A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    In response to jasko2248's comment:

     

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    And, maybe Detroit would go to $85M, if Boston offered $83M/5. Maybe not.

     



    Yes, there's no way of knowing if the Red Sox could have landed Sanchez if they had been willing to go to $83 or $85 million.  It appears that they stayed away from him because they thought the price was too steep even at $75 million. 

     

    And the way Sanchez is pitching, this certainly may turn out to have been a mistake.

     

     

    The Sox lost interest when it approached 50 million.  They clearly weren't going to sign anyone in this free agent class to a long term/high dollars contract.  They are obviously aware that they were going to likely have to extend Lester & Buchholz fairly soon, and having 3 guys in your rotation making close to 100 million or more is a recipe for disaster.  

     



    Obviously you are right, but that doesn't mean some can't disagree with the choice.

     

     




     

    You can certainly disagree with the "choice," but we have no idea if he would have even considered playing here, and I think it's a safe bet to say that they aren't going to give a long term deal at big dollars to anyone who would rather be somewhere else, and I agree 100%.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

     

    In response to jasko2248's comment:

     

    The Sox lost interest when it approached 50 million.  They clearly weren't going to sign anyone in this free agent class to a long term/high dollars contract.  They are obviously aware that they were going to likely have to extend Lester & Buchholz fairly soon, and having 3 guys in your rotation making close to 100 million or more is a recipe for disaster.  

     



    I don't know about this.  Buchholz is under control through 2017, so his contract + option years actually expires at the same time as Sanchez's.  And Lackey is off the books after 2014, except for the minimum wage option for 2015.

     

    The Sox may, of course, be eyeing a big pitching acquisition that we don't know about yet.   

     




    Or just waiting to see what they have in the minors before locking anyone up long term. Thats what the Dempster signing tells me. Buy time for their own guys. Build the next great Red Sox team and all.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

     

     

    The Sox lost interest when it approached 50 million.  They clearly weren't going to sign anyone in this free agent class to a long term/high dollars contract.  They are obviously aware that they were going to likely have to extend Lester & Buchholz fairly soon, and having 3 guys in your rotation making close to 100 million or more is a recipe for disaster.  

     



    Obviously you are right, but that doesn't mean some can't disagree with the choice.

     

     




     

    You can certainly disagree with the "choice," but we have no idea if he would have even considered playing here, and I think it's a safe bet to say that they aren't going to give a long term deal at big dollars to anyone who would rather be somewhere else, and I agree 100%.

     

    It is very clear the Sox were not going to make a big splash signing this year. I have never doubted that or tried to argue that point. I may be wrong, but it seems like you keep acting like I disagree with this part of the equation.

    I know they did not want to pay big for anyone, and obviously not Sanchez, or we would have heard at least rumors of an offer. 

    I don't blame them for not signing him, and he wasn't part of my first choice plan either. I just didn't expect them to sign so many players to big salaries and push the big choices to another year. I get the strategy and flexibility that comes with it, but I disagree with the fundemental aspect of playing it half way. It may make business sense in some ways, and I understand that's what it is all about, but from a baseball perspective, I feel we'd have done better to just shoot for 2014-2015 and beyond, or get 2 key big players that would help us now and beyond 2015 (ie Upton & Sanchez), or at least solve one of out biggest needs we've had for 3+ years: solid 3 starter and solid clean-up hitter. Then we'd have only one slot to fill next winter.

    As a side notae, I also said, Ben deserves a chance to show his plan. I wouldn't count last winter as totally his free handed reign. I loved the Dodger trade and am holding off judgement until a more appropriate time. I hope to God I have to apologize for being so critical. So far, some of the moves I did not like have worked out well. I'm hoping I am wrong more often.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    TB vs Bal

    NY vs Tor

    Bos vs MN

     

    Good chance to make some gains.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    TB vs Bal

    NY vs Tor

    Bos vs MN

     

    Good chance to make some gains.




    Toronto has been playing better as of late (4-game W streak) and the O's pitching is in trouble. Good for the Sox, bad for the other division leaders.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    Someone's going to lose in those series. I hope the Yanks and TB. (I still rate TB ahead of Baltimore.)

