AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In hindsight, I wish the Sox gave Salty a qualifying offer.  But all things considered this is more optimal than giving Salty a multi year deal. 

    [/QUOTE]

    If the Sox did, Salty would probably accept it.  14 millions dollars is too much compare to just 8.25 millions dollars contract (AJ's)

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In hindsight, I wish the Sox gave Salty a qualifying offer.  But all things considered this is more optimal than giving Salty a multi year deal. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Salty has a 2yr with 3rd option deal from Miami...Minn is said to possibly guarentee the 3rd year.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In hindsight, I wish the Sox gave Salty a qualifying offer.  But all things considered this is more optimal than giving Salty a multi year deal. 

    [/QUOTE]

         Salty would have jumped at a qo.

         That is why it wasn't offered.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    I highly doubt that a few games in the world series tipped the scale with Salty.  I think the Sox organization knew Salty was run down.  Catchers don't play as much as the other 7 on the diamond.  Actually on 10 catchers in all of baseball last year had enough plate appearences to qualify.  When Ross went down the Sox turned to Salty everyday and it really took it's toll on him.

    The Sox don't like Salty because his offense is subpar, and perhaps fringe average for a catcher, his defense is not that great, and he is horrible in controlling the running game. 

    Could Salty be more valuable than AJP next year? I think there is a very good chance he is, but A he will be paid more and B he's going to get a multi year deal.

    We effectively would be left with a bad catcher blocking our prospects in a few years.  

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    for a ONE YEAR contract, I would pay 6 million dollars more for Saltalamacchia, and don't be too sure he would accept it.  There are still teams looking for help behind the dish and the options are very thin. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I also have a tough time supporting any grown man who still uses initials for his first name (JD, CC, etc).....

    [/QUOTE]

    Ok, A. M.

    [/QUOTE]


    I don't call myself AM though, and no one I know does either......big difference.......

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    The Sox don't like Salty because his offense is subpar, and perhaps fringe average for a catcher, his defense is not that great, and he is horrible in controlling the running game. 

     

    He is a top 10 to 11 offensive catcher over the last year, 2 years combined or 3 years combined.

    2013:

    9th in catcher WAR out of all catchers with 400 PAs.

    6th in catcher OPS at .804.

     

     

    League OPS at catcher:

    2013: .698

    2012: .717

    2011: .704

     

    2012-2013:

    10th in OPS at .774

     

    2011-2013:

    11th in OPS at catcher OPS at .763

     

    Here's the breakdown pitcher by pitcher:  CERA/OPS against (innings)

                             AJ  P                G Soto

    Holland  3.44/ .702  (173)     3.35/ .751  (40)

    Darvish   2.80/.600  (112)      2.87/.623  (97)

    Perez      3.91/.722  (78)        3.13/ .739 (46)

    Ogando   3.13/.685 (86)        3.00/ .717 (12)

    Tepesch    4.61/ .718 (57)      5.64/.867 (30)

    Grimm      7.49/ .935 (52)     5.28/ .838 (31)

    Scheppers  1.33/.558 (54)   3.00/.755 (21)

    Nathan      1.29/.450  (49)   1.80/.534  (15)

    R Ross       3.32/.746 (43)   2.37/.523 (19)

    Frasor       2.35/.610 (38)   3.38/ .553 (11)

    Cotts         1.06/.524 (42)   0.61/.421 (15)

     

    1) Comparing AJ to Soto does not tell us much, unless we know how good Soto is regarded as a staff-handler.:

    2) The numbers: (many are very close)

        CERA  AJ 5  Soto 6

        OPS    AJ 7  Soto 4

    3) Some sample sizes are lopsided.

     

    Looks pretty even with Soto.

     

     

     

     

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I also have a tough time supporting any grown man who still uses initials for his first name (JD, CC, etc).....

    [/QUOTE]

    Ok, A. M.

    [/QUOTE]


    I don't call myself AM though, and no one I know does either......big difference.......

