And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Why was he pulled? Perhaps for the same reason he was pulled after a 1-2-3 13-pitch 7th frame in his prior outing.

    That move didn't turn out so well either.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimdavis. Show jimdavis's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???:
    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because??? : It's also called winning "In Spite of Francona".
    Posted by BOSOX1941


    Mr. 20/20 hindsight can never be wrong.  Must be a nice position to be in.  You never have to make a real decision just b!tch and moan after the fact.  Wake gives up a bloop and a blast, you would whine about that.  Either way you would complain.  You are lame.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BOSOX1941. Show BOSOX1941's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???:
    Why was he pulled? Perhaps for the same reason he was pulled after a 1-2-3 13-pitch 7th frame in his prior outing. That   move didn't turn out so well either.
    Posted by harness


    You are correct, and some of us questioned that move also.
    Just two glaring poor judgement moves by Francona involving Wake.
    A couple more with Beckett and 1 or 2 with Lackey, a big one with Bard. I'd guess he's made a minimum of TEN questionable moves this year, and they've played 27 games.  162 divided by 27 = six. 6 times 10(questionable moves) = 60 games that he'll negatively affect. Many of those games, much like today's game, will be won "In Spite of Francona".  Yell
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???:
    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because??? : You are correct, and some of us questioned that move also. Just two glaring poor judgement moves by Francona involving Wake. A couple more with Beckett and 1 or 2 with Lackey, a big one with Bard. I'd guess he's made a minimum of TEN questionable moves this year, and they've played 27 games.  162 divided by 27 = six. 6 times 10(questionable moves) = 60 games that he'll negatively affect. Many of those games, much like today's game, will be won "In Spite of Francona". 
    Posted by BOSOX1941


    The large majority of people who posted about it agreed with the move to replace Wakefield with Bard.  Go check the thread.  Needless to say a lot of this stuff is a matter of opinion and we all like to armchair-manage.   
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from crix. Show crix's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    The bigger question is, why bring Gagne... oops, I mean Jenks in the game in any close game situation whatsoever anymore? 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxfanwest. Show soxfanwest's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    The issue with Wakefield has never been his arm. Let's face it, Throwing knuckleballs is not taxing to a shoulder. But wakefield has had previous issues with his back. I'm not saying that something happen today to cause Tito to use a quick hook,but it's something to consider. It's a long season, Wakefields not a kid anymore.  Also Jimfromflorida, makes a good point as usual.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    the only bad decision today was keeping Jenks in to implode...the quick hook on wake was OK - why press your luck?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    It's obvious to more and more each day this guy ain't cuttin it. He takes out wake after 1 hit and 75 pitches brings in a pitcher who hasn't had a good outing since??? and people are saying it's reasonable? Give me a break. It is becoming more clear each day this acting manager is not cut out for the job. Call it armchair or whatever you want the results are speaking for themselves and you all know who you are.


    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???:
    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because??? : You are correct, and some of us questioned that move also. Just two glaring poor judgement moves by Francona involving Wake. A couple more with Beckett and 1 or 2 with Lackey, a big one with Bard. I'd guess he's made a minimum of TEN questionable moves this year, and they've played 27 games.  162 divided by 27 = six. 6 times 10(questionable moves) = 60 games that he'll negatively affect. Many of those games, much like today's game, will be won "In Spite of Francona". 
    Posted by BOSOX1941

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Is this really a mystery? Wake had been pitching relief all season. Most pitches were 64; second most were 27. I have no problem with Francona removing Wakefield when he did. My problem is going with Jenks and sticking with him throughout the inning as he blew a two-run lead.

    Removing Wake after 76 pitches was a fairly obvious call. Why Tito didn't go with Albers I have no idea.


     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    I agree with LLoyd.

    I guess he coul have let him finish the inning, but Albers has beelooking good. He should have gotten the nod. He's a 2+ inning guy anyways.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Kat-b2. Show Kat-b2's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Francoma doesn't mind leaving Josh in for 125 or so pitches.  This guy needs to go . We have a good team now and all we need is a great manager. He can't make a good decision without  John F. there. So get rid of him.  Wake could have gone 8 ininings and saved his bullpen. What a dumb a--... 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from fizsh. Show fizsh's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Again I ask, did the Sox announcers have a problem with the move?  I trust guys who have been there and understand major league baseball players because of this.  Mike Blowers on the Mariner's broadcast understood why Wakefield was taken out.  Even though he throws a knuckleball, it is still taxing and he can still get tired.  You guys act like it is nothing to pitch in the major leauges!  When was the last time you did that?  How do you know he could have gone 8 innings when he hadn't gone more than 3 1/3 all year?  There is a reason ALL TEAMS slowly work their starters in spring training to get them up to 90-100 pitches.  Having an opinion is one thing.  Acting like you know exactly what goes on in a major league dugout is another. 