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    TB vs Bal

    NY vs Tor

    Bos vs MN

     

    Good chance to make some gains.

     




    Toronto has been playing better as of late (4-game W streak) and the O's pitching is in trouble. Good for the Sox, bad for the other division leaders.

     



    Unfortunately, Kuroda is up against Buehrle tonight.

    Advantage, Yankees.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Someone's going to lose in those series. I hope the Yanks and TB. (I still rate TB ahead of Baltimore.)




    I believe Price, and the Rays, are worse off than some think. Hes been mediocre, for him, all season and now an arm issue. They have guys to replace him, but they are unprovenat the MLB level. Their lineup as constructed isnt that good IMO. I think Maddon doesnt set it up correctly as he doesnt put his high obp guys in front of guys like Zobrist and Longo. Loney should be batting 2nd, not 6th or 7th. Jennings should be lower until he can get on base more consistently.

    Moore is good, but still has issues. He walks a lot of guys and doesnt go deep into games. hes gone 7+ IP once. Hellickson is good, but not TOTR good IMO. Hes been mediocre so far this year. Hernanzez is a BOTR arm. I like Cobb. He can give up a lot of hits, but has better control overall. Im not sure they can overcome something like Price being out and not being at "Ace" caliber this year without Shields there to give them the innings needed.

    The O's best pitcher will be out the next month with an oblique strain. The rest of their guys are Middle-BOTR starters. Not much to be encouraged about with their rotation.  They have a decent BP, but they are going to be overworked from their starters. Good lineup though that can win some games for them, unlike the Rays who depend on their pitching more.

    Toronto has a beast of a line up and when Dickey, JJ, and Burehle get straight, they should be right in the mix.

     

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Someone's going to lose in those series. I hope the Yanks and TB. (I still rate TB ahead of Baltimore.)

     




    I believe Price, and the Rays, are worse off than some think. Hes been mediocre, for him, all season and now an arm issue. They have guys to replace him, but they are unprovenat the MLB level. Their lineup as constructed isnt that good IMO. I think Maddon doesnt set it up correctly as he doesnt put his high obp guys in front of guys like Zobrist and Longo. Loney should be batting 2nd, not 6th or 7th. Jennings should be lower until he can get on base more consistently.

     

    Moore is good, but still has issues. He walks a lot of guys and doesnt go deep into games. hes gone 7+ IP once. Hellickson is good, but not TOTR good IMO. Hes been mediocre so far this year. Hernanzez is a BOTR arm. I like Cobb. He can give up a lot of hits, but has better control overall. Im not sure they can overcome something like Price being out and not being at "Ace" caliber this year without Shields there to give them the innings needed.

    The O's best pitcher will be out the next month with an oblique strain. The rest of their guys are Middle-BOTR starters. Not much to be encouraged about with their rotation.  They have a decent BP, but they are going to be overworked from their starters. Good lineup though that can win some games for them, unlike the Rays who depend on their pitching more.

    Toronto has a beast of a line up and when Dickey, JJ, and Burehle get straight, they should be right in the mix.

     

     



    You make some good points, but I could make some similar points about Baltimore and Toronto's staff.

    TBR: Price is certainly the key, but it is Cobb who took Shields' slot in the rotation. He's done very well.

    Here's the Rays rotation without Price:

    Moore:  7-0  2.44  1.125

    Cobb:    4-2  2.89   1.170

    Hellick: 1-2  5.25  1.271

    Hernandez: 2-4  4.41  1.242

     

    Their pen has been shaky after years of "overachieving".

     

    Their offense is as bad as always.

    Out of their top 9 PA guys, only 2 are over .785 (Longoria/Loney)

    4 are below .719. The 10th guy is at .606, 11th at .501, and 12th at .679.

    If Zobrist comes around and Escobar snaps out of his .598 funk, they may be in this to the end.

     

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    I read a blip that Iggy was beched for not hustling.

    If so, I'm not impressed.

    Anyone have more data?

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    TB vs Bal

    NY vs Tor

    Bos vs MN

     

    Good chance to make some gains.

     




    Toronto has been playing better as of late (4-game W streak) and the O's pitching is in trouble. Good for the Sox, bad for the other division leaders.

