ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    Lets be clear.  Whatever is going on with Alfredo, whether it be overblown much ado about nothing (most likely) or serious attitude issues, THE GUY CAN PITCH.  We want him in our bullpen.  If he is malcontent, its not like last year where EVERYONE was malcotent so Aceve's blowups were gasoline on fire.  If he can't tow the line, bury him at the end of the pen or move him. My guess is he won't be a problem at all.  

    I think it is crazy talk to consider dumping him just because of his hot-headedness.  That same hot-headedness is what makes him Nails on the mound.  Now that he can resume the flex role he was born to play (no more rotation psyche-out and emergency closer duty), he is of super value to the Red Sox.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    Lets be clear.  Whatever is going on with Alfredo, whether it be overblown much ado about nothing (most likely) or serious attitude issues, THE GUY CAN PITCH.  We want him in our bullpen.  If he is malcontent, its not like last year where EVERYONE was malcotent so Aceve's blowups were gasoline on fire.  If he can't tow the line, bury him at the end of the pen or move him. My guess is he won't be a problem at all.  

    I think it is crazy talk to consider dumping him just because of his hot-headedness.  That same hot-headedness is what makes him Nails on the mound.  Now that he can resume the flex role he was born to play (no more rotation psyche-out and emergency closer duty), he is of super value to the Red Sox.



    Exactly...

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    Lets be clear.  Whatever is going on with Alfredo, whether it be overblown much ado about nothing (most likely) or serious attitude issues, THE GUY CAN PITCH.  We want him in our bullpen.  If he is malcontent, its not like last year where EVERYONE was malcotent so Aceve's blowups were gasoline on fire.  If he can't tow the line, bury him at the end of the pen or move him. My guess is he won't be a problem at all.  

    I think it is crazy talk to consider dumping him just because of his hot-headedness.  That same hot-headedness is what makes him Nails on the mound.  Now that he can resume the flex role he was born to play (no more rotation psyche-out and emergency closer duty), he is of super value to the Red Sox.




    Couldn't have said it better myself. :-)

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to selenium-'s comment:

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    I have plenty of doubts.

    Farrell might have just said, "Kid, forget the media; you did nothing wrong."

     




    Then, why would Aceves apologize?

     

    I'm sorry, but that makes no sense.

     



    Because the media demands apologies for non-issues.

     

    His agent was looking for an extension... LOL

    Are you really saying that what he did recently was worth all this? Seriously?

     




    Possible, but highly unlikely Moon. The simple interpretation of the events is probably correct: Aceves misunderstood what was required and was corrected by Farrell. If he continues to misbehave then we will all know that he has a chip on his shoulder and needs to be disciplined.

     

     



    Since when does a misunderstanding ( if it was)  equal misbehaving. If you remove all of the speculation by the media, fans, and posters, then only Aceves knows if he was misbehaving or was testing Farrell. We will never know the answer.

     



    Exactly...all the rest is speculation.

    And, even if in his own mind, he was misbehaving, the event was very minor in nature and not worthy of all this bunk.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    Moon - why would his agent be talking to ben the next day? Why would farrell himself say that it was addressed? Its not like he never thrown batting practice before - he has hundreds of times and knows the drill...for whatever reason Aceves decided to not do it properly...its not a consipracy of the media - he was out of line and called on it...and he has been warned....trust me if another thing happens again with aceves, this incident will be referenced and used as a reason to cut him/suspend him....and for that reason it is significant...

    as far as trading him....i wouldnt right now but those of you claiming Aceves is an excellent pitcher - he wasnt last year - he was a 5plus era with a terrible record - he needs to get over himself a bit and just pitch hard for the new manager and keep his nose clean....

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!



    For the RECORD, Aceves was totally out of his element in the closer role, a role he was neither cut-out for or prepared for. You know this of course, but, much to DAD's dismay, you like to leave context at the door when you make your points.  In 2011 he was steadfast and could be counted on in the clutch.  My guess is no one is knocking because he is not available at the moment, because JF and the FO aren't as panicky and shaky as you are in your personnel assessments.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to SpacemanEephus's comment:

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

     

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!

