6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to hill55's comment:

    on list released Tuesday by columnist Jonathan Mayo at MLB.com:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2013/index.jsp

    Boston and four other teams had six prospects each on the Top 100 list, although Seattle tallied the most "Prospect Points" under Mayo's scoring system:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20130129&content_id=41230208&c_id=bos

    Scroll down.



    I like the prospect point listing.  I never had a way to compare having, say 5 top-100 prospect, but mostly in the 75-100 range, and only having 3 top-100, but all in the top-25, or having a bunch of 19 y.o.s in the single-A level.  I figure anyone at a C-level or above should have a rating from 1-20 for C through A+ and you just need to add up the points.  I tried to do that myself, but I had no intuitive feel for how the assess these guys.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    on list released Tuesday by columnist Jonathan Mayo at MLB.com:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2013/index.jsp

    Boston and four other teams had six prospects each on the Top 100 list, although Seattle tallied the most "Prospect Points" under Mayo's scoring system:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20130129&content_id=41230208&c_id=bos

    Scroll down.

     



    I like the prospect point listing.  I never had a way to compare having, say 5 top-100 prospect, but mostly in the 75-100 range, and only having 3 top-100, but all in the top-25, or having a bunch of 19 y.o.s in the single-A level.  I figure anyone at a C-level or above should have a rating from 1-20 for C through A+ and you just need to add up the points.  I tried to do that myself, but I had no intuitive feel for how the assess these guys.

     



    Another point would be how to rate players in the 100-200 range. My guess is we have a bunch of A Ball players in this range that can rise to the top 100 after this season.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

     

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    on list released Tuesday by columnist Jonathan Mayo at MLB.com:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2013/index.jsp

    Boston and four other teams had six prospects each on the Top 100 list, although Seattle tallied the most "Prospect Points" under Mayo's scoring system:

    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20130129&content_id=41230208&c_id=bos

    Scroll down.

     



    I like the prospect point listing.  I never had a way to compare having, say 5 top-100 prospect, but mostly in the 75-100 range, and only having 3 top-100, but all in the top-25, or having a bunch of 19 y.o.s in the single-A level.  I figure anyone at a C-level or above should have a rating from 1-20 for C through A+ and you just need to add up the points.  I tried to do that myself, but I had no intuitive feel for how the assess these guys.

     

     



    Another point would be how to rate players in the 100-200 range. My guess is we have a bunch of A Ball players in this range that can rise to the top 100 after this season.

     

     




     

     

    This is my point ranking system....

    1///170
    2///152
    3///138
    4///128
    5///121
    6///115
    7///109
    8///104
    9///99
    10///95
    11///91
    12///88
    13///85
    14///82
    15///80
    16///78
    17///76
    18///74
    19///72
    20///70
    21///69
    22///68
    23///67
    24///66
    25///65
    26///64
    27///63
    28///62
    29///61
    30///60
    31-32///59
    33-34///58
    35-36///57
    37-38///56
    39-40///55
    41-42///54
    43-44///53
    45-46///52
    47-48///51
    49-50///50
    51-52///49
    53-54///48
    55-56///47
    57-58///46
    59-60///45
    61-62///44
    63-65///43
    66-68///42
    69-71///41
    72-74///40
    75-77///39
    78-80///38
    81-83///37
    84-86///36
    87-89///35
    90-93///34
    94-97///33
    98-102///32
    103-107///31
    108-113///30
    114-119///29
    120-126///28
    127-134///27
    135-143///26
    144-153///25
    154-164///24
    165-177///23
    178-192///22
    193-209///21
    210-228///20
    229-250///19
    251-275///18
    276-305///17
    306-340///16
    341-380///15
    381-425///14
    426-470///13
    471-520///12
    521-575///11
    576-635///10
    636-700///9
    701-770///8
    771-850///7
    851-950///6
    951-1070///5
    1071-1200///4
    1201-1350///3.5
    1351-1500///3
    1501-1700///2.5
    1701-1900///2
    1901-2200///1.5
    2201-2500///1
    2501-3000///.5
    3001-++++///.25

     

    It is basically similar to......