     

     



    Unfortunately, Kuroda is up against Buehrle tonight.

     

    Advantage, Yankees.




    hey man, dont rain on my parade with factual information Wink

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Someone's going to lose in those series. I hope the Yanks and TB. (I still rate TB ahead of Baltimore.)

     




    I believe Price, and the Rays, are worse off than some think. Hes been mediocre, for him, all season and now an arm issue. They have guys to replace him, but they are unprovenat the MLB level. Their lineup as constructed isnt that good IMO. I think Maddon doesnt set it up correctly as he doesnt put his high obp guys in front of guys like Zobrist and Longo. Loney should be batting 2nd, not 6th or 7th. Jennings should be lower until he can get on base more consistently.

     

    Moore is good, but still has issues. He walks a lot of guys and doesnt go deep into games. hes gone 7+ IP once. Hellickson is good, but not TOTR good IMO. Hes been mediocre so far this year. Hernanzez is a BOTR arm. I like Cobb. He can give up a lot of hits, but has better control overall. Im not sure they can overcome something like Price being out and not being at "Ace" caliber this year without Shields there to give them the innings needed.

    The O's best pitcher will be out the next month with an oblique strain. The rest of their guys are Middle-BOTR starters. Not much to be encouraged about with their rotation.  They have a decent BP, but they are going to be overworked from their starters. Good lineup though that can win some games for them, unlike the Rays who depend on their pitching more.

    Toronto has a beast of a line up and when Dickey, JJ, and Burehle get straight, they should be right in the mix.

     

     

     



    You make some good points, but I could make some similar points about Baltimore and Toronto's staff.

     

    TBR: Price is certainly the key, but it is Cobb who took Shields' slot in the rotation. He's done very well.

    Here's the Rays rotation without Price:

    Moore:  7-0  2.44  1.125

    Cobb:    4-2  2.89   1.170

    Hellick: 1-2  5.25  1.271

    Hernandez: 2-4  4.41  1.242

     

    Their pen has been shaky after years of "overachieving".

     

    Their offense is as bad as always.

    Out of their top 9 PA guys, only 2 are over .785 (Longoria/Loney)

    4 are below .719. The 10th guy is at .606, 11th at .501, and 12th at .679.

    If Zobrist comes around and Escobar snaps out of his .598 funk, they may be in this to the end.

     

     




    The wildcard is Moore. Hes good, no doubt, but If he cant go more than 5-6IP your going to get into that questionable BP as much as we do with Doubie or Lackey. Cobb seems steady and the other 2 are just Ok so far this year. Nothing that scares me at all.

    Escobar is a career 663 OPS SS so I dont expect too much more from him. Zobrist should recover.

    If Price is down for any period of time and the other starter dont step up, I dont think Tampa will be a threat to anyone.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to ampoule's comment:

    I read a blip that Iggy was beched for not hustling.

    If so, I'm not impressed.

    Anyone have more data?




    He was benched for a few games at the start of the month due to not hustling and having a tude' because he wasnt in Boston. Hes playing again the last week.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to ampoule's comment:

     

    I read a blip that Iggy was beched for not hustling.

    If so, I'm not impressed.

    Anyone have more data?

     




    He was benched for a few games at the start of the month due to not hustling and having a tude' because he wasnt in Boston. Hes playing again the last week.

     




    Thanks...a pouter.

    For a reality check, he should read Nava's bio.

    My enthusiasm for him has dropped a few notches.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    Escobar is a career 663 OPS SS so I dont expect too much more from him. 

    I don't, but those are better numbers than Sean Rodriguez.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedsoxProspects. Show RedsoxProspects's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    TB vs Bal

    NY vs Tor

    Bos vs MN

     

    Good chance to make some gains.

     




    Toronto has been playing better as of late (4-game W streak) and the O's pitching is in trouble. Good for the Sox, bad for the other division leaders.

     

     



    Unfortunately, Kuroda is up against Buehrle tonight.

     

    Advantage, Yankees.



    HHmm, A shut out for the Yanks. Kuroda continues to be a surefire stud. He's our problem.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedsoxProspects. Show RedsoxProspects's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    Is it just me or do they give Cobb that low strike more than any other pitcher in baseball?