     



    For the RECORD, Aceves was totally out of his element in the closer role, a role he was neither cut-out for or prepared for. You know this of course, but, much to DAD's dismay, you like to leave context at the door when you make your points.  In 2011 he was steadfast and could be counted on in the clutch.  My guess is no one is knocking because he is not available at the moment, because JF and the FO aren't as panicky and shaky as you are in your personnel assessments.

     

    Yes SPACEMAN, he certainly is out of his ELEMENT to the point where the rest of the team is saying it's time to go !!!

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to SpacemanEephus's comment:

     

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

     

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!

     



    For the RECORD, Aceves was totally out of his element in the closer role, a role he was neither cut-out for or prepared for. You know this of course, but, much to DAD's dismay, you like to leave context at the door when you make your points.  In 2011 he was steadfast and could be counted on in the clutch.  My guess is no one is knocking because he is not available at the moment, because JF and the FO aren't as panicky and shaky as you are in your personnel assessments.

     

     

    Yes SPACEMAN, he certainly is out of his ELEMENT to the point where the rest of the team is saying it's time to go !!!

     




    Really? You've got quotes from other players, saying that?


    Or, is it just you,...again.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

     

    In response to SpacemanEephus's comment:

     

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

     

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!

     



    For the RECORD, Aceves was totally out of his element in the closer role, a role he was neither cut-out for or prepared for. You know this of course, but, much to DAD's dismay, you like to leave context at the door when you make your points.  In 2011 he was steadfast and could be counted on in the clutch.  My guess is no one is knocking because he is not available at the moment, because JF and the FO aren't as panicky and shaky as you are in your personnel assessments.

     

     

    Yes SPACEMAN, he certainly is out of his ELEMENT to the point where the rest of the team is saying it's time to go !!!

     

     



    um ... rrrriiigghtt ... i forgot about how the rest of the team ... said that ... 

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    Good old Bill-806. Once he decides he doesn't like a player he never lets it go. Evidence be damned.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    Iguess we should have traded Manny after his second "incident". I guess we should have traded Papi the second time he failed to run to 1B.

    No second chances. No "give an inch".

    He picthed poorly last year in a role he never should have been forced in, so let's throw out his whole resume. Let's ignore the fact that this guy is a great mid/long relief pitcher. All that matters is that he clowned around a little bit early in ST. Sound great to me.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to georom4's comment:

    Moon - why would his agent be talking to ben the next day? Why would farrell himself say that it was addressed? Its not like he never thrown batting practice before - he has hundreds of times and knows the drill...for whatever reason Aceves decided to not do it properly...its not a consipracy of the media - he was out of line and called on it...and he has been warned....trust me if another thing happens again with aceves, this incident will be referenced and used as a reason to cut him/suspend him....and for that reason it is significant...

    as far as trading him....i wouldnt right now but those of you claiming Aceves is an excellent pitcher - he wasnt last year - he was a 5plus era with a terrible record - he needs to get over himself a bit and just pitch hard for the new manager and keep his nose clean....



    Pretty decent until mid-August.  Probably a combination of not having closed a full season before and Valentine abusing him.  8/28-9/1 he threw 143 pitches.  He had 3 appearances in 4 days, and threw 80 pitches.  80 PC over 4 days is pretty high for a closer.  But if that wasn't enough to wear him out, he made him go out the next day and throw 63 pitches.

    That's insane.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    Moon - why would his agent be talking to ben the next day? Why would farrell himself say that it was addressed? Its not like he never thrown batting practice before - he has hundreds of times and knows the drill...for whatever reason Aceves decided to not do it properly...its not a consipracy of the media - he was out of line and called on it...and he has been warned....trust me if another thing happens again with aceves, this incident will be referenced and used as a reason to cut him/suspend him....and for that reason it is significant...

    as far as trading him....i wouldnt right now but those of you claiming Aceves is an excellent pitcher - he wasnt last year - he was a 5plus era with a terrible record - he needs to get over himself a bit and just pitch hard for the new manager and keep his nose clean....