    [/QUOTE]

    It was a joke, AM.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The Sox don't like Salty because his offense is subpar, and perhaps fringe average for a catcher, his defense is not that great, and he is horrible in controlling the running game. 

     

    He is a top 10 to 11 offensive catcher over the last year, 2 years combined or 3 years combined.

    2013:

    9th in catcher WAR out of all catchers with 400 PAs.

    6th in catcher OPS at .804.

     

     

    League OPS at catcher:

    2013: .698

    2012: .717

    2011: .704

     

    2012-2013:

    10th in OPS at .774

     

    2011-2013:

    11th in OPS at catcher OPS at .763

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    see but that's the thing, how many catchers even reach 400 PA? practically half of most other positions.  Salty's only real strength is his durability. 

    I'm not saying Salty isn't good, he's just in no way worth a multi year deal.  I wouldn't mind the overpay on a one year however, which is why I didn't mind the Q.O.  Because I thnk he's a better option for one year than A.J. is....but that's history. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I also have a tough time supporting any grown man who still uses initials for his first name (JD, CC, etc).....

    [/QUOTE]

    Ok, A. M.

    [/QUOTE]


    I don't call myself AM though, and no one I know does either......big difference.......

    [/QUOTE]

    It was a joke, AM.

    [/QUOTE]

    I get it.  No worries on my end.  I just wanted to make it clear to some of our less coherent participants.....

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    14 mil for Salty would be too much.  On the other hand, he would had been the first and only player to ever accept a QO so who knows


    Salty needs more days off during the season.  He gets way too sluggish at the end.  Mgt should had recognized that and protected him more.  That was the entire point of the Ross signing, I thought....

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

     

          A closer look at the Pierzynski deal Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff   December 3, 2013 02:41 PM   By Peter Abraham, Globe Staff

    Let's be honest, the public image of new Red Sox catcher A.J. Pierzynski is that he's a pain in the butt. He has tangled with teammates and opponents over the course of his 16-year career and built a reputation for being irksome.

    Pierzynski throws his helmet, he curses, and he talks trash. He is known to be an avid fan of pro wrestling and he enjoys playing the heel. In the oh-so-sensitive world of baseball, Pierzynski makes waves.

    It won't take you long to find YouTube.clips of him brawling or the poll from Men's Journal in 2012 that named him the most hated player in baseball.

    But that's a simple-minded approach. The guess is that the Red Sox looked well beyond Google in assessing whether Pierzynski would fit into their clubhouse.

    Pierzynski played five years with David Ortiz when both were with the Twins and is a player Ortiz has long spoken highly of as a teammate.

    Jake Peavy and Koji Uehara also played with Pierzynski. Peavy, in fact, once had a little dust-up in 2011. You can be sure the Red Sox checked in with Peavy on this.

    Red Sox pitching coach Juan Nieves was with the White Sox for five years as bullpen coach when Pierzynski was their primary catcher. He offered a strong recommendation, according to insiders.

    Nieves wields considerable influence in the Red Sox' decision-making process, something that was evident in the deals for Matt Thornton and Peavy. There is little chance the Red Sox would have signed a catcher their pitching coach thought was a bad guy.

    The Red Sox just won the World Series and have a team of veterans, including tone-setters like Ortiz and Dustin Pedroia. In John Farrell, they also have an authoritative manager with a low threshold for nonsense. Pierzynski's personality likely won't be an issue, and if it becomes one, it'll be settled quickly.

    Pierzynski has a reputation for intelligence, durability, playing hard, and playing to win. That sounds a lot like the players Ben Cherington gathered up last winter.

    The bigger story here is the signal Cherington is sending. In refusing to sign Jarrod Saltalamacchia for three seasons, the general manager is showing faith in a farm system that is making a significant impact on the franchise.