    Another thing, the Sox won!  I was going to say enjoy it, but you have the right to be miserable about it if you like.  I, on the other hand, WILL enjoy that and the entire season.  Like I said a few days ago, a 7-4 homestand would get them over .500 and on their way.  Going 3-1 in each of their next two series can still do that.  And guess what, if they don't, the world will continue (until May 21 anyway, but that is another story) and I will continue to watch the Sox.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Again, Beckett has been starting all season and is averaging 105 pitches per outing. Wakefield had been throwing in relief and was averaging 22 pitches per outing.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from billsrul. Show billsrul's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    I don't see a problem with Wake being pulled.  If he's gonna be a starter, he'll need to be stretched out before he can be used more.  I think he was trying to get wake through the 6th.  However, once Wake gave up a single, it was time.  Langerhans has some speed, so he likely would have been on 2nd a couple pitches into the AB.  Therefore it seemed like a good decision to go to Jenks who is also good at holding runners on.  However, April has been a tough month for the "best" relievers in this bullpen (save Papelbon).  I'm not sure why, but for some reason it seems that the vast majority of the "established" players on this team have struggled this month...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???:
    Again I ask, did the Sox announcers have a problem with the move?  I trust guys who have been there and understand major league baseball players because of this.  Mike Blowers on the Mariner's broadcast understood why Wakefield was taken out.  Even though he throws a knuckleball, it is still taxing and he can still get tired.  You guys act like it is nothing to pitch in the major leauges!  When was the last time you did that?  How do you know he could have gone 8 innings when he hadn't gone more than 3 1/3 all year?  There is a reason ALL TEAMS slowly work their starters in spring training to get them up to 90-100 pitches.  Having an opinion is one thing.  Acting like you know exactly what goes on in a major league dugout is another.  Another thing, the Sox won!  I was going to say enjoy it, but you have the right to be miserable about it if you like.  I, on the other hand, WILL enjoy that and the entire season.  Like I said a few days ago, a 7-4 homestand would get them over .500 and on their way.  Going 3-1 in each of their next two series can still do that.  And guess what, if they don't, the world will continue (until May 21 anyway, but that is another story) and I will continue to watch the Sox.
    Posted by fizsh

    Damn straight.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    It is because he was on a 75 pitch count. He was not strenched out at all. I could go on.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    How about this as a better alternative to the big explosion that Tim somtimes gives up.   Going along just fine then BOOOOM!

    That's about it.  You have to ask yourself who will have the better ERA for the year, the BP or Wake?  Look back at the last 4 years and see what his OPSa is 0-50 pitch count and 50+ PC.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from M1A2. Show M1A2's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Taking Wake out was the right move. He had to be near his limit, and that base hit was a sure sign that he was close.  Getting 5.2 innings from him was miraculous.   Jenks was a bad move only in retrospect.  As it turned out, Albers did well and so did Papelbon, so the Sox still won the game. 

    Jenks is an interesting case.  Good credentials, good fastball, but he can't throw a breaking ball for a strike, period.  Consequently, he's a living time bomb. 
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from kannaman. Show kannaman's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    I thought Wake had reached the end of the line for him...after Langerhans hit a solid line drive into right field bringing up Olivo, Tito figured better to get him out of there before Olivo tied the game up. It looked like to me that Jenks was supposed to get the one out and than they would bring in Albers to start the 7th inning...but Jenks had no command at all. Tough break for Wake...he outpitched Hernandez and deserved the win....but either way the Sox needed the win and I was glad it turned out the way it did. 
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    That's about it.  You have to ask yourself who will have the better ERA for the year, the BP or Wake?

    Joe, you know ERA is about the worst stat to judge relief pitchers by.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    I think using how they perform in high-leverage situations (as compared to lesser situational circumstances) is the most critical mode of measurement.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???:
    In Response to Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because??? : It's also called winning "In Spite of Francona".
    Posted by BOSOX1941

    '41, I notice you erased your tagline regarding Papelbon's 1-2-3 innings. Hmm ...
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BaseballGM. Show BaseballGM's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    Seattle had the worst offense in the AL, a year ago. This year, there is only one team worse in OPS. They are a terrible offensive team. As I said before this game, Wakefield going a few innings and getting lucky does not validate the fact he is a waste of a roster spot. A revolving door of AAA'ers could have gone 5 and change, Aceves to name one. Except Aceves is a legitimate decent pen option, as well, unlike Wakefield. Wakefield needs to go, and this fumes off the de facto DL merely confirms it. Tito took him out because it was miracle he lasted that long.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    the correct answer: if Wakefield continued to throw a shutout, even a CG one, the moron fans might be questioning why Tito/Theo felt he was only an afterthought for Sox, one that couldn't be counted on as the anti-Wakefield fans feel. There is no reason to pull a guy WHO STARTED EVERY SINGLE GAME FOR SOX between 2003-2009 shouldn't be allowed to work his own way out of jams in the 6th inning of game. Tito, like 90 percent of you yahoos, panicked!!!!!!!! oh my god, he might give up a homer!! Bring in the overrated Eric Gagne looking reliever who is supposed to replace Bard when Papelbon leaves...nice work there, Bobby.   No Jenks sucks posts? Nope, only more Wakefield bashing.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: And Francona pulled Wakefield because???

    So at no point during this thread to Francona's critics at least consider that maybe Wakefield was removed because Olivo has hit .308 / .400 /.615 against him, but against Jenks, Olivo was 0 for 4 with 3 strikeouts?

    Just throwing that one out there for all those who clearly see all and could not rationalize a single reason to ever replace Wakefield with Jenks...
     
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