    A 12

    B+ 7.5

    B 5

    B- 3

    C+ 2

    C 1

     

    We have a ton of players I would rate in the 200-350 range. Probably a dozen or so C+ types.

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    Maybe your differentials at the top are a bit too much.

    I might go like this:

    1- 100

    2- 98

    3- 96

    4- 94...

    11-12/ 80

    13-14/78

    15-16/76

    17-18/74

    19-20/72

    21-23/70

    24-27/68

    28-30/66

    31-34/64

    35-38/62

    39-42/60

    43-46/58

    47-50/56

    51-55/54

    56-60/52

    61-65/50

    66-70/48

    71-75/46

    76-80/44

    81-85/42

    86-90/40

    91-95/38

    96-100/36

    101-105/34

    106-110/32

    111-115/30

    116-125/29

    126-135/28

    136-145/27

    146-155/26

    156-165/25

    166-180/24

    181-200/23

    201-220/22

    221-240/21

    241-260/20

    261-280/18

    281-300/17

    301-325/16

    326-350/15

    351-375/14

    376-400/13

    401-425/12

    426-450/11

    475-500/10

    501-550/9

    551-600/8

    601-650/7

    651-700/6

    701-750/5

    751-800/4

    801-900/3

    901-1000/2

    1001-1500/1

    1500-2000/0.5

    2000-3000/0.25

     

     

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Maybe your differentials at the top are a bit too much.

    I might go like this:

    1- 100

    2- 98

    3- 96

    4- 94...

    11-12/ 80

    13-14/78

    15-16/76

    17-18/74

    19-20/72

    21-23/70

    24-27/68

    28-30/66

    31-34/64

    35-38/62

    39-42/60

    43-46/58

    47-50/56

    51-55/54

    56-60/52

    61-65/50

    66-70/48

    71-75/46

    76-80/44

    81-85/42

    86-90/40

    91-95/38

    96-100/36

    101-105/34

    106-110/32

    111-115/30

    116-125/29

    126-135/28

    136-145/27

    146-155/26

    156-165/25

    166-180/24

    181-200/23

    201-220/22

    221-240/21

    241-260/20

    261-280/18

    281-300/17

    301-325/16

    326-350/15

    351-375/14

    376-400/13

    401-425/12

    426-450/11

    475-500/10

    501-550/9

    551-600/8

    601-650/7

    651-700/6

    701-750/5

    751-800/4

    801-900/3

    901-1000/2

    1001-1500/1

    1500-2000/0.5

    2000-3000/0.25

     

     

     




     

    One of the  purposes of the numbers is to calculate trades. Would the number 2 prospect and 950th prospect be worth the number 1 guy? Or the 11th guy[say Skaggs, Wheeler, or Tailon] and 250th[say Brandon Jacobs] get you the number 1 guy[Profar]? I doubt it. Lets just say I would not do that trade if I was the Rangers. Plus, Profar is not even that strong a number 1. Imagine that trade in the 2012 class.

     

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    Or from a Red Sox perspective, would you trade Bogaerts for Cecchini and Webster? Or Bogaerts for 4 Jacobs? Or Jacobs, DeLaCruz, Britton and Johnson? I would not.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    Or from a Red Sox perspective, would you trade Bogaerts for Cecchini and Webster? 

    No. I wouldn't trade him for Bradley and Cecchini either.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    I would have to get a stud starter prospect back to trade Bogy...

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Or from a Red Sox perspective, would you trade Bogaerts for Cecchini and Webster? 

    No. I wouldn't trade him for Bradley and Cecchini either.




     

    Exactly.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to BMav's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Or from a Red Sox perspective, would you trade Bogaerts for Cecchini and Webster? 

    No. I wouldn't trade him for Bradley and Cecchini either.

     




     

     

    Exactly.



    And, I probably like Cecchini more than many here.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    Saying two B+- prospects equals one grade A is like cutting a diamond up and saying it would be the same value if added together.

    The good news is (if you're a prospect junkie like me) a lot of scouts seem to think another blue chipper can emerge from this depth of Sox talent this year.  If that happens.....we are a top 3 farm system hands down. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    What is a B+- prospect?  Is that a B prospect?

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac35. Show pinstripezac35's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    Saying two B+- prospects equals one grade A is like cutting a diamond up and saying it would be the same value if added together.

