Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    04, C-Varitek (trade) 1b-Millar (free agent) 2b-Bellhorn (free agent) 3b-Mueller (free agent) SS-Cabrera (trade) LF-Manny (free agent) CF-Damon (free agent) RF-Nixon...homegrown!!! SP-Schilling (trade), Pedro (free agent), Wakefield (free agent scrapheap),  Lowe (trade), Foulke (closer, free agent), Timlin (free agent), Embree (trade?). get the point, people?
    Posted by dannycater


    There is the reason why the pirates and padres usually stink.  I dont get why so many posters want us to adopt their model.  Actually, I do get why.  Its because everyone wants to find "the next big thing."

    There is an extremely strong correlation between payroll and success.  Im not saying have a team full of hired guns, but we have competitive advantages as a big market team.  Because of that, we dont have to follow the pirates model.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    Trot Nixon, the pride of the homegrown of 2004...
    2007? Papelbon, Pedroia, Lester, Youks, Ellsbury
    but let's add some more hired guns,
    Dice-K! Drew! Coco! Lugo! Lowell! Beckett!....
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    here's what I think of homegrown? You got weed? There, you go.
     
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    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : 1 more arb year according to B-R. 
    Posted by Chilliwings



    thanks for the info.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    04, C-Varitek (trade) 1b-Millar (free agent) 2b-Bellhorn (free agent) 3b-Mueller (free agent) SS-Cabrera (trade) LF-Manny (free agent) CF-Damon (free agent) RF-Nixon...homegrown!!! SP-Schilling (trade), Pedro (free agent), Wakefield (free agent scrapheap),  Lowe (trade), Foulke (closer, free agent), Timlin (free agent), Embree (trade?). get the point, people?
    Posted by dannycater


    Pedro was a trade.

    Is the point that Theo inherited better talent than he left?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    Breslow....nice pick-up. He has a degree in molecular biophysics and biochemistry from Yale.  I think some of you guys can appreciate that we're not dealing with the village idiot here. I'm impressed even if he doesn't pitch well...LOL If he's pitching and Lavarnway is catching, it would be a battery of two Yale graduates...one for the record books, I'd think. Drewski, he's one your guys..'wink'.
    Posted by ampoule

    Here is a list of the 23 Yalies who have played in the majors:

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/schools/index.cgi?key_school=e7bc8c34
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    04, C-Varitek (trade) 1b-Millar (free agent) 2b-Bellhorn (free agent) 3b-Mueller (free agent) SS-Cabrera (trade) LF-Manny (free agent) CF-Damon (free agent) RF-Nixon...homegrown!!! SP-Schilling (trade), Pedro (free agent), Wakefield (free agent scrapheap),  Lowe (trade), Foulke (closer, free agent), Timlin (free agent), Embree (trade?). get the point, people?
    Posted by dannycater


    Not quite...........

    Schilling was HOMEGROWN!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Lowe and Tek were acquired before they had any real ML games (Tek none, Lowe a few I believe)

    Pedro and Cabrera and Minky don't get acquired w/o Sox giving up home grown talent/prospects

    Wakefield may as well been considered Homegrown given, as you pointed out, he was put out to pasture and made a free agent...ditto on Ortiz

    Ellis Burks and Lenny DiNardo were also home grown guys on the 2004 team.
     
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    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    I love how people are on here saying that forum members want a "splash".  In my experience, its the opposite.  It seems like everybody only wants to find the "next big thing", and is more concerned with with how many home grown players we have than how many games we win. Most posters are so in love with youth that they fall in love with every player in our farm system, even though less than 10% are going to pan out.  Me?  I say use EVERY AVENUE to field the best team possible.  Trades, free agents, draft.  Not just the draft, like most posters. Winning /> having a cheap team of home grown players.
    Posted by Drewski5


    Spot on.  I've been saying this all along.  I don't even care if we are buying or selling.  I just want to get back more than I gave up.

    Way too many people think that GMs are going to swoop in with a masterful move, and get a star for next to nothing.

    What happens half the time is they get snookered.

    Last year, everyone wanted Pence.  Philly got him for 2 top-50 prospects and an RP prospect.  This year, they got about half that back,

    Last year, SF gave up the #22 prospect for Beltran, and then proceeded to miss the playoffs.

    Last year, CL gave up their two best prospects for Jimine, who not only clogs up the payroll, but is also 12-14 with an ERA> 5.00.

    Yet everyone was screaming last year that they wanted Pence, Beltran abd Jimines.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : Pedro was a trade. Is the point that Theo inherited better talent than he left?
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards


    The point was that big $$ free agents and big $$ players, acquired via trades, were a large part of both 2004 and 2007.  Therefore , these types of moves should not be "avoided at all costs" (albeit they are very risky).
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : Pedro was a trade. Is the point that Theo inherited better talent than he left?
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards


    The point was that big $$ free agents and big $$ players, acquired via trades, were a large part of both 2004 and 2007.  Therefore , these types of moves should not be "avoided at all costs" (albeit they are very risky).
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : then how is the guy pushed out of our rotation?  and we are talking about a rotation that only has 2 reliable starers (1 if you include the entire season)....what does that say about us right now? 
    Posted by andrewmitch


    Franklin Morales has never pitched 100 innings in a season.  They need to be careful with this guy.  I can only imagine if the Sox ever did something like Washington may do, which is shut down Strasburg at some point despite being in first place.  They would burn Fenway to the ground.   
     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from cpjohn1. Show cpjohn1's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    Welcome back Breslow!  I don't know Breslow myself, but he is a friend of a friend of mine.  My friend is excited that he's back in Boston.
     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : Franklin Morales has never pitched 100 innings in a season.  They need to be careful with this guy.  I can only imagine if the Sox ever did something like Washington may do, which is shut down Strasburg at some point despite being in first place.  They would burn Fenway to the ground.   
    Posted by jasko2248



