2013/2014

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    2013/2014

    I think the biggest thing about this team compared to '08 and '05 is that it's falling flat on its face, the hitting being horrible, and the RISP beyond atrocious, and the number of strikeouts and the lack of home runs and overall power. That's why we are all frustrated and that's why there is so little satisfaction from saying "Defending World Champions." I don't think I've ever seen a Boston team win a title and look so horrible the next year. It's maddening, it's frustrating, and it's unacceptable. To feel good about '13 WS or to look back at it is nice, and you put in the WS video or something. But I can't follow this '14 team and not feel negative, angry and discouraged. As for the blame game, I guess it goes around to everyone, but most of all the players who have no pride it appears. Either that, or all you can say is '13 was indeed a flukey, perfect storm of great.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    I think the biggest thing about this team compared to '08 and '05 is that it's falling flat on its face, the hitting being horrible, and the RISP beyond atrocious, and the number of strikeouts and the lack of home runs and overall power. That's why we are all frustrated and that's why there is so little satisfaction from saying "Defending World Champions." I don't think I've ever seen a Boston team win a title and look so horrible the next year. It's maddening, it's frustrating, and it's unacceptable. To feel good about '13 WS or to look back at it is nice, and you put in the WS video or something. But I can't follow this '14 team and not feel negative, angry and discouraged. As for the blame game, I guess it goes around to everyone, but most of all the players who have no pride it appears. Either that, or all you can say is '13 was indeed a flukey, perfect storm of great.



    I feel your pain, but as bad as it looks now the championship won after a horrible 2012 season was enough for me to take this season with a grain of salt, shrug my shoulders and look to 2015 and beyond with quite a bit of hope.

     

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sheriff-Rojas. Show Sheriff-Rojas's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    I think the biggest thing about this team compared to '08 and '05 is that it's falling flat on its face, the hitting being horrible, and the RISP beyond atrocious, and the number of strikeouts and the lack of home runs and overall power. That's why we are all frustrated and that's why there is so little satisfaction from saying "Defending World Champions." I don't think I've ever seen a Boston team win a title and look so horrible the next year. It's maddening, it's frustrating, and it's unacceptable. To feel good about '13 WS or to look back at it is nice, and you put in the WS video or something. But I can't follow this '14 team and not feel negative, angry and discouraged. As for the blame game, I guess it goes around to everyone, but most of all the players who have no pride it appears. Either that, or all you can say is '13 was indeed a flukey, perfect storm of great.



    Speak for yourself.  I get a great deal of satisfaction from saying, "World Champions."  I'd just leave the "defending" part out of it.  

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    The baseball Gods were behind us last year. This year, not so much.

    it happens, but I will NEVER be unsatisfied referring the the Sox as World champions.

    the future is bright and thats what im looking forward to.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    The way I look at is, if you don't derive any lasting satisfaction from a championship, then what's the point of all this?  Do you have to wait until the following year plays out to find out if the championship was valid or not?

    Some of the people who post here seem perpetually frustrated and angry, in spite of the Red Sox breaking their 86 year drought and winning 3 titles.  I think that's kind of sad.  If they don't have any satisfaction by now, they never will.  

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    You're missing the point, HF. I'm a long time Sox fan, around way before there were titles. My point is that usually your champion team is out there showing why they won the title the year before. They pretty much almost never win that "back-to-back" season, but you hope the team resembles a bit that performance of a year ago. Satisfication is there, but just because I enjoyed '13, doesn't mean I can't criticize or be disappointed in '14. As moon said, to go from '12 to '13 was ludicrous, well so is '13 to '14...It's mind-boggling, but you tend to have to look at '13 as a fluke. I look at '04 and '07 more a product of a stretch of years where the Sox were very good to great...'03 through '08 for sure.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    If we can just throw this season out as if it didn't exist, which seems to be what people want (Firesale!), hard to enjoy the fun '13 anymore. I wanted to go to the Sox/Angels in August, but what's the point, the team that I saw in '13 may not even be there in person, certainly not in spirit. Hollow to follow.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    Also the team is terrible at the plate. The worst Sox teams are the teams that were not playoff material over the many years of Sox baseball always had entertaining hitting lineup. This '14 one is obviously a joke.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    Either that, or all you can say is '13 was indeed a flukey, perfect storm of great.




