A tale of two extensions

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    A tale of two extensions

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    This is all good, but let's see what actually happens.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    The Tanaka contract jacked up the prices to all Good to Fair Starters. Sox better start 20 million at least. That will be a hometown discount.

    Teams really have to focus on getting their Minor Leagues into shape, especially the small market teams.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

    [/QUOTE]


    Well said..and perception goes a long way. At the end of the day..you can really tell the players who truly love Boston and love playing for the Sox...people like Lester, Pedroia, Wake, Dempster, etc....player who put the team and the fans first.

    I will take character over popularity any day of the week. While other Sox fans worship at the feet of players who make millions..yet still complain to the media about being able to "feed their families"...I prefer the ones who just go out and do the job..and put the team first.

    I am sure with the adversity that Lester has faced, he is able to really put things into perspective and realize just how lucky he is on so many levels. I am sure actions like this are his way of paying back the karma so to speak.

    I have always been a fan of Lester. It's amazing what happened to that starting rotation once they got rid of the poison in the locker room.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from seannybboi. Show seannybboi's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    If Lester cared about how much Tanaka is getting, Lester wouldn't have said they have to rip his jersey off of him to leave Boston.  Lester is only thinking about coming back and I think he will take something similar to or little more than what Pedey took.  

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to JIMMYPROFFER's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to crazy-world-of-troybrown's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The Tanaka contract jacked up the prices to all Good to Fair Starters. Sox better start 20 million at least. That will be a hometown discount.

    Teams really have to focus on getting their Minor Leagues into shape, especially the small market teams.

    [/QUOTE]

    Good to fair starters have been getting outlandish contracts well before Tanaka.

    [/QUOTE]

    Excellent point.

    AJ Burnett @ $69.5MM

    CC @ $182MM

    mussina @ $109MM

    pavano @ $38MM

    etc..etc...etc...etc....etc....etc....

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to miscricket's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

    [/QUOTE]


    Well said..and perception goes a long way. At the end of the day..you can really tell the players who truly love Boston and love playing for the Sox...people like Lester, Pedroia, Wake, Dempster, etc....player who put the team and the fans first.

    I will take character over popularity any day of the week. While other Sox fans worship at the feet of players who make millions..yet still complain to the media about being able to "feed their families"...I prefer the ones who just go out and do the job..and put the team first.

    I am sure with the adversity that Lester has faced, he is able to really put things into perspective and realize just how lucky he is on so many levels. I am sure actions like this are his way of paying back the karma so to speak.

    I have always been a fan of Lester. It's amazing what happened to that starting rotation once they got rid of the poison in the locker room.

    [/QUOTE]


    he is the clear leader now and always was in my book.  Yes, he has character.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to seannybboi's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    If Lester cared about how much Tanaka is getting, Lester wouldn't have said they have to rip his jersey off of him to leave Boston.  Lester is only thinking about coming back and I think he will take something similar to or little more than what Pedey took.  

    [/QUOTE]


    I love this statement and if he was buying his own drinks up to this point, that just ended after this statement.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:



    he is the clear leader now and always was in my book.  Yes, he has character.




    Yeah.
    Right....

    Go back to beer and fried chicken threads.

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to miscricket's comment:



    Well said..and perception goes a long way. At the end of the day..you can really tell the players who truly love Boston and love playing for the Sox...people like Lester, Pedroia, Wake, Dempster, etc....player who put the team and the fans first.

    I will take character over popularity any day of the week. While other Sox fans worship at the feet of players who make millions..yet still complain to the media about being able to "feed their families"...I prefer the ones who just go out and do the job..and put the team first.

    I am sure with the adversity that Lester has faced, he is able to really put things into perspective and realize just how lucky he is on so many levels. I am sure actions like this are his way of paying back the karma so to speak.

    I have always been a fan of Lester. It's amazing what happened to that starting rotation once they got rid of the poison in the locker room.




    I know a player that has character, a love for his team and a great love for the city he plays in :-)

    I wouldn't go as far as to say I worship said player, but I think he gets a bum deal for speaking his mind. I'd have to say, said player did go out and do his job as well as help his team bring the winning trophy back to Boston. Without him in the mix, there would not have been a World Series win. I'd say he did put the team first, especially when he gathered them in the dugout for a pep talk.