    The good news is (if you're a prospect junkie like me) a lot of scouts seem to think another blue chipper can emerge from this depth of Sox talent this year.  If that happens.....we are a top 3 farm system hands down. 

     

     

     

    If that happens.....we are a top 3 farm system hands down.

     

    don't shoot I'm just   a troll doing my job

    the messenger

    I'm still kinda of in shock after seeing this

     

     

     

     

     

    http://riveraveblues.com/2013/02/yankees-rank-tenth-in-keith-laws-farm-system-rankings-82030/

    Yankees rank tenth in Keith Law’s farm system rankings
    By Mike Axisa

    Keith Law released his 2013 farm system rankings today (subs. req’d), which are predictably topped by the Cardinals. They have Oscar Taveras, a ton of MLB-ready power arms, and quality depth coming out of their ears. The Twins and Rays round out the top three while the Angels bring up the rear at #30. The Yankees rank tenth.

    “It’s a top-heavy system, but the group of position players who started in low Class A Charleston last year, some of whom finished in high-A Tampa, could produce as many as three above-average or better regulars plus several other guys who’ll have big league value,” wrote Law while also saying they’d rank higher had Manny Banuelos and Jose Campos not gotten hurt. Baseball America had the Yankees ranked 11th while John Sickels had them 14th, so the consensus right now is that 10-15 range. Tampa was the only AL East team ahead of New York, with the Orioles (13th), Red Sox (17th), and Blue Jays (24th) lagging behind. · (32) ·

     

     

    you guys had me nervous 4 a while ;-)

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    Is that what Keith law has us at?? If that is up to date it's the lowest I've seen Boston.  

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    It shows how hard it is to figure out.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac35. Show pinstripezac35's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    Is that what Keith law has us at?? If that is up to date it's the lowest I've seen Boston.  

     



    that was fresh yesterday

    I think the sox were rated 4th elsewhere

    perhaps others R including some ex prospects

    that have graduated  that laws doesn't

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    Is that what Keith law has us at?? If that is up to date it's the lowest I've seen Boston.  

     



    that was fresh yesterday

    I think the sox were rated 4th elsewhere

     



    Baseball America is the gold standard and carries far more weight in the industry. Law's a jounalist who can't possibly have seen enough of the players to arrive at a grade on his own. What we all know is that the Sox and Yankees have used thier resources to sign players both in the first year player draft and international free agency to above slot moneys...With the new CBA both teams will be hard pressed to maintian there current ranking if they continue to draft at the bottom of each round.

    The Yankees have used the international market to offset the loss of picks by signing free agents a practice they no longer can employ. The Sox hoarded picks by letting potential free agents play out their contracts and reaped the supplemental draft picks that came with them, also something that can no longer be employed...Time will tell how much the landscape will change given the new rules but one has to think it now rightfully favors the teams drafting at the top and with the slotting system in place, fewer of the bluechippers will drop based on signability...

    That said, not sure that where we rank on the top prospects list is something they give out a trophy for? Suffice to say that the Sox are in a good position with quality and depth at every level of the system and will add an impact player to that depth this year picking 7th. How they chose to deploy those resources will be interesting to watch...

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to Beantowne's comment:

     

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:

     

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    Is that what Keith law has us at?? If that is up to date it's the lowest I've seen Boston.  

     



    that was fresh yesterday

    I think the sox were rated 4th elsewhere

     

     



    Baseball America is the gold standard and carries far more weight in the industry. Law's a jounalist who can't possibly have seen enough of the players to arrive at a grade on his own. What we all know is that the Sox and Yankees have used thier resources to sign players both in the first year player draft and international free agency to above slot moneys...With the new CBA both teams will be hard pressed to maintian there current ranking if they continue to draft at the bottom of each round.

     

    The Yankees have used the international market to offset the loss of picks by signing free agents a practice they no longer can employ. The Sox hoarded picks by letting potential free agents play out their contracts and reaped the supplemental draft picks that came with them, also something that can no longer be employed...Time will tell how much the landscape will change given the new rules but one has to think it now rightfully favors the teams drafting at the top and with the slotting system in place, fewer of the bluechippers will drop based on signability...

