39 million to 5 million?????

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to LR3683paw's comment:

    The offer was never discounted because it was not officially an offer until after the physical. Why is that difficult for some posters to comprehend?

    It is like asking to drive a used car around the block before a real offer is made. Not really rocket science. It shouldn't be that difficult to understand unless you are playing a game here or toying with the forum posters.




    Pike?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    This is almost like a deal you would give a former mega-all*star coming off a horrendous year, and a year removed from some major repair job on the body. Napoli is no mega star.... RED FLAG RED FLAG

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to georom4's comment:

    In response to notin's comment:

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...

     



    I don't think he is quite as injury-prone as you indicate. He sat a lot in Anaheim because Scioscia did not like his defense as a catcher. 

     

     

    This is a non-factor now...

     




    Im Ok with this revised deal but Notin, im not exactly sure why some are saying its a great deal...the guy is obviously in rough shape....im pretty sure he didnt give himself 90% pay cut because he just loved the thought of playing for the sox...Mike Lowell redux?

     



    No one knows why he took the deal, beyond some obvious reasons, like no one made a better one, or at least one he liked better. 

     

    Think of it this way. You're Mike Napoli. You need a season to re-establish your market value.  What ballpark would work best for you toward this goal?

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    Call me crazy, but this is a very good, risk / reward deal.  One year w a base of $5 Million, plus incentives?  Sounds like a great risk / reward deal to me.  Low risk, short contract, with big up sides if he can stay healthy?  I love it!  Very smart move by BC!  As GM, I make this deal, assuming he has a decent shot at good health. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from baddad. Show baddad's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    seems fair to sox and napoli,,,,,,,,real possibity for a win win deal for all involved

     
  6. This post has been removed.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    Why not a league minimum plus incentives? 

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to georom4's comment:

    What is the over under on games played by napoli in 2013

     

    84....say I

     

    what say you




     

    He might play 77

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    108......  it is his career norm

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to notin's comment:

    Think of it this way. You're Mike Napoli. You need a season to re-establish your market value.  What ballpark would work best for you toward this goal?




    Excellent point, notin.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    Space, he's got to be seriously damaged goods - its like buying a car with a flooded title...who knows? at least its cheap./..also another silver lining, Gomez has to be given lots of playing time...

     

    potentially damaged goods doesn't go from 39/3 to 5/1.  he must be really damaged.


    Not necessarily damaged goods: I do not think you sign a player who can't play. I would say POTENTIALLY damaged goods. Its a good risk IMO, especially in a year that is a rebuilding year.

     




     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...

     



    I don't think he is quite as injury-prone as you indicate. He sat a lot in Anaheim because Scioscia did not like his defense as a catcher. 

     

     it's 39 to 5 period, not 13 to 5. If his hip deteriorates to the point where he cant play in 14 or 15, he wont make anything those years, and the guarantee reduced by 90%.

    This is a non-factor now...


    Im Ok with this revised deal but Notin, im not exactly sure why some are saying its a great deal...the guy is obviously in rough shape....im pretty sure he didnt give himself 90% pay cut because he just loved the thought of playing for the sox...Mike Lowell redux?




    C'mon Geo, you know that's BS.  Right now it appears to be an AAV paycut of $13m to $5m, and that's before incentives.  You don't help your case by manipulating numbers, you hinder it.

    [/QUOTE]


     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to georom4's comment:

    What is the over under on games played by napoli in 2013

     

    84....say I

     

    what say you

      The "BIG O" did say that the rich must pay !!!!

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to royf19's comment:

    My Napoli prediction:

    135 games 25 HR, 85 RBI, .265 BA.

    Spring training is less than a month away from pitchers and catchers reporting. Spring is a time to be optimistic and positive, so I refuse to join the Doom and Gloomers Club where too many fans like to live.



    If he does this, he will probably have an OPS > .860.  Which will be either the highest or second highest on the team (depending mainly on Ortiz).  He draws a ton of walks, so a .265 BA will come with a .350 OBP at least.  25 HR / 135 GP is an impressive ding rate.  This would be a very good slash line, and if he achieves it...

    ...He should absolutlye get a 2 yr / 24 M contract nest offseason (assuming the hip isnt hanging on by a thread at that point).  If it is, 1 yr @ 8 with incentives that can push the number up to 15M.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to georom4's comment:

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

     

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...

     



    I don't think he is quite as injury-prone as you indicate. He sat a lot in Anaheim because Scioscia did not like his defense as a catcher. 

     

     

    This is a non-factor now...


    Im Ok with this revised deal but Notin, im not exactly sure why some are saying its a great deal...the guy is obviously in rough shape....im pretty sure he didnt give himself 90% pay cut because he just loved the thought of playing for the sox...Mike Lowell redux?

     




    C'mon Geo, you know that's BS.  Right now it appears to be an AAV paycut of $13m to $5m, and that's before incentives.  You don't help your case by manipulating numbers, you hinder it.