     



    Pretty decent until mid-August.  Probably a combination of not having closed a full season before and Valentine abusing him.  8/28-9/1 he threw 143 pitches.  He had 3 appearances in 4 days, and threw 80 pitches.  80 PC over 4 days is pretty high for a closer.  But if that wasn't enough to wear him out, he made him go out the next day and throw 63 pitches.

     

    That's insane.



    one of these days you're going to realize that the season ends in early october....he had a bad season and blew many games...Valentine gave him the chance of a lifetime and he failed...he has himself to blame and no one else

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!



    For the record Bill, until the whole team collapsed in Sept 2011 Aceves had an ERA of 2.83 with an OPSa of .615. I am discounting last year because he was put in a role he is not suited for. In 2010 he was hurt, but for the Yankees in 2009 his ERA for the whole year was 3.83. The fact is, he CAN pitch when he is placed in his proper role. He has proven that. At the risk of agreeing with 4B's I think it would be a mistake to trade this guy right now. Unless he becomes divisive and cannot be managed he should stay with the team. Good pitching is hard to get.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    Not everyone is well-suited for the closer role.

    The decision to move Bard to starter and Aceves to closer from roles that they had shown amazing success up to 2012 was even more absurd in light of the fact that we had just lost Papelbon.

    You rely too much on what a player did over the last year, last month, or even last 2-4 games in some cases. Yes, recent performance and trends does matter and may indicate what is to come, but larger recent sample sizes are much better at projecting future performance levels.

    He just turned 30 and has a 3.45 ERA and 1.10 WHIP as a releiver (.648 OPS against).

    Trading someone after a poor stretch is rarely a good plan, but in your quest to obtain a lily white choirboy clubhouse skill level is rendered near meaningless.

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    one of these days you're going to realize that the season ends in early october....he had a bad season and blew many games...Valentine gave him the chance of a lifetime and he failed...he has himself to blame and no one else

    How about this-how about you find one other closer that threw 143 pitches in 5 days, and then we can discuss it.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

     

    For the RECORD........  He had his share of failures last year.....  For those POSTERS that think his ability/value is more positive than his ability to self destruct, then I say ACEVES is not the person that J F will beable to count on in the clutch.......... If Ben can get any value for him, then he should......  Looks like MLB teams have enough HISTORY (Yanks & Sox) that no one is knocking too hard on the door !!!

     



    For the record Bill, until the whole team collapsed in Sept 2011 Aceves had an ERA of 2.83 with an OPSa of .615. I am discounting last year because he was put in a role he is not suited for. In 2010 he was hurt, but for the Yankees in 2009 his ERA for the whole year was 3.83. The fact is, he CAN pitch when he is placed in his proper role. He has proven that. At the risk of agreeing with 4B's I think it would be a mistake to trade this guy right now. Unless he becomes divisive and cannot be managed he should stay with the team. Good pitching is hard to get.

     



    What we really need, and kind of rare, is the Aceves of 2011 that could come in in the 5th inning of a 4-4 game, and shut the opposition down for 3 innings.  He had 7 wins in 2011 with 3+ innings of relief.  He had two saves of 3.2 IPs.  That's about 10% of our win total.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: ACEVES ??? As DAD would say............

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to kimsaysthis' comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    I'm beginning to see why more MLB players might not want to play in Boston. This hypercriticism is not productive or appropriate. It's absurdity that this issue is still being discussed as a reason to dump a player of his skill level or any skill level for that matter.

     




    I agree. But I'm also looking at it like there must be NOTHING else to talk about that they could put in a negative light. That's actually a positive if this is it.

     

     



    I see your point, but with someone as "touchy" as Aceves, I do not think all this hypersenitivity over a minor event is what he needs right now. It's not what anybody needs. I can understand why the media needs something to frenzy over (Yes, I used that word as a verb), but it doesn't mean us knowledgable posters have to take the bait and run with it.

     




    I also notice that the press seems to target the players that can offer the most to the Sox when they're "on". You sometimes have to wonder if they are sabotaging the team. They really don't seem to care about the effect they have on the team, especially over such a minor incident. I just don't understand why their stories always have to be negative stories. Shouldn't they just report sports news, and not always have to dig for nonsense?

     
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