    That said, not sure that where we rank on the top prospects list is something they give out a trophy for? Suffice to say that the Sox are in a good position with quality and depth at every level of the system and will add an impact player to that depth this year picking 7th. How they chose to deploy those resources will be interesting to watch...

     



    Well said, and I think some of our recent draftees will crack the top lists in the next year or two, while we may not see any player lose their prospect status this year..

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    Cant wait to see the "kids" in Portland...Love the prospects.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Beantowne's comment:

     

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:

     

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    Is that what Keith law has us at?? If that is up to date it's the lowest I've seen Boston.  

     



    that was fresh yesterday

    I think the sox were rated 4th elsewhere

     

     



    Baseball America is the gold standard and carries far more weight in the industry. Law's a jounalist who can't possibly have seen enough of the players to arrive at a grade on his own. What we all know is that the Sox and Yankees have used thier resources to sign players both in the first year player draft and international free agency to above slot moneys...With the new CBA both teams will be hard pressed to maintian there current ranking if they continue to draft at the bottom of each round.

     

    The Yankees have used the international market to offset the loss of picks by signing free agents a practice they no longer can employ. The Sox hoarded picks by letting potential free agents play out their contracts and reaped the supplemental draft picks that came with them, also something that can no longer be employed...Time will tell how much the landscape will change given the new rules but one has to think it now rightfully favors the teams drafting at the top and with the slotting system in place, fewer of the bluechippers will drop based on signability...

    That said, not sure that where we rank on the top prospects list is something they give out a trophy for? Suffice to say that the Sox are in a good position with quality and depth at every level of the system and will add an impact player to that depth this year picking 7th. How they chose to deploy those resources will be interesting to watch...

     



    Well said, and I think some of our recent draftees will crack the top lists in the next year or two, while we may not see any player lose their prospect status this year..

     



    Im more interested in seeing the guys already on the list progress than guys make the list.

    Despite my earlier post (where I was ribbing Hugh a bit), I completely agree with his point.

    Give me 3 elite prospects over 9 good prospects.

    I loved the list.  I think it listed our six best prospects.  While I am admittedly less familiar w/ non-Red Sox prosepcts, I think teh face that this list nailed our top 6 lends credibility towards the list.

    And it wasnt like the list was obvious either.  Owens and Iggy are our 9th and 10th best prospects per soxprosepcts , but top 6 per this list.  So , they (the list creators) stuck their neck out there a bit, and (IMO) gave a solid list.

    Because I think that these guys are our true top 6 (De La Rosa lost prospect status), I am very eager to see these six take a step forward.

    If Iggy can hit .280 in AAA (which I dont think is out of reach)...

    If Owens can take a step forward and have his ERA reflect the fact that he has a 6'6 lefty frame and incredible "raw stuff" ...

    If Barnes/Webster can have a sub 3 ERA in AAA...

    If Boegarts/Bradley can hit like they have been hitting in higher minor league levels...

    ...Im very pumped.

    Even if noone else cracks the list.

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

     I think some of our recent draftees will crack the top lists in the next year or two, while we may not see any player lose their prospect status this year..

     

     



    Im more interested in seeing the guys already on the list progress than guys make the list.

     

    Despite my earlier post (where I was ribbing Hugh a bit), I completely agree with his point.

    Give me 3 elite prospects over 9 good prospects.

    I loved the list.  I think it listed our six best prospects.  While I am admittedly less familiar w/ non-Red Sox prosepcts, I think teh face that this list nailed our top 6 lends credibility towards the list.

    And it wasnt like the list was obvious either.  Owens and Iggy are our 9th and 10th best prospects per soxprosepcts , but top 6 per this list.  So , they (the list creators) stuck their neck out there a bit, and (IMO) gave a solid list.

    Because I think that these guys are our true top 6 (De La Rosa lost prospect status), I am very eager to see these six take a step forward.

    If Iggy can hit .280 in AAA (which I dont think is out of reach)...

    If Owens can take a step forward and have his ERA reflect the fact that he has a 6'6 lefty frame and incredible "raw stuff" ...

    If Barnes/Webster can have a sub 3 ERA in AAA...