    Or maybe you can say that 2014 is a flukey, perfect storm of bad as far as the offense is concerned. 

    It's been a frustrating year, no doubt.  I had high hopes for this team to make the playoffs again.  It doesn't look like it's going to happen,  but I still get satisfaction out of watching them play and rooting for them everyday.   Believe it or not, these are good times to be a Red Sox fan.  And yes, being the current World Champs does take some sting out of this season.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    kimmi, I don't feel that about this team. I did in '05 and '08...Not this year. It's extremely different. Yes, you can say, however, this is a perfect bad storm...no questions there. But it's not bad pitching and bad fielding (hasn't been a factor), it's bad offense where the team is excruciating with runners on base. Bad at bats after bad at bats. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    kimmi, I don't feel that about this team. I did in '05 and '08...Not this year. It's extremely different. Yes, you can say, however, this is a perfect bad storm...no questions there. But it's not bad pitching and bad fielding (hasn't been a factor), it's bad offense where the team is excruciating with runners on base. Bad at bats after bad at bats. 




    Believe me, I understand your frustration.  You would not want to be around me during the games.  LOL  Excruciating is a good way to describe this offense.   As bad as it has been, I really look forward to the next day's game.    I keep hoping and waiting for that spark that is going to ignite this team's offense.  I know it's in there somewhere.

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    Here is some splits with RISP and 2 outs RISP from 13 to 14. I consider this stat huge, to winning games. I rate 2 out RISP .250-.270 a C, .280-.290 B, .300 a A
     


     


                 RISP               2 out RISP
    Ells 13    .315                 .207
    Holt 14+   .361                .400
    Nava 13  .306                 .250 


     


    Nava 14  .267               .100


     


    Pedey 13  .312            .268    


     


              14   .230          .111


     


    Papi   13   .315           .250


     


             14    .278           .355


     


    Naps  13   .257          .222


     


             14    .188         .172


     


    Salty  13    .252     .283


     


    AJ      14    .243        .243
    Victorino  13    .315      .317
    Bradley   14    .283      .276


     


    From what I see Pedey is killing us at Number 3. Victorino was huge last year at number 2, espescially if Ells stole a base. Sorry for all the white, don't understand this site.


    Salty hit .312 the last 2 months of season with 2 outs RISP.


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


                           


     


     


     


                                      


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    kimmi, I don't feel that about this team. I did in '05 and '08...Not this year. It's extremely different. Yes, you can say, however, this is a perfect bad storm...no questions there. But it's not bad pitching and bad fielding (hasn't been a factor), it's bad offense where the team is excruciating with runners on base. Bad at bats after bad at bats. 




    Hitting with runners on base is not something you can plan for, trade for, or sign as a free agent. No player is a sure fire "clutch hitter". Players go through cycles and streaks- good and bad. There's really not much a GM or manager can do about it, except to try and put the best possible team (on paper) on the field and hope the odds work in our favor more often than not.

    I am very frustrated with this team. I'm not happy. I did expect more from this team than I expected for the 2013 team. That saddens me greatly. I do want us to win every year, or at least make a strong push each year. I want us to make the playoffs every year, but realize that even spending top dollar and having a better than average farm system does not guarantee making the playoffs every year- let alone win a championship 3 times every decade. There are 29 other teams trying to do the same thing. There are 10-15 other teams spending big, drafting well and building strong teams year to year.

    I'd be really frustrated and angry if we were doing this poorly and had a bad farm and/or long term deadwood contracts on the books. In other words, I felt worse in 2012 (before the Dodger trade) than I do now.

    I'm still going to continue to watch every play of every game as I have for years and years. I am going to root for us to win. I'm never going to root for us to do so poorly that we get the number 1 draft pick. I feel sad when we lose... every time. I do not feel good about writing off this season so early. No way did I expect to be advocating us being sellers this deadline, but the reality is that I see an opportunity this year, and it kind of excites me.

