A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    Of course Amp's a genuine RedSox fan. Why else would he foot the expense and time to come out to Seattle every year to catch the Sox series.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III : Amp, "pessimistic" is all too many Sox "fans"'s attitude all too much of the time.  "Realistic" are your concerns. O-wise, re Youk's problems - whatever they are - are a concern, but at worst they make the 1st/2nd offensive machine the 3rd/4th.  Relatively minor problem. P-wise, we're dead in the water in the post-season without Beckett at his best. Re health blame?  Lester has been healthy and excellent, Beckett sublime despite accidental sprain last week.....Lackey may or may not have long term elbow probs given shots in the Spring after a decade of heavy duty......Matsuzaka's elbow gave out after MANY pitches (rather than inning count) in MLB and heavy duty pitch counts from his teens in Japan.  Buchholz has had back problems. My point is that, of the Fab 5, the only health situation that isn't fully healthy, incidental injury or run-of-the-mill wear-and-tear is Buchholz' back...and 1 is a pretty small sample.  So I think finding blame is guesswork, and seeking blame is scapegoating.
    Posted by SonicsMonksLyresVicars[/QUOTE]

    My friend and Red Sox fan, since I was in my 20's while at the 7th game of the 67' series against the Cardinals, my 'tenure' alone should entitle me to feel 'pessimistic'.  I've been through the tough years. I would hope you would allow me satisfaction of my feelings....*laugh*.

    Call it what you wish, but it certainly isn't optimism.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Boomerangsdotcom. Show Boomerangsdotcom's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    I don't know if I have ever been as disapointed as I was when we lost the 67 series. What a great series. I was 12 years old. It was crushing!

    I think we will get into the playoffs and if Buchholz can start game 3 we have a shot. I'm hanging in there as will Amp I'm sure! 
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    Bedard for game 3.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Critter23. Show Critter23's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

     Interesting points from all tonight.  I am praying that Buch, Beckett, and Youk will be back for the PO's.  I agree with DC on trying anything with catchers in short time left if it might help a pitcher.  Comments over the last few pages have reinforced for me all that Harness and Moon offered about CERA last year.  I think Salty despite shortcomings has been a pleasant surprise and worth Theo's faith in him.  He hit his 16th tonight and would we agree he has improved on both sides of the ball this year?  Wake would be hard for any catcher and how many catchers have to catch a Wake?  My biggest disappointment Amp was 1986 and the Mets.
    I was teaching in Dhaka in an overseas American School.  My principal came to my room telling me the RS had won, but the marines who were getting the game on a radio had garbled the message or misunderstood what was being said.  I was jumping and screaming in my room for joy in front of a wide array of international students who thought I was nuts.  Later my boss came to the room telling me the RS had lost, and I was broken hearted.  He was from the part of Conn. that roots for the Sox, so he was disappointed too.
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    PS.  1975 wasn't a picnic either.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    I lived in Milwaukee in '67.

    I was 16 in '75.  I was heart-broken.


     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE]I don't know if I have ever been as disapointed as I was when we lost the 67 series. What a great series. I was 12 years old. It was crushing! I think we will get into the playoffs and if Buchholz can start game 3 we have a shot. I'm hanging in there as will Amp I'm sure! 
    Posted by Boomerangsdotcom[/QUOTE]
    Boom, I turned 12 during the 1967 World Series.