    I got to tell you, eddie jask, I had to re-read this about 100 times before I posted a response. ARE YOU F-ING KIDDING ME? IF THE WORRY IS A GUY HITTING 100 INNINGS, THEN I DON'T WANT TO RELY ON THAT PITCHER. WHY NOT PUT A 75-INNING LIMIT ON ACEVES....No Fenway would not burn to the ground because Morales "over-threw"....Apparently coddling players has now been bought by fans.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : I got to tell you, eddie jask, I had to re-read this about 100 times before I posted a response. ARE YOU F-ING KIDDING ME? IF THE WORRY IS A GUY HITTING 100 INNINGS, THEN I DON'T WANT TO RELY ON THAT PITCHER. WHY NOT PUT A 75-INNING LIMIT ON ACEVES....No Fenway would not burn to the ground because Morales "over-threw"....Apparently coddling players has now been bought by fans.
    Posted by dannycater


    There was an article in Sports Illustrated this off-season (Verducci I think) that was all about young pitchers increasing more than 40 innings a year and how the risk of injury and/or decline for young pitchers who do this is around 75%.  So there is actually strong evidence that large inning increases for young pitchers are a bad idea and therefore, whether fans like it or not, it is likely in both the teams and players best interest to proceed cautiously.

    A couple of the guys who I can remember who were on the watch list for this year were Pineda (out for year) and Holland ( significant decline).

    Morales is a slightly different story because he is 26, the research is on 25 and younger and he started a lot in the minors but minor league innings are not considered as "high stress" as ML innings.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : I got to tell you, eddie jask, I had to re-read this about 100 times before I posted a response. ARE YOU F-ING KIDDING ME? IF THE WORRY IS A GUY HITTING 100 INNINGS, THEN I DON'T WANT TO RELY ON THAT PITCHER. WHY NOT PUT A 75-INNING LIMIT ON ACEVES....No Fenway would not burn to the ground because Morales "over-threw"....Apparently coddling players has now been bought by fans.
    Posted by dannycater


    Wow, you read it 100 times, yet you still didn't get it. I never said "the worry was Morales hitting 100 innings." I said, "he's never pitched 100 innings before, so they need to be careful with him." That was all.  I understood why they have been careful with him.  He may have had some fatigue as well.  There was a reason they pulled him from the rotation when he was pitching well, and it wasn't because they were trying to lose games or p*ss off the fans.  Do you understand now? 

    As for the other point, I was clearly saying that if Boston was in 1st place (like Washington) and decided to shut down a young superstar pitcher (like Strasburg), as a precaution, the fans would freak.  That part of it had nothing to do with Morales. 
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : Wow, you read it 100 times, yet you still didn't get it. I never said "the worry was Morales hitting 100 innings." I said, "he's never pitched 100 innings before, so they need to be careful with him." That was all.  I understood why they have been careful with him.  He may have had some fatigue as well.  There was a reason they pulled him from the rotation when he was pitching well, and it wasn't because they were trying to lose games or p*ss off the fans.  Do you understand now?  As for the other point, I was clearly saying that if Boston was in 1st place (like Washington) and decided to shut down a young superstar pitcher (like Strasburg), as a precaution, the fans would freak.  That part of it had nothing to do with Morales. 
    Posted by jasko2248


    I can't find the link to it but the Sports Illustrated story showed strong evidence that increasing young pitchers work loads by over 40 IP is a bad idea. 

    Another example was Clay, who jumped 80 IP from 2009 to 2010 and then broke down last year and virtually the same thing happened to Hughes. 
     
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    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : I can't find the link to it but the Sports Illustrated story showed strong evidence that increasing young pitchers work loads by over 40 IP is a bad idea.  Another example was Clay, who jumped 80 IP from 2009 to 2010 and then broke down last year. 
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards


    That's all I was trying to point out, Tmac.  Morales has terrific stuff.  The knock on him was was always control issues.  He seems to have harnessed his control and could have a nice career ahead of him, so I can understand why they are a little cautious at this point. 
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!:
    In Response to Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn! : That's all I was trying to point out, Tmac.  Morales has terrific stuff.  The knock on him was was always control issues.  He seems to have harnessed his control and could have a nice career ahead of him, so I can understand why they are a little cautious at this point. 
    Posted by jasko2248


    They'd be foolish not to be cautious.  Morales has had some higher IP numbers in the minors, so maybe than mitigates some of the risk but considering the last 2 years he has thrown around 50 IP, going over 100 seems risky.  I'd rather have him for 150+ next year.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    The Breslow deal is a very good pickup.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter55. Show parhunter55's posts

    Re: Albers and Posednick for Craig Breslow. Ben's Big Move. Yawn!

    I think you also have to add to the equation that Albers looked very good at this point in the season last year, and then became part of the problem, along with Bard and Papelbon, as August (and especially September) rolled along.  The Sox bullpen was as putrid as their starters during the collapse as I remember it.  I would not be surprised, as much as I like the movement on Albers's stuff, to see his statistics become quite pedestrian the rest of the way. 

    Breslow, on the other hand, has been pretty consistent, with a low WHIP except in 2 of his 7 seasons.  Based on that, I like the odds of Breslow being the more effective pitcher over the last two months of the season.
     
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