    Not to mention, watching him interact with his son speaks volumes of his character.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    17.5M per year for lester seems like the magic number to me. it would be a team friendly salary given the going rate for top flight pitching yet still grant Lester a comfortable contract.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to mef429's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    17.5M per year for lester seems like the magic number to me. it would be a team friendly salary given the going rate for top flight pitching yet still grant Lester a comfortable contract.

    [/QUOTE]


    I bet they reach an agreement soon.  Once they extend his contract the sox will deal with Ortiz.  Right now Jon is the one get signed.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to 2013soxchamps' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    [QUOTE]

    Well said..and perception goes a long way. At the end of the day..you can really tell the players who truly love Boston and love playing for the Sox...people like Lester, Pedroia, Wake, Dempster, etc....player who put the team and the fans first.

     

    I will take character over popularity any day of the week. While other Sox fans worship at the feet of players who make millions..yet still complain to the media about being able to "feed their families"...I prefer the ones who just go out and do the job..and put the team first.

    I am sure with the adversity that Lester has faced, he is able to really put things into perspective and realize just how lucky he is on so many levels. I am sure actions like this are his way of paying back the karma so to speak.

    I have always been a fan of Lester. It's amazing what happened to that starting rotation once they got rid of the poison in the locker room.

     

    [/QUOTE]


     

    I know a player that has character, a love for his team and a great love for the city he plays in :-)

    I wouldn't go as far as to say I worship said player, but I think he gets a bum deal for speaking his mind. I'd have to say, said player did go out and do his job as well as help his team bring the winning trophy back to Boston. Without him in the mix, there would not have been a World Series win. I'd say he did put the team first, especially when he gathered them in the dugout for a pep talk.

    Not to mention, watching him interact with his son speaks volumes of his character.

    [/QUOTE]

    You mean that same player who stated in an interview that he "hopes he doesn't have to play with another jersey in 2015"? That is a far cry from the actions of Lester.

    True..without Ortiz there would not be a World Series ring..but the same could be said for most other players on the team...and most certainly the starting pitching. Without Lester there wouldn't be a World Series ring either..or Pedroia..or Naps...I could go on and on.

    I will agree with you that Ortiz is good at the emotional pep talks.. If only he would learn the art of "no comment" when speaking to the media I think most people would stop thinking of him as a petulant child.

    Speaking of chicken and beer..seems to be there was a decided lack of leadership in the Red Sox clubhouse that year. Pedey tried his best..but there were no emotional pep talks from Ortiz that year..no rallying of the team that year..even though leadership was sorely needed. I guess when Ortiz shut it down for the season he saw no reason to lead the team out of the bad place they were in.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

    [/QUOTE]Very well said...... Lester did a great job on this and now has moved on to S T and wlii let the SOX & his agent figure it all out !!   Nothing wrong with that........


     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

    [/QUOTE]

    Because a 30 year old pitcher is the same as a 38 year old DH. You realize that Lester could make more in this deal than Ortiz has made in his career? So I guess it is the same exact thing. You are so tiresome?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

    [/QUOTE]

    Because a 30 year old pitcher is the same as a 38 year old DH. You realize that Lester could make more in this deal than Ortiz has made in his career? So I guess it is the same exact thing. You are so tiresome?

    [/QUOTE]


    it is not the same thing and if both players go to free agency, I will bank there will be a lot more interest in Lester.  Last I check both the AL and NL use pitchers, not the same for Ortiz's position.  Even with the al, the dh is not used primarily by one player on the majority of teams.

    Althought Ortiz's whining to the press works with John Henry, I am also willing to bet that some owners want nothing to do with it.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    it is not the same thing and if both players go to free agency, I will bank there will be a lot more interest in Lester.  Last I check both the AL and NL use pitchers, not the same for Ortiz's position.  Even with the al, the dh is not used primarily by one player on the majority of teams.

    Althought Ortiz's whining to the press works with John Henry, I am also willing to bet that some owners want nothing to do with it.

    [/QUOTE]

    maybe he should opt out of his contract and have the Red Sox bid against nobody and give him a 10 year $300MM contract like your boy a-rod did.....

    talk about "some owners"....SMH.....

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to miscricket's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to 2013soxchamps' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    [QUOTE]

    Well said..and perception goes a long way. At the end of the day..you can really tell the players who truly love Boston and love playing for the Sox...people like Lester, Pedroia, Wake, Dempster, etc....player who put the team and the fans first.