    1) We have a few pieces that we can trade for promising prospects. Those prospects can help us in the future or be packaged for some helpful pieces for 2015 and beyond. I'm sure Peavy and Gomes (with some cash) can get us a couple mid level prospects with promise. I'm sure Badenhop and Miller can bring us even more. I want Lester and Uehara back next year, but understand that if their contract demands are too high, we must trade them as well for excellent prospects.

    2) Trading Peavy, Gomes, Badenhop and Miller would open up 4 slots for some youngsters on the farm to get a chance to shine on the big stage. That would be fun for me to watch as well. Trading Lester and Uehara would hurt a lot, but I would choose to believe they will be replaced this winter with decent free agents of trade pieces. The prospects we get for them would also help. The prospects we bring up to replace them would be fun to watch as well. Assuming we trade all 6 plus Pierzynski, out 25 man roster might look like this...

    SP(6): Lackey, Buchholz, de la Rosa, Workman & Webster/Ranaudo

    RP(6): Tazawa, Breslow, Doubront, Mujica, 2 from: Britton/ Layne/Wilson

    C(2): Vazquez, Ross (maybe Butler or Sept: Swihart)

    1B(1): Napoli (eventually Carp/ Sept: T Shaw)

    2B(1): Pedroia (Sept: Coyle)

    3B(2): Bogaerts, eventually Middlebrooks (LF?)

    SS(2): Drew, Herrera (Sept: Marrero)

    LF(1): Nava, eventually Cecchini/Middlebrooks

    CF(2): Betts, JBJ

    RF(2): Holt, Victorino

    DH(1): Ortiz

    There's a lot of interesting stories here. It's not a team that is going to lead to a miracle comeback this year, but nevertheless can and should be exciting to watch over the next 2-3 months.

    We have a lot of salary coming off the books this winter. There will be a lot of action going on, and my guess is there will even be a blockbuster trade this winter along with some big FA signings. I look forward to the changes about to be made. I'm not certain I'll agree with every deal or even most of the deals, but I was against most of the winter deals before 2013, so let's give Ben a chance to put his big stamp on this team.

    I'm optimistic about 2015 and beyond, so that tempers my disappointment with 2014... a lot!

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    kimmi, I don't feel that about this team. I did in '05 and '08...Not this year. It's extremely different. Yes, you can say, however, this is a perfect bad storm...no questions there. But it's not bad pitching and bad fielding (hasn't been a factor), it's bad offense where the team is excruciating with runners on base. Bad at bats after bad at bats. 


    To me, that's why this year is more flukey. Except for Nava, no one had a career year at the plate last year. Everyone basically was around their career norms. Salty I guess you could say had a career year, but it was more of an incremental improvement -- not running out of gas late in the season.

    This year, more players are below their career norms -- especially Napoli and Pedroia hitting w/RISP. They are ridiculously below their career norms. If both were at their career norms, IMO, the Sox would be at least .500 maybe even a few games above because perhaps it would have taken the pressure off the young players.

    For all the complaints about what the Sox did or didn't do in the offseason, to me, it all starts with how poorly Pedroia and Napoli have hit in the clutch.

    And in your comment in you OP about pride -- really? Just because a player is struggling, you're really going to say they have no pride. Pedroia has no pride? Bogaerts and Bradley -- two rookies trying to make their name in the game -- have no pride? Bradley, who runs into walls playing defense, has no pride? That's ridiculous.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from billge. Show billge's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    So many trade worthy, so little demand- so far.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    I think the biggest thing about this team compared to '08 and '05 is that it's falling flat on its face, the hitting being horrible, and the RISP beyond atrocious, and the number of strikeouts and the lack of home runs and overall power. That's why we are all frustrated and that's why there is so little satisfaction from saying "Defending World Champions." I don't think I've ever seen a Boston team win a title and look so horrible the next year. It's maddening, it's frustrating, and it's unacceptable. To feel good about '13 WS or to look back at it is nice, and you put in the WS video or something. But I can't follow this '14 team and not feel negative, angry and discouraged. As for the blame game, I guess it goes around to everyone, but most of all the players who have no pride it appears. Either that, or all you can say is '13 was indeed a flukey, perfect storm of great.



