Angels looking for young pitching

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from charliedarling. Show charliedarling's posts

    Angels looking for young pitching

    If you ran the Red Sox would you trade someone like Renaudo and a lower level prospect for Mark Trumbo of the Angels?

    Trumbo is 27, is in only his first year of arbitration eligibily and has averaged over 30 HRs since 2011.  He is basically an OK to decent first baseman who can also play some outfield.

    Could he project to be a 40 HR guy playing half of his games at Fenway?

    He will be cheaper than Napoli for the next few years, is younger and seems to have more power.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    If you can deal with his very low OBP...Its at .299 right now. hes got all 3 years of arbitration before hes a FA, so you would have him for 3 years. His BB rate went up a little this year, but still obviously not that great.

    He seems like the all or nothing type hitter.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to charliedarling's comment:

    If you ran the Red Sox would you trade someone like Renaudo and a lower level prospect for Mark Trumbo of the Angels?

    Trumbo is 27, is in only his first year of arbitration eligibily and has averaged over 30 HRs since 2011.  He is basically an OK to decent first baseman who can also play some outfield.

    Could he project to be a 40 HR guy playing half of his games at Fenway?

    He will be cheaper than Napoli for the next few years, is younger and seems to have more power.




    No way he can hit 40 HR by just playing half games at Fenway Park.  Jim Rice couldnt do that.

    Thought you meant mike trout??  i ll do it in a heart beat.  Trumbo?  He is just like Napoli. Trumbo struck out 163 times compare to Napoli striking out 173 times.  Yes he is a much cheaper than resigning Napoli.  

    But I know there no way that the Angels would just want a farm system player.  The Angels could ask for Bogaert, Workman or Britton among top talents.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    He's got power, but he's also a low walk high strike out guy.  WHy trade away young pitching for that when we could probably get Mike Napoli back for one more year on a qualifying offer. 

    Now before anybody shoots that idea down lets do a little research. 

     

    http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=6876&position=1B/OF

    http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=3057&position=C/1B

    Mark Trumbo is basically Mike Napoli: yes he strikes out a bit less, but we are talking 4-5% less while walking at almost 1/2 the rate as Mike Napoli

    Trumbo is a lifetime .254/.301/.476 hitter with a .777 OPS

    Napoli is a lifetime    .259/.356/502 hitter with a .858 OPS

    Even this year Napoli is out OPSing Trumbo by a .812-.770 clip.

     

    Honestly I'd rather offer Mike Napoli the QO and have him on the team for one more year than give up prospects for a player who is effectively the same guy (perhaps even worse) 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    and Mike Napoli has outslugged Trumbo 2 of the last 3 years, including this year So I don't know how anyone can say he has more power unless they look only at HR's. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc1944. Show MadMc1944's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    Nap may have to shave his beard---I could see him in the Bronx as the full time DH.

    We have several young guys we need to find places for Nava, Carp, perhaps WMB.

    Xander will probably play 3 B or SS with perhaps Cecchini at 3 B. We'll see how Cecch does

    in the AFL---comparable to AAA ball, for a month.

    If you don't sign Nap you have money for Ells, if you really want him, ($10 from Ells this year plus $13 for Nap). I'm just not sold on Ells for 5 + years.

    I would trade Barnes before Ranaudo.

     

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    Will Middlebrooks would be a closer comp to Mark Trumbo than Mike Napoli would.

    MLB careers stats:

    WM 604 PA, 32 BB (5.3%), 151 K (24.9%), .264/.307/.480/.787

    MT 1981 PA, 107 BB (6.0%), 444 K (25.0%), .254/.301/.476/.777

    MN 3182 PA, 375 BB (11.8%), 846 K (26.6%), .259/.356/.502/.858

    In 2014 Will Middlebrooks will be even less expensive option at first base than Mark Trumbo will be.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to MadMc1944's comment:

    Nap may have to shave his beard---I could see him in the Bronx as the full time DH.

    We have several young guys we need to find places for Nava, Carp, perhaps WMB.

    Xander will probably play 3 B or SS with perhaps Cecchini at 3 B. We'll see how Cecch does

    in the AFL---comparable to AAA ball, for a month.

    If you don't sign Nap you have money for Ells, if you really want him, ($10 from Ells this year plus $13 for Nap). I'm just not sold on Ells for 5 + years.

    I would trade Barnes before Ranaudo.

     

     




    Why the new profile Mad?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    Trumbo has some talent, but I wouldn't give up a whole lot for a career .777 OPS.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    He's only 27. and he's cheaper than Napoli, but I'm hoping we can do better.