     




    the agreed to contract was 3 years at 39 million....not one yr at 13 mil..i really have no idea what you are trying to point out...napoli not only agreed to drop his yearly salary, but cancel out the other two years of his agreed to contract....why?  lets get real here....

    [/QUOTE]

    Because it became common knowledge that he is a huge injury risk , which completely changed his market.

    It also didnt help Napoli that Texas had signed AJ and Berkman and Sea had withdrawn all interest.  His market was flipped upside down.  Ben knew this and held the line.  Although I would have probably preferred 2/20 , with the second yr voided if he goes on teh DL with a hip injury at any pt in the first year.

    There is a strong possibility that by July, we are wishing that we stuck with 3/39.  His career OPS is second highest on the team!  Behind only Ortiz.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to EnchiladaT's comment:

    Why not a league minimum plus incentives? 



    Because Texas offered him 1 yr @ more money than 5M (I dont know what the offer was but read that it topped teh sox offer).

    He was willing to leave some money on the table to play here; however, I doubt he would have played here for practically no guaranteed money.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

     

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...

     



    I don't think he is quite as injury-prone as you indicate. He sat a lot in Anaheim because Scioscia did not like his defense as a catcher. 

     

     

    This is a non-factor now...


    Im Ok with this revised deal but Notin, im not exactly sure why some are saying its a great deal...the guy is obviously in rough shape....im pretty sure he didnt give himself 90% pay cut because he just loved the thought of playing for the sox...Mike Lowell redux?

     




    C'mon Geo, you know that's BS.  Right now it appears to be an AAV paycut of $13m to $5m, and that's before incentives.  You don't help your case by manipulating numbers, you hinder it.

     

     




    the agreed to contract was 3 years at 39 million....not one yr at 13 mil..i really have no idea what you are trying to point out...napoli not only agreed to drop his yearly salary, but cancel out the other two years of his agreed to contract....why?  lets get real here....

     



    Because it became common knowledge that he is a huge injury risk , which completely changed his market.

    It also didnt help Napoli that Texas had signed AJ and Berkman and Sea had withdrawn all interest.  His market was flipped upside down.  Ben knew this and held the line.  Although I would have probably preferred 2/20 , with the second yr voided if he goes on teh DL with a hip injury at any pt in the first year.

    There is a strong possibility that by July, we are wishing that we stuck with 3/39.  His career OPS is second highest on the team!  Behind only Ortiz.

    [/QUOTE]

    Under no circumstances should anyone look back and wish we took that deal. Its not worth the risk of being stuck with an albatross for two years more than we should have. Sure, his hip may not act up at all for three years, but you can't use 20-20 hindsight to judge what has been done. This is the right thing for the Red Sox at this time. Even if Napoli puts up great numbers this year, when the franchise is competitive again in 2015 or so he will easily be replaced. Finally, the problems with the team are not about hitting. Until the pitching is fixed we are going nowhere.

     

     
  18. This post has been removed.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    In response to EnchiladaT's comment:

     

    Why not a league minimum plus incentives? 

     



    Because Texas offered him 1 yr @ more money than 5M (I dont know what the offer was but read that it topped teh sox offer).

     

    He was willing to leave some money on the table to play here; however, I doubt he would have played here for practically no guaranteed money.



    He wouldn't have had a full time position in Texas with A.J., Moreland, etc. Here, he's the 1B.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    He's got to be pissed at this. The physical really cost him a lot of money but brilliant stratery by the front office IMO

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

     

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...

     



    I don't think he is quite as injury-prone as you indicate. He sat a lot in Anaheim because Scioscia did not like his defense as a catcher. 

     

     

    This is a non-factor now...


    Im Ok with this revised deal but Notin, im not exactly sure why some are saying its a great deal...the guy is obviously in rough shape....im pretty sure he didnt give himself 90% pay cut because he just loved the thought of playing for the sox...Mike Lowell redux?

     




    C'mon Geo, you know that's BS.  Right now it appears to be an AAV paycut of $13m to $5m, and that's before incentives.  You don't help your case by manipulating numbers, you hinder it.

     

     




    the agreed to contract was 3 years at 39 million....not one yr at 13 mil..i really have no idea what you are trying to point out...napoli not only agreed to drop his yearly salary, but cancel out the other two years of his agreed to contract....why?  lets get real here....

     

     



    Because it became common knowledge that he is a huge injury risk , which completely changed his market.

     

    It also didnt help Napoli that Texas had signed AJ and Berkman and Sea had withdrawn all interest.  His market was flipped upside down.  Ben knew this and held the line.  Although I would have probably preferred 2/20 , with the second yr voided if he goes on teh DL with a hip injury at any pt in the first year.

    There is a strong possibility that by July, we are wishing that we stuck with 3/39.  His career OPS is second highest on the team!  Behind only Ortiz.