    In Pierzynski and David Ross, the Red Sox will start next season with two 37-year-old catchers signed for one year. For 23-year-old Christian Vazquez, 27-year-old Dan Butler, and 21-year-old Blake Swihart, opportunity is their Christmas gift. The Red Sox clearly believe Vazquez can become their catcher by 2015.

    For 26-year-old Ryan Lavarnway, however, it's another roadblock. He has little left to prove in Triple A and seemingly no place on the major league roster. The Sox should do Lavarnway a favor and trade him. But he could linger as insurance.

    The next step for the Red Sox should be the return of Mike Napoli. Now that they're set at catcher, more moves are coming.

     
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    for a ONE YEAR contract, I would pay 6 million dollars more for Saltalamacchia, and don't be too sure he would accept it.  There are still teams looking for help behind the dish and the options are very thin. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Salty cant throw out base stealer which that is why Boston refuse to give him the money that he is demanding now!!   If Salty want to return to Boston, just take 8 mm dollars a year contract.   That is how much he is worth now.  

    Remember V-Mart wanted to return to Boston, but Boston refused to give him a big fat contract cuz he stunk as a catcher.  Then the Tigers swooped in and give him a big fat 4 years contract for at least 12 mm dollars a year.  Now Tigers regretted it!!

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to GoUconn13's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    for a ONE YEAR contract, I would pay 6 million dollars more for Saltalamacchia, and don't be too sure he would accept it.  There are still teams looking for help behind the dish and the options are very thin. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Salty cant throw out base stealer which that is why Boston refuse to give him the money that he is demanding now!!   If Salty want to return to Boston, just take 8 mm dollars a year contract.   That is how much he is worth now.  

    Remember V-Mart wanted to return to Boston, but Boston refused to give him a big fat contract cuz he stunk as a catcher.  Then the Tigers swooped in and give him a big fat 4 years contract for at least 12 mm dollars a year.  Now Tigers regretted it!!

    [/QUOTE]

            That's all Salty is worth.

           I don't see any team offering more than 8M per.

           I'am not sad to see him go at all.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to GoUconn13's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    for a ONE YEAR contract, I would pay 6 million dollars more for Saltalamacchia, and don't be too sure he would accept it.  There are still teams looking for help behind the dish and the options are very thin. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Salty cant throw out base stealer which that is why Boston refuse to give him the money that he is demanding now!!   If Salty want to return to Boston, just take 8 mm dollars a year contract.   That is how much he is worth now.  

    Remember V-Mart wanted to return to Boston, but Boston refused to give him a big fat contract cuz he stunk as a catcher.  Then the Tigers swooped in and give him a big fat 4 years contract for at least 12 mm dollars a year.  Now Tigers regretted it!!

    [/QUOTE]

    All I'm saying is worst case scenario if The Sox offered Salty a Q.O. and he accepted is that he accepts and they pay 6 million more a year for a catcher.  Yes that is a gross overpay...but remember it's a ONE year overpay, the premium you pay is the flexibility it provides.  A.J. is not that much better defensively than salty, CS% numbers can vary from year to year and also the pitching staff can weight heavily on those numbers.  When it comes down to it AJ has 2% edge on Salty.

    The thing is AJ can fall apart any year, for all we know he could be a none factor next year, the chance for stability is much much stronger in Salty.  When it's all said in done both options would leave the Sox on the hook for $0 in 2015. 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    given the situation we are in, I'm much happier with AJ for one year than Salty for multi years....but I wouldn't have minded paying Salty a few million more for a ONE year contract, and I think there was a deccent chance he would have turned the Q.O. down.....especially the way this years market has shaped up. (still in progress with effectively no options now)

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    I liked him on the pregame stuff.

    1 year is perfect.  Coming off a WS win Ben is playing with house $$$ and easily gets a pass for this year.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    Last year, I basically agreed with every free agent signing. So I am not a BC basher. However, I disagree with this move. I would have traded for Hanigan or another catcher or signed a vet free agent for a million as insurance[Susuki?] and likely gone wiith a young catcher.