    Sox4ever

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    He's only 27. and he's cheaper than Napoli, but I'm hoping we can do better.

    Sox4ever



    Exactly that's why I'd rather have Napoli accept a QO! Get better production from first next year, or get the draft pick and signa stop gap, and hopefully there will be better options in 2014

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to hill55's comment:

    Will Middlebrooks would be a closer comp to Mark Trumbo than Mike Napoli would.

    MLB careers stats:

    WM 604 PA, 32 BB (5.3%), 151 K (24.9%), .264/.307/.480/.787

    MT 1981 PA, 107 BB (6.0%), 444 K (25.0%), .254/.301/.476/.777

    MN 3182 PA, 375 BB (11.8%), 846 K (26.6%), .259/.356/.502/.858

    In 2014 Will Middlebrooks will be even less expensive option at first base than Mark Trumbo will be.



    Perhaps he is a better comp.  but seeing how we are talking about replacing Napoli with Trumbo I figured it's appropriate to compare those two

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    He's only 27. and he's cheaper than Napoli, but I'm hoping we can do better.

    Sox4ever

     



    Exactly that's why I'd rather have Napoli accept a QO! Get better production from first next year, or get the draft pick and signa stop gap, and hopefully there will be better options in 2014

     



    Naps is already at a career high in PAs and RBIs, so I'm not sure it's realistic to expect "better production" next year at age 32, but I wouldn't mind seeing him back.

    I do still see a big need for a middle-of-the order stud, and I was thinking 1B or RF/CF would be the place to make it happen this winter. I'm not sure who is available via trade, but I don't see Napoli, Morneau, K Morales, or Morse as that "big bopper".

    The way Drew is playing, I'm thinking they may bring him back, play Boggy at 3B, and move Middlebrooks to 1B. That would be a very inexpensive solution to the IF, and it would leave money left over to re-sign Ellsbury or somehow get a big bopper (perhaps with a high salary) OF'er by trade. Or, we could maybe sign Pence and McCann along with Drew. That would put us over the luxury limit, unless we dump Dempster, Lackey or another high-priced player.

    Ideally, we could get a low-cost kid like Stanton without giving up Boggy. We'd have filled our OF opening and saved money to sign Drew and/or Naps and McCann or Salty.

    I'll throw this out there without much thought as to wether I'd do it or not, but...

    Trade Lackey ($16M/2 remaining makes him a great high stock value) for top prospects. 

    With the $30-35M available plus Lackey's near $16M, we'd have about $50M to spend.

    Trade those prospects plus JBJ, Middlebrooks, and maybe a young pitching prospect for Stanton.

    Sign: Drew, Napoli, and McCann

    This is our 25 man roster for 2014:

    C McCann/Ross

    1B Napoli/Carp

    2B Pedroia

    3B Bogaerts

    SS Drew

    IF Holt (Cecchini by September)

    LF Nava/Gomes

    CF Victorino

    RF Stanton

    DH Ortiz

    SP: Buch, Lester, Peavy, Doubront, Dempster, Morales

    RP: Uehara, Tazawa, Breslow, Miller, Bailey, Workman

      (Thornton?/DLR/Britton/Webster/Villareal/Ranaudo/Owens)

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    Will Middlebrooks would be a closer comp to Mark Trumbo than Mike Napoli would.

    MLB careers stats:

    WM 604 PA, 32 BB (5.3%), 151 K (24.9%), .264/.307/.480/.787

    MT 1981 PA, 107 BB (6.0%), 444 K (25.0%), .254/.301/.476/.777

    MN 3182 PA, 375 BB (11.8%), 846 K (26.6%), .259/.356/.502/.858

    In 2014 Will Middlebrooks will be even less expensive option at first base than Mark Trumbo will be.

     



    Perhaps he is a better comp.  but seeing how we are talking about replacing Napoli with Trumbo I figured it's appropriate to compare those two

     



    True, but with Boggy possibly being our 3Bman next year, Middlebrooks is in the 1B mix next year.