    Please God, make us have a better draft year than last year. 2012 may well end up as our worst draft in history. Imagine our farm if we got anyhting from last year's crop?

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Escobar is a career 663 OPS SS so I dont expect too much more from him. 

    I don't, but those are better numbers than Sean Rodriguez.




    Lol...which is also not saying much ;)

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:

    Is it just me or do they give Cobb that low strike more than any other pitcher in baseball?

    Please God, make us have a better draft year than last year. 2012 may well end up as our worst draft in history. Imagine our farm if we got anyhting from last year's crop?



    Not a Mike Trout or Strasburg type guy, but not nearly as bad as you make it out to be either. We wont know on a couple of these guys for another couple years. Not sure how you can use the term worst in history. A bit deamatic I think.

    Callahan and Buttrey have a lot of promise and a lot of upside. Aguliera is making himself known already this year, Marrero looks to be a steady solid SS. Light and Maddox look like good pen arms with Maddox being eyed as a possible closer because scouts love his make up for that role. Johnson looks to be a solid BOTR starter who can eat some innings. Nothing wrong with last years draft Boom. Nothing at all.

    1 (24) Deven Marrero SS Arizona State 1 (31)* Brian Johnson LHP Florida 1s (37)* Pat Light RHP Monmouth 2 (87) Jamie Callahan RHP Dillon HS (SC) 3 (118) Austin Maddox RHP Florida 4 Ty Buttrey RHP Providence HS (NC) 5 Mike Augliera RHP Binghamton
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

     

    Dear Blue Jays,

    Learn how to #&^%$ win at Yankee stadium.   

    Geez.

    Sincerely,

    A Red Sox fan who thinks that your team stinks.    LOL

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Escobar is a career 663 OPS SS so I dont expect too much more from him. 

    I don't, but those are better numbers than Sean Rodriguez.

     




    Lol...which is also not saying much ;)

    \

    True but a rise from .550 to .650 is as good as one from .750 to .850. A gain is a gain.

     

     




     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to RedsoxProspects's comment:

     

    Is it just me or do they give Cobb that low strike more than any other pitcher in baseball?

    Please God, make us have a better draft year than last year. 2012 may well end up as our worst draft in history. Imagine our farm if we got anyhting from last year's crop?

     



    I think in general this season umpiring has been horrible for the Sox and their opponents.  I work for/watch NESN and have seen some of the worst calls in recent years on the Amica pitch zone.  Not everyone agrees with the system but its been quite noticable to me compared to previous seasons.

     

    Either its way out of calibration, or some of the umps need serious eye exams and re-training.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    The umps have been worse than normal, but I think it has been evenly bad so far.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jidgef. Show jidgef's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2013: Part II

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:

     

    Is it just me or do they give Cobb that low strike more than any other pitcher in baseball?

    Please God, make us have a better draft year than last year. 2012 may well end up as our worst draft in history. Imagine our farm if we got anyhting from last year's crop?

     



    Not a Mike Trout or Strasburg type guy, but not nearly as bad as you make it out to be either. We wont know on a couple of these guys for another couple years. Not sure how you can use the term worst in history. A bit deamatic I think.

     

    Callahan and Buttrey have a lot of promise and a lot of upside. Aguliera is making himself known already this year, Marrero looks to be a steady solid SS. Light and Maddox look like good pen arms with Maddox being eyed as a possible closer because scouts love his make up for that role. Johnson looks to be a solid BOTR starter who can eat some innings. Nothing wrong with last years draft Boom. Nothing at all.

    1 (24) Deven Marrero SS Arizona State 1 (31)* Brian Johnson LHP Florida 1s (37)* Pat Light RHP Monmouth 2 (87) Jamie Callahan RHP Dillon HS (SC) 3 (118) Austin Maddox RHP Florida 4 Ty Buttrey RHP Providence HS (NC) 5 Mike Augliera RHP Binghamton



    Marrero looked terrific in Spring Training; small sample I know, but he has all the tools. He was invited to major league camp right out of the shoot so someone thinks pretty highly of him.

     
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