#7 was a cheater too.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to jete02fan's comment:

    i've always been amazed at watching old baseball vids and seeing how many of the old time players were smokers...guess they weren't as fanatical on fitness as the current generation..



    Not even close, Jete.

    I'm old enough, and I'm sure others here are, to remember everyone smoking, everywhere!

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

    In response to jete02fan's comment:

     

    i've always been amazed at watching old baseball vids and seeing how many of the old time players were smokers...guess they weren't as fanatical on fitness as the current generation..

     



     

    Not even close, Jete.

    I'm old enough, and I'm sure others here are, to remember everyone smoking, everywhere!

     



    Yes 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to nhsteven's comment:

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

     

    In response to jete02fan's comment:

     

    i've always been amazed at watching old baseball vids and seeing how many of the old time players were smokers...guess they weren't as fanatical on fitness as the current generation..

     



     

    Not even close, Jete.

    I'm old enough, and I'm sure others here are, to remember everyone smoking, everywhere!

     

     



    Yes 

     

    thanks Steven and 4B's...it's why i was blown away, because while i was coming  up playing ball as i suspect you guys did also at sometime(and i'm sure even today now) you have coaches who frown on smoking...  


     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    I'm guessing these guys could have played longer (Yaz smoked, making his longevity even more amazing) if smoking was less prevalent. DiMaggio & Mantle were done at 36, Maris at 34.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to TV-Guy's comment:

     

    The Yankees during most of Mantle's career were loaded with talent ( they had a major league minor league affiliate in Kansas City).  During those years the Red Sox were out of the race by the All Star game. Mantle's corked bat wasn't the difference. In the playoff game of 1978 a corked bat was the difference.

     

    Refer to the book 

    The Kansas City A's and the Wrong Half of the Yankees: How the Yankees Controlled Two of the Eight American League Franchises During the 1950s 


    The KC episode was quite the scandal, and this type of exploitation was done by others, notably (on even a greater scale) by Mr. Rickey at St. Louis & Brooklyn. (It didn't work in Pittsburgh) The Dent corked bat was hearsay, not that it wasn't true (It probably was). But don't overlook the assistance of the Green Monster, as articulated by Yaz on the hit.

     

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to jete02fan's comment:

     

    i've always been amazed at watching old baseball vids and seeing how many of the old time players were smokers...guess they weren't as fanatical on fitness as the current generation..

     



     

    It was the pre-1964 era (when the study linking smoking & lung cancer was published); however, the populace knew it was bad beforehand; recall the song Smoke, Smoke, Smoke that Cigarette

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

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     I thought I'd save BDC the trouble

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to mryazz's comment:

    In response to jete02fan's comment:

     

    i've always been amazed at watching old baseball vids and seeing how many of the old time players were smokers...guess they weren't as fanatical on fitness as the current generation..

     



    seems like there were less injuries then the 'current generation.'

     

    oh no doubt, those guys were probably never out of the lineup and  routinely played thru both ends of doubleheaders..


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to nhsteven's comment:

     

      Regardless, if you think this tarnishes in a major way one of the greats of the game, you are quite mistaken. Enjoy your Yankee hating melodrama.

     



    i absolutely thinks it tarnishes his career.  he knowingly cheated the game of baseball.

     

    i couldn't care less if joe d smoked or not.  or if babe ruth drank till he puked.  i am pretty sure neither was ever a cheat in his profession.  mantle was.

    he cheated the game.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    slasher9, go read the wikipedia article on corked bats and discover--

    only six guys have been caught using one;

    corked bats are prone to breaking on contact, which then leads to their discovery, a huge disincentive to using one because discovery leads to penalties;

    in 2007 it was argued that corked bats are in fact less effective than regular bats and transfer less kinetic energy to the ball. 

    Mantle probably cheated, but not much, and maybe he only cheated himself, not baseball.  I am not a big Mantle fan, but consider his talent and accomplishments to be undeniable.  I would, however, take Willie Mays over Mantle every day and twice on Sundays. 

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    i hear you max.  but MM didnt play in 2007.  he played in an era where bats weighed 1500 pounds.  drilling out the wood and replacing with cork = bat speed.  bat speed = hitting a FB on time when you are losing some due to (fill in the blank).  the perception was he was gaining an advantage.  ask any ballplayer...any hitter....confidence at the plate = key to success.  THINKING you have an advantage may make the baseball look like a beachball and not a pea.  what he did was pure subterfuge.  he is a cheat.  i dont really care if the "mythbuster" in 2007 found that a baseball hit with a corked bat didnt go any further.  did it compare a 32oz corked bat with a 38oz wood bat and see how quickly a 32-35 year old man can get around on a low to mid 90's FB with each?

    whether or not the corked bats actually helped #7 hit more HR's or have a higher batting avergage is irrelevant.  the simple fact remains - HE CHEATED THE GAME OF BASEBALL.

    this cannot be argued.  you can make all the excuses how it didnt help him.  but that doesnt matter.  he is a cheat.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    Take it easy, slasher.  I said I think he cheated and that I don't much like him.  But I firmly believe his cheating was marginal whatever his intent.  I also don't particularly despise the spitballers of days gone by (or if any are still practicing that ancient art).  Pete Rose, I despise.  The Black Sox, also despicable.  The PED users don't deserve to get into the HOF even though a big chunk of them, like ARod and Roger Clemens, should be there because of what they accomplished without PED's. 

    But a corked bat?  Sorry, but I think my priest would call that a venial sin.  Kind of like George Brett's bat with the extra pine tar. 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to slasher9's comment:

    so really we shouldn't be surprised that the tradition continues in the Bronx.

    A Mickey Mantle game used bat was xrayed and discovered that it was drilled and corked.  this is the first proof of the claims of the longtime clubhouse attendant that always said Mantle corked.

    atta boy Mick!!!



    And being a Red Sox fan, would the Red Sox have won the 2004 and 2007 World Series without repeated steroid user Manny Ramirez, and David Ortiz?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    2004 was the greatest year of baseball ever.   EVAH.

    no other year can even come close.  like apples and a torque wrench.

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaffyDan. Show DaffyDan's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to ADG's comment:

    IAnd being a Red Sox fan, would the Red Sox have won the 2004 and 2007 World Series without repeated steroid user Manny Ramirez, and David Ortiz?

    If every other team lost their offenders? 

    Yes. 

     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: #7 was a cheater too.

    In response to TV-Guy's comment:

    No, I just don't think that an OP about Mantle using a corked bat should include everything under the Sun involving cheating. Last week when the threads were about Buchholz's " spitball", did anyone bring up Bucky Dent, Mickey Mantle, or the Black Sox?



    You mean like this?

     

     

    The Yankees during most of Mantle's career were loaded with talent ( they had a major league minor league affiliate in Kansas City).  During those years the Red Sox were out of the race by the All Star game. Mantle's corked bat wasn't the difference. In the playoff game of 1978 a corked bat was the difference.

     
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