     
  15. This post has been removed.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    This team is so likeable and some of the kids seem so close, I would not be looking to make many mves at all.....I would like to see them sign Salty, and I will assume we will not pony up the money Ells wants, so Bradley gets his Roster spot, though not necessarily all his time in CF. I think you either keep Lava next year up with the big club or you move him.....I think his bat will play well against LHP, so I let Ross move on. I move Dempster, for minor prospects(and eat some salary)....I offer Naps and Drew no more than a 2 year deal( and I give WMB some offseason work at 1b and 2B).  Bogey gets a shot at 3b to prove he belongs. That makes the 25 man roster basically the same with

    Salty, Napoli, Pedey, Drew, Bogey, WMB, Nava, Bradley, Victorino, Gomes, Carp. Papi, Lava

    Lester, Buch, Peavy, Lackey, Doubront, Uehara, Tazawa, Breslow, Miller, Bailey, Workman, Morales

    If one of the kids is ultra impressive in the Spring. they might replace a Doubront in the rotation or one of th back end Bullpen guys.
     

    They will be fun  to watch again

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from JoeFoyFan. Show JoeFoyFan's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    I'd rather switch PawSox outfielder Bryce Brentz to first than trade for Trumbo. Let the kids play!

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to JoeFoyFan's comment:

    I'd rather switch PawSox outfielder Bryce Brentz to first than trade for Trumbo. Let the kids play!



    First would put more pressure on his bat and most people question his ability to hit enough to justify a Corner outfield spot.  Also probably his only guranteed tool to transfer to the MLB level is his plus arm, and that will be completely wasted at first base.

    I agree in letting the kids play, and I like having a young team.  But Bryce Brentz isn't the answer at first base. 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from MustangBri. Show MustangBri's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to charliedarling's comment:

    If you ran the Red Sox would you trade someone like Renaudo and a lower level prospect for Mark Trumbo of the Angels?

    Trumbo is 27, is in only his first year of arbitration eligibily and has averaged over 30 HRs since 2011.  He is basically an OK to decent first baseman who can also play some outfield.

    Could he project to be a 40 HR guy playing half of his games at Fenway?

    He will be cheaper than Napoli for the next few years, is younger and seems to have more power.



    With Naps,  Carp,  Nava & the talk of converting WMB to 1B....  who needs another candidate for the position?  Especially if we need to give up some ML talent to get him.  Heck, no!!

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    All signs point to the Sox starting WMB at 3B and Bogaerts at SS.

     

    I say we offer Napoli a Q.O.  He's better than anthhing else we could get for one year and there is no one worthy of giving a long term contract in FA.  I'd try to sign a Morales type if he leaves signs a multi year deal (which would net us a draft pick)  But I think there is a really good chance that Napoli would accept a Q.O. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from fl+adam,. Show fl+adam,'s posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    Ellsbury is the key.  Does he want to play here or not.  He leaves we need a big OF bat.  Bradley has not shown me anything yet.

     

    I think it will come down to Drew or Napoli.  They sign one but not the other.  Drew will be cheaper for sure, but will overall weaken the offense.  If they go Middlebrooks at 1B, boggy at 3B, and drew at SS, they will have to spend the savings at C or OF to make up the difference.  I like Drew over napoli and then go McCann over Salty.  Then trade Lackey, lavarnway, bradley, etc towards a stanton type.  I'm not sold entirely on Stanton, as his numbers are way down.  As his walks are way up it looks like they are simply pitching around him with no protection in the lineup.  His average is similar, but both his doubles and HR are way off.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to fl+adam,'s comment:

    Ellsbury is the key.  Does he want to play here or not.  He leaves we need a big OF bat.  Bradley has not shown me anything yet.

     

    I think it will come down to Drew or Napoli.  They sign one but not the other.  Drew will be cheaper for sure, but will overall weaken the offense.  If they go Middlebrooks at 1B, boggy at 3B, and drew at SS, they will have to spend the savings at C or OF to make up the difference.  I like Drew over napoli and then go McCann over Salty.  Then trade Lackey, lavarnway, bradley, etc towards a stanton type.  I'm not sold entirely on Stanton, as his numbers are way down.  As his walks are way up it looks like they are simply pitching around him with no protection in the lineup.  His average is similar, but both his doubles and HR are way off.



    MLBTRADERUMORS just came out with a story that Florida turned down a trade offer from Philly....for the 10th time.  They aren't trading Stanton.  We aren't getting a Stanton type without giving up Middlebrooks or Doubront plus a boat load of prospects or Bogaerts + a prospect of two. 

    THe Sox are not starting Middlebrooks at first base next year, and I'm pretty sure Drew would get just as much as Napoli at this point.  Teams are still going to question Napoli's hip and Drew offers above average offense for a SS at a defensive first position (and his defense is above average as well)

    I also don' think the Sox are going to offer any of them a contract, let them accept a Q.O.  I still think if Drew were to accept a QO the Sox would just turn around and flip him.  They want Bogaerts at SS and Middlebrooks at 3B.  Maybe down the line WMB is an option at first but for now there is no way that is happening. 

