitcher he is today. He is not 30 any more. The Victorino signing was dumb; signing Dumpster would be even dumber.

     

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