     

    I will take character over popularity any day of the week. While other Sox fans worship at the feet of players who make millions..yet still complain to the media about being able to "feed their families"...I prefer the ones who just go out and do the job..and put the team first.

    I am sure with the adversity that Lester has faced, he is able to really put things into perspective and realize just how lucky he is on so many levels. I am sure actions like this are his way of paying back the karma so to speak.

    I have always been a fan of Lester. It's amazing what happened to that starting rotation once they got rid of the poison in the locker room.

     

    [/QUOTE]


     

    I know a player that has character, a love for his team and a great love for the city he plays in :-)

    I wouldn't go as far as to say I worship said player, but I think he gets a bum deal for speaking his mind. I'd have to say, said player did go out and do his job as well as help his team bring the winning trophy back to Boston. Without him in the mix, there would not have been a World Series win. I'd say he did put the team first, especially when he gathered them in the dugout for a pep talk.

    Not to mention, watching him interact with his son speaks volumes of his character.

    [/QUOTE]

    You mean that same player who stated in an interview that he "hopes he doesn't have to play with another jersey in 2015"? That is a far cry from the actions of Lester.

    True..without Ortiz there would not be a World Series ring..but the same could be said for most other players on the team...and most certainly the starting pitching. Without Lester there wouldn't be a World Series ring either..or Pedroia..or Naps...I could go on and on.

    I will agree with you that Ortiz is good at the emotional pep talks.. If only he would learn the art of "no comment" when speaking to the media I think most people would stop thinking of him as a petulant child.

    Speaking of chicken and beer..seems to be there was a decided lack of leadership in the Red Sox clubhouse that year. Pedey tried his best..but there were no emotional pep talks from Ortiz that year..no rallying of the team that year..even though leadership was sorely needed. I guess when Ortiz shut it down for the season he saw no reason to lead the team out of the bad place they were in.

    [/QUOTE]


    I may be wrong but wasn't Varitek the captain during the beer/chicken/video games season. Lester shut down the end of that season. I guess Varitek was the one that dropped the ball there and saw no reason to lead the team out of the bad place they were in.

    How many different times do you think Ortiz will be asked today about his contract? Doesn't that become monotonous after a while?

    Why does someone need to be told to use "no comment."  He is honest and forthright. Something that is hard to find now a days. Honesty is big in my book, some people just like to be BS-ed...or lied to I guess. One thing about Ortiz he is real, not a stuck up arrogant player.

     

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to slasher9's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to JIMMYPROFFER's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to crazy-world-of-troybrown's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The Tanaka contract jacked up the prices to all Good to Fair Starters. Sox better start 20 million at least. That will be a hometown discount.

    Teams really have to focus on getting their Minor Leagues into shape, especially the small market teams.

    [/QUOTE]

    Good to fair starters have been getting outlandish contracts well before Tanaka.

    [/QUOTE]

    Excellent point.

    AJ Burnett @ $69.5MM

    CC @ $182MM

    mussina @ $109MM

    pavano @ $38MM

    etc..etc...etc...etc....etc....etc....

    [/QUOTE]

    Lets not forget that some of those contracts you referenced are relatively old in terms of how fast player salaries have been rising.  

    Fangraphs calcuates a players value every year based on what similiar players make in FA.  Lester on average has been a 20.5 million dollar a year player the last 6 years.  

    he is one of the only pitchers in baseball who has averaged 31 starts and over 200 innings the last 6 years.

    and he has been even better in the playoffs.

    Anyone who thinks he is going to get significantly less than 20 million for a short duration is crazy.

    A discount may be 20 million a year for 4-5 years instead of a 5-7 year deal...or less than 20 million a year for a longer duration. 

    Lester has even eluded to the fact that a discount isn't going to be crazy cheap as he doesn't want to "set the market back" 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.



    Because a 30 year old pitcher is the same as a 38 year old DH. You realize that Lester could make more in this deal than Ortiz has made in his career? So I guess it is the same exact thing. You are so tiresome?

    [/QUOTE]


    it is not the same thing and if both players go to free agency, I will bank there will be a lot more interest in Lester.  Last I check both the AL and NL use pitchers, not the same for Ortiz's position.  Even with the al, the dh is not used primarily by one player on the majority of teams.