    I agree that I would very much like McCann, but Salty is not too far behind.  There is really decent drop off at talent level for catchers in the FA market after Salty/McCann so Salty definitely gets a Q.O. even if he declines it that should still make a lot of teams think twice before signing him.  We would be the only team who woudn't lose a draft pick for signing him but I'd still like to take a push for McCann first. 

    I think Everyone gets a Q.O. and Salty/Naps/Ellsbury would all play their respected positions if the accept.  Of course Ellsbury won't, Salty probably won't and Napoli might.  But no one is getting a 2-3 year contract.  I agree JBJ may be a drop off, but at the end of the day its' the sum of the total team not one position.  JBJ represents no drop off in defense for the league minimum and his offense might not be half bad with his plate approach, Ellsbury's money can be spent elsewhere. 

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc1944. Show MadMc1944's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to MadMc1944's comment:

     

    Nap may have to shave his beard---I could see him in the Bronx as the full time DH.

    We have several young guys we need to find places for Nava, Carp, perhaps WMB.

    Xander will probably play 3 B or SS with perhaps Cecchini at 3 B. We'll see how Cecch does

    in the AFL---comparable to AAA ball, for a month.

    If you don't sign Nap you have money for Ells, if you really want him, ($10 from Ells this year plus $13 for Nap). I'm just not sold on Ells for 5 + years.

    I would trade Barnes before Ranaudo.

     




    Why the new profile Mad?

     



    Southy---not sure what happened---I think I got suspended for a couple of days--I had to use a new Browser to get back to the Forum. I could read but couldn't comment. It was a good experience--I had to use what few skills a 70 year old, non computer geek, has in his arsenal. As someone else mentioned, you sometimes don't realize how adicting this forum is.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

     

     

    He's only 27. and he's cheaper than Napoli, but I'm hoping we can do better.

    Sox4ever

     

     



    Exactly that's why I'd rather have Napoli accept a QO! Get better production from first next year, or get the draft pick and signa stop gap, and hopefully there will be better options in 2014

     

     

     



    Naps is already at a career high in PAs and RBIs, so I'm not sure it's realistic to expect "better production" next year at age 32, but I wouldn't mind seeing him back.

     

    I do still see a big need for a middle-of-the order stud, and I was thinking 1B or RF/CF would be the place to make it happen this winter. I'm not sure who is available via trade, but I don't see Napoli, Morneau, K Morales, or Morse as that "big bopper".

    The way Drew is playing, I'm thinking they may bring him back, play Boggy at 3B, and move Middlebrooks to 1B. That would be a very inexpensive solution to the IF, and it would leave money left over to re-sign Ellsbury or somehow get a big bopper (perhaps with a high salary) OF'er by trade. Or, we could maybe sign Pence and McCann along with Drew. That would put us over the luxury limit, unless we dump Dempster, Lackey or another high-priced player.

    Ideally, we could get a low-cost kid like Stanton without giving up Boggy. We'd have filled our OF opening and saved money to sign Drew and/or Naps and McCann or Salty.

    I'll throw this out there without much thought as to wether I'd do it or not, but...

    Trade Lackey ($16M/2 remaining makes him a great high stock value) for top prospects. 

    With the $30-35M available plus Lackey's near $16M, we'd have about $50M to spend.

    Trade those prospects plus JBJ, Middlebrooks, and maybe a young pitching prospect for Stanton.

    Sign: Drew, Napoli, and McCann

    This is our 25 man roster for 2014:

    C McCann/Ross

    1B Napoli/Carp

    2B Pedroia

    3B Bogaerts

    SS Drew

    IF Holt (Cecchini by September)

    LF Nava/Gomes

    CF Victorino

    RF Stanton

    DH Ortiz

    SP: Buch, Lester, Peavy, Doubront, Dempster, Morales

    RP: Uehara, Tazawa, Breslow, Miller, Bailey, Workman

      (Thornton?/DLR/Britton/Webster/Villareal/Ranaudo/Owens)

    Why would you go after McCann instead of Salty? It is upgrading for upgrading state. Go with Salty it will be cheaper and younger.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Angels looking for young pitching

    If the Sox are going to pursue a free-swinging RH power hitter who cannot field, I would rather they go after Houston's Chris Carter than Trumbo, for a few reasons. 

     

    Not that Carter tops my wish list either. ..

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share