    I feel your pain, but as bad as it looks now the championship won after a horrible 2012 season was enough for me to take this season with a grain of salt, shrug my shoulders and look to 2015 and beyond with quite a bit of hope.

     

     



    Exactly my view, except I have been a Sox fan longer--since 1949--and am more inclined toward pessimism. But I definitely agree with not getting to excited about 2014 because 2013 is still a great memory.

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to royf19's comment:

    To me, that's why this year is more flukey. Except for Nava, no one had a career year at the plate last year. Everyone basically was around their career norms. Salty I guess you could say had a career year, but it was more of an incremental improvement -- not running out of gas late in the season.

    This year, more players are below their career norms -- especially Napoli and Pedroia hitting w/RISP. They are ridiculously below their career norms. If both were at their career norms, IMO, the Sox would be at least .500 maybe even a few games above because perhaps it would have taken the pressure off the young players.

    For all the complaints about what the Sox did or didn't do in the offseason, to me, it all starts with how poorly Pedroia and Napoli have hit in the clutch.

    And in your comment in you OP about pride -- really? Just because a player is struggling, you're really going to say they have no pride. Pedroia has no pride? Bogaerts and Bradley -- two rookies trying to make their name in the game -- have no pride? Bradley, who runs into walls playing defense, has no pride? That's ridiculous.




    Excellent post Roy.

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    You're missing the point, HF. I'm a long time Sox fan, around way before there were titles. My point is that usually your champion team is out there showing why they won the title the year before. They pretty much almost never win that "back-to-back" season, but you hope the team resembles a bit that performance of a year ago. Satisfication is there, but just because I enjoyed '13, doesn't mean I can't criticize or be disappointed in '14. As moon said, to go from '12 to '13 was ludicrous, well so is '13 to '14...It's mind-boggling, but you tend to have to look at '13 as a fluke. I look at '04 and '07 more a product of a stretch of years where the Sox were very good to great...'03 through '08 for sure.



    While going from 2012 to 2013 was unexpected, it is interesting that fans lump the three years together and labeling 2013 as a fluke.  And while I see why that is done, it is interesting that the 2014 team more closely resembles the 2013 team than 2012 does.  The 2012 team was the clear outlier, before we had Napoli, Victorino, Uehara, Gomes and a few others.  The cleanup hitter for a huge chunk of 2012 was journeyman Cody Ross, which should speak volumes.  And really, the 2013 team only had 2 players that had clear and obvious career years – Buchholz and Nava.  Arguments could be made for Uehara, although he was really just in a more prominent role, and Saltalamacchia, although he was better in some way in 2013, and worse in some.   He was the team HR leader in 2012, which also says a lot about that team. 

    The 2014 team relied too much on platoon guys because they worked the year before, and on rookies, who are gambles.  The struggles of the rookies this year are not necessarily indications of the future.  Lots and lots of rookies struggle.  The struggles of guys like Nava and Gomes are more a case of the world straightening itself out. 

    But regardless of how frustrating 2014 it, it doesn’t mean 2013 means any less despite what anyone who labels it as a “fluke” is actually doing.  This team could easily be back in contention in 2015, and could be with some prudent moves at the deadline.  After all, there is not as much difference as fans think between best and worst in MLB…

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    Napoli's 92 RBI was a career high for him in '13. He is more in tune with the 70s and his HR total will likely be in the 20s again. But many people think Napoli is also not hitting, but I think he isn't far from what his norms are. He also struck out a career high last year (187). 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    I disagree on the fluke angle, although notin thinks this year is the fluke. The barometer of difference in wins and losses from one year to another is scary. I think it will take a lot more than a couple of adds and subtractions to bring this team to the winner's circle again. 54-34 v. 39-49...that's a 15-game nosedive...The '12 team was 44-44 and didn't start truly nose-diving until injuries, the trade, and a white flag was thrown up the last 2 months. Cody Ross had 22 HR, 81 RBI. That team had far more power with 6 different players with 15 or more HR. The '13 team had 8 different players hit 12 or more HR, including 25 combined from Nava/Drew.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    Napoli's 92 RBI was a career high for him in '13. He is more in tune with the 70s and his HR total will likely be in the 20s again. But many people think Napoli is also not hitting, but I think he isn't far from what his norms are. He also struck out a career high last year (187). 