    If Boegarts/Bradley can hit like they have been hitting in higher minor league levels...

    ...Im very pumped.

    Even if noone else cracks the list.

     

    I agree that it is more important to have our top prospects do well this year than to have more join the list next year, but guys at the bottom of the top 100 list are still fine players, often with huge upside. There are 30 teams, so a top 100 player is essentially a top 3 prospect on the average team's farm.

    Iggy and Owens passed Brentz, Swihart and Cecchini from soxprospects.com maybe because soxprospects might weigh upside more. They have Brentz at 4-8, Cecchini at 4-9 and Swihart at 3-9. Iggy is 5-8 and Owens is 3-8. (DLR is not a prospect, but soxprospects treats him as such) 

    I think it is entirely possible that Cecchini cracks the top 100 next year. So might Marrero, Vinicio, de la Cruz or one of our young pitchers drafted last June. Iggy may be the only guy with a chance to become a non-prospect this year.

    On a side note, I wonder where Lava would be rated had he not "graduated".

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    lets not leave out Manuel Margot and Cody Kukuk,  I've been hearing some people throw their names out there as potential impact players who could rise as top prospects next year. They're my sleeper picks. Kukuk was a talented high school arm taken in the 2011 draft who only picthed 10 innings last year.  We should get a better look at him this year.  Margot is another guy who will be interesting to follow this year as he comes stateside.  1st division team potential in CF.  

    I also really like the 2012 draft class today more so than I did last year.  If a guy ends up being a really good #4 or even #5 starter, it adds good value to the team and I think people really really underestimate that value.  The Sox seemed to take a lot of high floor, low ceiling talent last year that could rise to the big leagues quick.  If any of these guys reach their potential or even push that talent a little higher then guys like Pat Light and Brian Johnson can move up next year too.  But the Red Sox also added a couple high school arms in the first several rounds as well; taken Callahan in the 2nd and Buttrey in the 4th that I also think will be interesting to watch. 

    We've been hearing for years how the system was considered weak but had a lot of promising talent in the lower levels but now that the system is top heavy, it appears to still have a lot of interesting promising talent that can rise up and replace some of these prospects as they graduate.  It will be a very exciting year to follow the farm system.......(and the big league team too hopefully) 

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    lets not leave out Manuel Margot and Cody Kukuk,  I've been hearing some people throw their names out there as potential impact players who could rise as top prospects next year. They're my sleeper picks. Kukuk was a talented high school arm taken in the 2011 draft who only picthed 10 innings last year.  We should get a better look at him this year.  Margot is another guy who will be interesting to follow this year as he comes stateside.  1st division team potential in CF.  

    I also really like the 2012 draft class today more so than I did last year.  If a guy ends up being a really good #4 or even #5 starter, it adds good value to the team and I think people really really underestimate that value.  The Sox seemed to take a lot of high floor, low ceiling talent last year that could rise to the big leagues quick.  If any of these guys reach their potential or even push that talent a little higher then guys like Pat Light and Brian Johnson can move up next year too.  But the Red Sox also added a couple high school arms in the first several rounds as well; taken Callahan in the 2nd and Buttrey in the 4th that I also think will be interesting to watch. 

    We've been hearing for years how the system was considered weak but had a lot of promising talent in the lower levels but now that the system is top heavy, it appears to still have a lot of interesting promising talent that can rise up and replace some of these prospects as they graduate.  It will be a very exciting year to follow the farm system.......(and the big league team too hopefully) 




    It certainly helps the lower farm to have drafted ...

    2010: 5 guys in the top 110 picks (1 HS) & then Cecchini (HS) in the 4th round.

    2011: 6 guys in the top 111 picks (4 HS) and then C Kukuk (HS) & T Shaw later.

    2012: 5 guys in the top 118 picks (1 HS) and then Buttrey (HS) in the 4th round.

    That's 16 players over the past 3 years... about 5 more than what we were slotted for.

    This year, we don't have sandwich picks, but we do have the 7th overall pick.

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    They've got a pretty good article on Blake Swihart up on epsn right now.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 6 Sox prospects among Top100 ...

    I feel better about Swihart as our catcher of the future than Lava.

     
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