    Under no circumstances should anyone look back and wish we took that deal. Its not worth the risk of being stuck with an albatross for two years more than we should have. Sure, his hip may not act up at all for three years, but you can't use 20-20 hindsight to judge what has been done. This is the right thing for the Red Sox at this time. Even if Napoli puts up great numbers this year, when the franchise is competitive again in 2015 or so he will easily be replaced. Finally, the problems with the team are not about hitting. Until the pitching is fixed we are going nowhere.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Completely agree that this is the right deal for right now.  And that its not fair to use hindsight to critique the deal at a later date.  However, after the Beltre year, didnt you wish that we had him for a second yr at the same price?  How about Ross?

    Im a big fan of Napoli's attitude and bat.  I was just pointing out the possibility that he plays 130 games and mashes.  Leaving us wishing that we had him locked up for another yr.  Of course, this doesnt mean that we should criticize Ben as 1@5 is a much better deal right now.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

     

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

     

     

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...

     



    I don't think he is quite as injury-prone as you indicate. He sat a lot in Anaheim because Scioscia did not like his defense as a catcher. 

     

     

    This is a non-factor now...


    Im Ok with this revised deal but Notin, im not exactly sure why some are saying its a great deal...the guy is obviously in rough shape....im pretty sure he didnt give himself 90% pay cut because he just loved the thought of playing for the sox...Mike Lowell redux?

     




    C'mon Geo, you know that's BS.  Right now it appears to be an AAV paycut of $13m to $5m, and that's before incentives.  You don't help your case by manipulating numbers, you hinder it.

     

     




    the agreed to contract was 3 years at 39 million....not one yr at 13 mil..i really have no idea what you are trying to point out...napoli not only agreed to drop his yearly salary, but cancel out the other two years of his agreed to contract....why?  lets get real here....

     

     



    Because it became common knowledge that he is a huge injury risk , which completely changed his market.

     

    It also didnt help Napoli that Texas had signed AJ and Berkman and Sea had withdrawn all interest.  His market was flipped upside down.  Ben knew this and held the line.  Although I would have probably preferred 2/20 , with the second yr voided if he goes on teh DL with a hip injury at any pt in the first year.

    There is a strong possibility that by July, we are wishing that we stuck with 3/39.  His career OPS is second highest on the team!  Behind only Ortiz.

     



    Under no circumstances should anyone look back and wish we took that deal. Its not worth the risk of being stuck with an albatross for two years more than we should have. Sure, his hip may not act up at all for three years, but you can't use 20-20 hindsight to judge what has been done. This is the right thing for the Red Sox at this time. Even if Napoli puts up great numbers this year, when the franchise is competitive again in 2015 or so he will easily be replaced. Finally, the problems with the team are not about hitting. Until the pitching is fixed we are going nowhere.

     

     



    Completely agree that this is the right deal for right now.  And that its not fair to use hindsight to critique the deal at a later date.  However, after the Beltre year, didnt you wish that we had him for a second yr at the same price?  How about Ross?

    Im a big fan of Napoli's attitude and bat.  I was just pointing out the possibility that he plays 130 games and mashes.  Leaving us wishing that we had him locked up for another yr.  Of course, this doesnt mean that we should criticize Ben as 1@5 is a much better deal right now.

    [/QUOTE]


    I understand what you are saying. It would have been nice to have Beltre for more than one year after seeing his production the year he was here and after he left. But I have no regrets about his deal then or the Napoli deal now. You gotta do the right thing and not look back. Napoli was given his deal, $13M x 3 with the assumption that his hip was fine and that he would produce. In a year I doubt he will be worth much more than that. If it all works out he will be a year older with the same hip issues and if he is producing and if he likes it here, we should be able to get him to stay for about the same money he was originally offered.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sheriff-Rojas. Show Sheriff-Rojas's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:

    One has to wonder why Napoli is such damaged goods that he ends up with a one year low single digit guarantee. If he isn't fit to play a full season of at least 130 games at a position, this amounts to a golden parachute for a player who did all his damage years ago against the Red Sox.

    I will withhold judgment and assume the medical staff is competent, which is a true leap of faith. If he is fit for a season, it's a solid deal. If not, more incompetence from management.



    Hedging your bets, eh Softy?  A little preemptive hindsight?

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    Space, he's got to be seriously damaged goods - its like buying a car with a flooded title...who knows? at least its cheap./..also another silver lining, Gomez has to be given lots of playing time...

     




    Not necessarily damaged goods: I do not think you sign a player who can't play. I would say POTENTIALLY damaged goods. Its a good risk IMO, especially in a year that is a rebuilding year.

     



    I agree.  If there is nothing left of his hip, they would just walk away and not give a $5M retirement present and a roster spot.  It probably wouldn't even be in Napoli's best interest to take aone-year deal if he was injured.  If he plays 60 games and needs surgery, he'd get no contract in 2014.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: 39 million to 5 million?????

    In response to georom4's comment:

    i think you get what you pay for..just sayin...

    but you have to love the discounted price.....but im not sure what this says about ben's acumen as GM....why was he giving a guy who was oft injured 39 mil? turns out he was worth 5 mil...thats not too impressive imo...



    That's the way it works.  You come to an agreement pending physicals.  Other agreements have been abrogated.

     
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