    Instead we signed A.J. for 8.25. Urp. Lets start with the negatives.

    He is the worst pitch taker in ALL of baseball. One of our secret or not so secret weapons of wearing down a pitching staff may have single handidly been ended by the addition of A.J. He was dead last in this stat and awful his entire career. The difference between Salty and him will make a dramatic difference in a negative way. I hate this fact about A.J.

    He is a lefty pull hitter. People mention his .322 BA in Fenway, but leave out his ZERO HR's. Don't expect 17 homers from A.J., expect 10 or less.

    He is old and getting worse. I would project a OPS just under 700.

    His defensive stats are very dubious. Bad thrower. Bad pitch framer the last 2 seasons. Bad DRS the last 5 seasons.

    Money. 8.25 takes up a huge chunk of our allotted money. A trade would have saved a bunch of money. Its a sting to the AAV.

    Bad move.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    But not a terrible deal.

     

    I like that its just 1 year. If he stinks or Vasquez is ready, we just replace him.

    He is a lefty and I wanted a lefty. Although his splits are not as dramatic as I prefer.

    He is a veteran who knows how to catch. He is smart. He can teach our younger catchers the art of catching, which I mentioned a while back.

    He is considered a very good game caller. His CERA's are respectable. This is the only reason I have hope. The difference in game calling between him and Salty could be extreme and the main reason for why he is on the team and Salty is not.

    Oh well, hopefully he has one year left in him and calls a great game. Welcome to the team.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxDOrtiz. Show RedSoxDOrtiz's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to J-BAY's comment:

     

     

         

    Red Sox pitching coach Juan Nieves was with the White Sox for five years as bullpen coach when Pierzynski was their primary catcher. He offered a strong recommendation, according to insiders.

    Nieves wields considerable influence in the Red Sox' decision-making process, something that was evident in the deals for Matt Thornton and Peavy. There is little chance the Red Sox would have signed a catcher their pitching coach thought was a bad guy.

     




     

    This is all you really have to know.  Our pitching coach worked with AJ for five years.  He knows that AJ knows how to do the one job that a catcher should do above all others... call a proper game.  Our team clung onto Tek for years after he was done because of his ability to call a decent game.  He was never great at throwing out guys, but hell could he call a good game. 

    Projections are misleading here:

    AJ Pierzynski:

    ZIPS - .267./.297/.430 2.3 WAR

    STEAMER - .265/.302/.411 2.1 WAR

     

    Jarrod Saltalamacchia:

    ZIPS - .236/.301/.428 1.9 WAR

    STEAMER - .230/.301/.414 2.9 WAR

     

    A lot of the WAR differences are due to projected playing time. The projection systems have them as almost identical players with the bat if given the same number of at bats.  STEAMER has Salty with 152 more at bats, so he naturally can get more WAR... but if that projected number of bats is even then we get even WAR for the amount of at bats.  Salty projects better on STEAMER only because WAR is a cumulative stat and they projected Salty with 150 more PA. 

    Combine this with a projected game planning/calling upgrade and you have a better catcher for next year for half the annual salary and three to four times as short of a deal.  Sox look at not just offense... but they have a pitching background With Farrell and Nieves with the inside scoop... so they look beyond throwing guys out as a defensive metric.  This has to be an emphasis when the Sox look at catchers in today's game and has to be part of the equation. 

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    A.J. Pierzynski is a strong pickup on a one-year deal, but I'm somewhat surprised in light of luxury tax concerns that the Red Sox committed $8.25 million of the 2014 payroll at catcher when other holes remain.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Marioguy424. Show Marioguy424's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

     Crap.

     

    ...Crap.

     


    They spend the entire year talking about good clubhouse chemistry and this is who they pick up to replace Salty?

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    In response to hill55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    A.J. Pierzynski is a strong pickup on a one-year deal, but I'm somewhat surprised in light of luxury tax concerns that the Red Sox committed $8.25 million of the 2014 payroll at catcher when other holes remain.