    Althought Ortiz's whining to the press works with John Henry, I am also willing to bet that some owners want nothing to do with it.

    [/QUOTE]

    You aren't even attempting to make a point here. This is so silly. The Lester extension is a much bigger deal than giving Ortiz another year at 12 million. Lester is still on pace with a home town discount to get an over 100 million dollar extension. You have an issue with Latin players that you have hinted too, but even you have to admit the Tomase piece has more to do with a reporter who in the past has become part of the story trying to find something juicey. Remember he was removed from the Pats beat because of inventing a story about Matt Welsh a day befoee the Super Bowl.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to steven11's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It is amazing how a few different words makes a huge difference in the way contract talks thru the media are viewed by the public.

    Instead of using the words "I'll walk", Jon Lester says he'll give a discount because he wants to remain a red sox.  Instead of implying there are other teams interested and he'll test the market, Lester tips his hand and says he does not like change.

    Instead of reminding us how much he has done for the sox, Lester tells us that he has to get to work to help the team and the contract talks will be left to the people he pays to do his work.

    I hope the sox do get to work and give Jon Lester a long term deal.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Because a 30 year old pitcher is the same as a 38 year old DH. You realize that Lester could make more in this deal than Ortiz has made in his career? So I guess it is the same exact thing. You are so tiresome?

     

    [/QUOTE]


    it is not the same thing and if both players go to free agency, I will bank there will be a lot more interest in Lester.  Last I check both the AL and NL use pitchers, not the same for Ortiz's position.  Even with the al, the dh is not used primarily by one player on the majority of teams.

    Althought Ortiz's whining to the press works with John Henry, I am also willing to bet that some owners want nothing to do with it.

    [/QUOTE]

    You aren't even attempting to make a point here. This is so silly. The Lester extension is a much bigger deal than giving Ortiz another year at 12 million. Lester is still on pace with a home town discount to get an over 100 million dollar extension. You have an issue with Latin players that you have hinted too, but even you have to admit the Tomase piece has more to do with a reporter who in the past has become part of the story trying to find something juicey. Remember he was removed from the Pats beat because of inventing a story about Matt Welsh a day befoee the Super Bowl.

    [/QUOTE]


    seriously, try staying on topic and away from what you think you know.  I was a huge fan of manny.  Mike Lowell is one of my all time favorite sox.  I tell a Mike Story all the time on how on a fowl ball he took a fan's cell phone and returned it after the inning. The only reason I got over losing Hanley was it brought Mike Lowell here.

    I have enjoyed Ortiz and look forward to seeing him this year and next.  I just think the sox should use the qualifying offer route.  Sorry if this offends you.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to slasher9's comment:

    In response to steven11's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    it is not the same thing and if both players go to free agency, I will bank there will be a lot more interest in Lester.  Last I check both the AL and NL use pitchers, not the same for Ortiz's position.  Even with the al, the dh is not used primarily by one player on the majority of teams.

    Althought Ortiz's whining to the press works with John Henry, I am also willing to bet that some owners want nothing to do with it.



    maybe he should opt out of his contract and have the Red Sox bid against nobody and give him a 10 year $300MM contract like your boy a-rod did.....

    talk about "some owners"....SMH.....

    [/QUOTE]


    arod is not my boy.  Check Ortiz's twitter account and his pictures with arod.  Arod is Ortiz's boy.

    Spending all that money on arod hasn't worked out the way they thought, has it?

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    In response to steven11's comment:

    I have enjoyed Ortiz and look forward to seeing him this year and next.  I just think the sox should use the qualifying offer route.  Sorry if this offends you.



    BS!!!

    You've b-tched and moaned about Ortiz for YEARS. Do we need to drag up the threads from last year regarding his achilles. Or from 2011 when you thought the Sox should dump him. Or the numerous mentions that he was on the juice. Come now jackbu, you aren't fooling anyone.

    All those comments about Ortiz slumps, or how he couldn't hit against lefties. The only thng you enjoy about Ortiz is when you can whine about him.

    Gimme a break. You enjoy Ortiz.....and I'm Beyonce.

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: A tale of two extensions

    On a side note, Fenway Park just got an extension.  John Henry said yesterday that Fenway should be around for another 30 years. We could possibly still be discussing then if Ortiz deserves an extension or if the sox should go the QO route.

     

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