    I was crushed a week or two earlier when the Red Sox swept a two-game series from my Minnesota Twins at Fenway Park on the final weekend to win the pennant by one game over the Twins and the Tigers.
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE] Interesting points from all tonight.  I am praying that Buch, Beckett, and Youk will be back for the PO's.  I agree with DC on trying anything with catchers in short time left if it might help a pitcher.  Comments over the last few pages have reinforced for me all that Harness and Moon offered about CERA last year.  I think Salty despite shortcomings has been a pleasant surprise and worth Theo's faith in him.  He hit his 16th tonight and would we agree he has improved on both sides of the ball this year?  Wake would be hard for any catcher and how many catchers have to catch a Wake?  My biggest disappointment Amp was 1986 and the Mets. I was teaching in Dhaka in an overseas American School.  My principal came to my room telling me the RS had won, but the marines who were getting the game on a radio had garbled the message or misunderstood what was being said.  I was jumping and screaming in my room for joy in front of a wide array of international students who thought I was nuts.  Later my boss came to the room telling me the RS had lost, and I was broken hearted.  He was from the part of Conn. that roots for the Sox, so he was disappointed too.
    Posted by Critter23[/QUOTE]

    Another teacher told me a similar story, Crit. He reacted in the same fashion. So, don't feel bad.

    Tonight the team showed amazing heart. Kudos to Jake/Salty/Paps.
    Let's hope Lester shines in a big game Sunday. I hope Tek catches him.
    I said going into this series that the Sox, wounded on the hill, need just one win.
    If they get it Sunday:

    The RedSox can play .500 ball the rest of the season and Tampa would have to go 14-3 just to tie.
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    The RedSox can play .500 ball the rest of the season and Tampa would have to go 14-3 just to tie.

    You are correct, but since we still ahve to play TB 4 games next week, we could win tomorrow, get swept next week and that alone puts TB 1 GB in the loss column. 
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    I'll bet against a sweep next week. I'll ride with the percentages on this one.
    The Sox have lost their last 4. Starting pitchers of games lost:
    Weiland
    Lackey
    Miller
    Wake

    Two of them spent much of the season in the minors.
    Wake started the season in the pen.
    Lackey took two cort. shots and is still in the rotation.
    Despite that, two of these games were winnable.

    None of these pitchers are likely targeted for round 1 of the PO's.
    By contrast, the Rays/Yankees have their rotations in tact.
    And NY has lost their last 4 games.

    RedSox BP misses Hill big time.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    I agree, harness. I didn't say I thought TB would sweep, but when you have so many head-to-head games left, making up ground can be easier. Each game is really a two-game swing.

    I still have complete faith in the Sox. I can't wait to see all the bandwagon jumperoffers scramble to jump back on this October.
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    Panics and bridge jumpers don't reflect team plight as much as they do their own inability to cut it when it's on the line.

    I heavily rely on just this very mindset during the winter months.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    If we lose today, only the a few of us will be left that still feel this team is strong enough to win it all.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III



    I still believe that the Red Sox is strong enough to win it all. 

    Teams go through struggles throughout a 162-game season.

    The Yankees and Brewers are struggling too. 
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    Exactly. This team is still the same team of a month ago. Once healthy, we will all see soon enough.
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE]Bedard for game 3.
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]
    If Buchholz can come back and get a couple starts in before the playoffs and look good, I'd go with Buchholz. I'd have to agree that Bedard is more likely though given the situation. My point was that this rotation probably is unlikely to cut it in the playoffs without Buchholz being back and looking good. That's a lot to hope for but it is possible. He may only get one rehab start. He may not be available before the 2nd round. My gut tells me that they are timing him to be ready for a start in the first round PO. It seems like that is the trajectory. they just don't want to announce it and get everyone prepped for it. 

    I like Bedard and I'm ok with Bedard in game 3. I'd just like him available in the Yankees series if necessary, in Yankee stadium. And against the Phillies if we get that far.
     
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    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III : Boom, I turned 12 during the 1967 World Series. I was crushed a week or two earlier when the Red Sox swept a two-game series from my Minnesota Twins at Fenway Park on the final weekend to win the pennant by one game over the Twins and the Tigers.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    The finest hour of Yaz, in a very long career! Those Twin teams were great! Carew, Oliva, Killebrew ( I was scared to death of that guy...44 HR that year! ). Dean Chance, Dean Chance, Jim Kaat. Gaylord Perry's brother pitched for them that year and was decent. Yaz just willed the Sox to the top. It was his year. 
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Boomerangsdotcom. Show Boomerangsdotcom's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    75 was a great series to watch though wasn't it!  The best!