    You have to look at all the numbers. His 92 RBIs were a career high, but not his RBIs per PA. Last year, he had a career-high 578 PA, which is a major reason why his RBI totals were up.  Last year, he had 1 RBI every 6.28 PAs. This year, he has 1 RBI every 8.97. In 2011 when he had 75 RBIs, his next-highest total, he had 1 RBI every 5.76 PAs, which is better than last year's mark. 

    His hitting over all is close to his norms, but not his hitting w/RISP, which is below .200, which is why his RBI totals are down.

    The career high in Ks is also due in large part because of the career-high in PAs. He struck out once every 3.09 PAs last year. In 2013, it was once every 3.33. This year, it's once every 3.7, which shows his improved two-strike approach.

     

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    Napoli's 92 RBI was a career high for him in '13. He is more in tune with the 70s and his HR total will likely be in the 20s again. But many people think Napoli is also not hitting, but I think he isn't far from what his norms are. He also struck out a career high last year (187). 



    You have to look at all the numbers. His 92 RBIs were a career high, but not his RBIs per PA. Last year, he had a career-high 578 PA, which is a major reason why his RBI totals were up.  Last year, he had 1 RBI every 6.28 PAs. This year, he has 1 RBI every 8.97. In 2011 when he had 75 RBIs, his next-highest total, he had 1 RBI every 5.76 PAs, which is better than last year's mark. 

    His hitting over all is close to his norms, but not his hitting w/RISP, which is below .200, which is why his RBI totals are down.

    The career high in Ks is also due in large part because of the career-high in PAs. He struck out once every 3.09 PAs last year. In 2013, it was once every 3.33. This year, it's once every 3.7, which shows his improved two-strike approach.

     

     He's had less chances with men in scoring position as well.

     

    2014: 84 PAs (out of 296) RISP and 23 RBI

    2013: 199 PAs (out of 578) RISP and 73 RBI

    If you double Napoli's 2014 PAs to 592, it is nearly the same as his 2014 total of 578, but double his PAs with RISP and you have 168 vs 199. Big difference.

    Still the 46 RBI vs 73 is more a result of lower BA w RISP than less chances.

     

    2014: 142 PAs men on base and 25 RBI

    2013: 299 PAs men on base and 81 RBI

    Double 142 and the 284 number is pretty close to 2013's 299 number, but 50 RBIs is way behind 81.

     

     

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BogieAt12oclock. Show BogieAt12oclock's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    I think the biggest thing about this team compared to '08 and '05 is that it's falling flat on its face, the hitting being horrible, and the RISP beyond atrocious, and the number of strikeouts and the lack of home runs and overall power. That's why we are all frustrated and that's why there is so little satisfaction from saying "Defending World Champions." I don't think I've ever seen a Boston team win a title and look so horrible the next year. It's maddening, it's frustrating, and it's unacceptable. To feel good about '13 WS or to look back at it is nice, and you put in the WS video or something. But I can't follow this '14 team and not feel negative, angry and discouraged. As for the blame game, I guess it goes around to everyone, but most of all the players who have no pride it appears. Either that, or all you can say is '13 was indeed a flukey, perfect storm of great.



    No question that 2013 was a major luck-fest. This year the luck disappeared. 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    It takes an incredible amount of luck to win 97 games and go 11-5 in the postseason. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from BogieAt12oclock. Show BogieAt12oclock's posts

    Re: 2013/2014

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    It takes an incredible amount of luck to win 97 games and go 11-5 in the postseason. 



    I agree.

     
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