    [/QUOTE]

    They still have about 24 million left.  Like many people I think they will increase that by trading Dempster or Peavy.

    Ben has got the numbers crunched, I'm pretty sure about that.

     

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxDOrtiz. Show RedSoxDOrtiz's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    During our tank year with the Punto trade, the team ERA was horrible with Salty and Lava and we couldn't throw out a base runner.  Every starter on the team has a better ERA when pitching to David Ross than they do to Salty

    When Ross went on the DL last year, so did Jon Lester's ability to pitch last season.  When Ross came back and a start was skipped, it was like magic catching fairy dust was sprinkled into his game for the rest of the season. 

    AJ had the fifth best CERA (Catchers ERA) last year in the league, so the dude can call a game:

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_/position/c/sort/catcherERA/order/false

    On the Red Sox, Ross had a 0.71 point lower CERA than Salty:

     

    3.17  Ross with same staff vs. Salty's 3.88

    Ross has never had a negative DWAR (defensive wins) career 4.06 CERA

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/5206/type/fielding/david-ross

    AJ has never had a negative DWAR career 4.11 CERA

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/3948/aj-pierzynski

    Salty has a negative to even DWAR yearly; career 4.49 CERA

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/28663/type/fielding/jarrod-saltalamacchia

     

    We already have Salty on the roster, but his name is Lavarnway and costs a heck of a lot less.

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/31039/type/fielding/ryan-lavarnway

    -.2 DWAR and 5.32 CERA for his career (4.56 CERA last year)

     

    I'm sure the Sox considered the offensive downgrade we are getting next year and came up with some creative accounting on how to improve the team.  If a catcher gives up an average of .71 runs per game over his direct comparison on the same staff, then if they find a player who comes close to the former... they can prevent an extra 85 runs next year.  That is calculated by taking the roughly 120 starts Salty had and project Ross into that equation.

    It is an equation to them and all they want to do is balance the equation.  If runs go down and we can't improve there, then how do we improve preventing runs?  If we go from Ells to Bradley we are decreasing offense, period.  If we go from Salty to AJ, we improve pitching and defense.  They do not have as much of a tangible and easy to measure statistic as hitting, but if I can figure this out from my couch... I'm sure the Sox could figure this out and is why they wanted no part of Salty. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxDOrtiz. Show RedSoxDOrtiz's posts

    Re: AJ Pierzynski agreed to deal with the Red Sox

    Very telling stats from SOSH comparing AJ to Salty's hitting

    http://sonsofsamhorn.net/topic/80801-aj-pierzynski-signs-with-red-sox/page-2

    Salty's contact rate is sub-70's. A.J's has always been mid-high 80's.

    Salty's career K% is 29.4% versus A.J.'s 11.5%. 

    Salty's BABIP was .373 in 2013. Despite that being a soft metric, that's not likely sustainable. A.J's was closer to his career numbers which may indicate his performance is.

     

    Salty's closer to J.P. Arencibia than Pierzynski as a hitter. Raw-boned power with lots of flailing at the plate. I'm not disagreeing, but am saying that AJ isn't a Salty clone at all.

     

    http://sonsofsamhorn.net/topic/80801-aj-pierzynski-signs-with-red-sox/page-3

    I don't know if Salty only hits lousy pitching, but he does seem like a guy who is relatively easy to pitch to in big spots- and the starts sort of bear that out. 

     

    In high leverage spots, he's had a 637 OPS in his career (with a 8% BB rate, and 34% K rate). Medium lev is 753 (8%, 27%), low lev at 770 (9%, 29%).

     

    Conversely, AJP has a 799 OPS In high lev situations (6% BB, 12% K), 742 in medium lev (2%, 10%), and 733 in low lev (4%, 12%).

     

    ...

     

     

    I'll go one step further. In 2013:

     

    Salty

    vs. teams .500 or worse: 331/407/549/956

    vs. teams .500 or better: 232/288/408/696

     

     

     
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