    Until 2004!

    We could list a ton of disapointment years couldn't we. I chose to move on! No Bucky "bleeping" Dent's  from me! God, I'm glad that's over!
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Boomerangsdotcom. Show Boomerangsdotcom's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE]The RedSox can play .500 ball the rest of the season and Tampa would have to go 14-3 just to  tie. Y ou are correct, but since we still ahve to play TB 4 games next week, we could win tomorrow, get swept next week and that alone puts TB 1 GB in the loss column. 
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    Yeah, Tampa was just going to tank at mid season, Right Moon! They might knock us out of the playoffs! We need our pitching to come back and put up good numbers for a while. We face a pretty tough schedule.

    Softy has set a new low this year. He should just be flipping a coin instead.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III : If Buchholz can come back and get a couple starts in before the playoffs and look good, I'd go with Buchholz. I'd have to agree that Bedard is more likely though given the situation. 

    Boom, there's only like 18 days left to the season. No way can Buch start 2 games by Sept 28th. 

    My point was that this rotation probably is unlikely to cut it in the playoffs without Buchholz being back and looking good. That's a lot to hope for but it is possible. He may only get one rehab start. He may not be available before the 2nd round. My gut tells me that they are timing him to be ready for a start in the first round PO. It seems like that is the trajectory. they just don't want to announce it and get everyone prepped for it.  

    If he starts a game in the second round, I'd be shocked. He hasn't even thrown batting practice. He's been out a long long time.

    I like Bedard and I'm ok with Bedard in game 3. I'd just like him available in the Yankees series if necessary, in Yankee stadium. And against the Phillies if we get that far.

    I am still happy with Beckett, Lester and Bedard as our 1-2-3.
    Posted by Boomerangsdotcom[/QUOTE]

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Boomerangsdotcom. Show Boomerangsdotcom's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    Moon, I don't know what Buchholz can do. They are not saying what he can do. They might announce next week for all i know, a rehab start or 2. From everything they've said they are not even projecting him for the playoffs at all but don't we know that behind the scenes he's probably being prepped for a shot at starting in the PO? They wouldn't announce it even if that were the plan. They will announce such things at the last possible time.

    I really think he gets a start in the PO. I also really think we don't get far without him. Lester seems to be complaining a lot about pitch calls, and he doesn't always seem to be right when he's complaining. Beckett looks strong. Bedard may well give us a good start or 2 but we can't really count on him and our pen seems to be falling apart. We could use Buchholz a lot. It's ugly right now. We really need Buchholz in the play offs. I'm still thinking he has a good shot at coming back.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Boomerangsdotcom. Show Boomerangsdotcom's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    Man the pen is just looking like a disaster right now. WTFH?
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III


    The encouraging thing now is that they've hit bottom and it looks like they're embarassed.  Being professionals, in a bizzare way, this might be the impetus they need to turn things around around.  If this happens, the timing would be great.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Boomerangsdotcom. Show Boomerangsdotcom's posts

    Re: A Realistic Look at 2011: Part III

    I don't see a lot of short term hope in the starting rotation or the bull pen. They are not positioned well for the play offs. Can we even expect .500 ball during the rest of the year when the wheels come off the pitching staff like it has recently? I trust that the offense will be ok but with Buchholz out and Lester struggling some, Wakefield, Miller and Lackey tanking, it's a problem. Becket has missed a start and might miss another. Wieland has given us the best start we've had recently. Bedard is still hanging in there. The pen has imploded recently. We have real problems with pitching, and to be honest, we've had significant problems there all year.

    Tampa has a hot pitching staff. They and California are both going to be a problem.

    We may not make the playoffs. We are not trending well at all.
     
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