Another Colon discussion

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from peanutandme. Show peanutandme's posts

    Another Colon discussion

    I've been reading on this board about Bartolo Colon and his recent success and of course if you are not a Yankee fan, then you tend to believe that certainly Colon is or has been doing something to enhance his performance.
    When Bonds was accused of doing or taking illegal drugs, the only people who defended him were not surprisely, San Francisco fans. To them Bonds did nothing illegal, he just got better as he got older, you know by hard work and putting in more training time than most other players. At least that was their story, and of course they were sticking to it. Everyone else in the sports world suspected otherwise, and as of this date in time, he has not really been proven guilty, but of course all[except Giant fans] fans really know something different.

    We can say the same thing about any other player whose name has come up in illegal or performance enhancing drug talk.

    Now we all agree that player's don't tend to get better or stronger as they approach their later years in the sports world. Or at least if they don't play on our team. And then if someone on the team we like and root for is suspicious of doing something illegal, then we start picking on player's from other teams and accuse them of doing drugs or other thing to enhance their performance. It seems know one on the old town team can possible be doing anything but just playing hard and working at their game more than others.

    People can we just stop being like little chrildren and except the facts and realize just because some one play's for our team he is above board and just a hard dedicate person.

    In Colon's case we all know he went home and had a operation, preformed by a Doctor who is known for using Human growth hormones in some of his operations. Now we are all expected he had this operation and thru hard work has come back to be better than he has been for the last five years. Also let's look at his body, he sure looks the same to me, physically he looks as he always has, a liitle overweight and not in the best of shape, so we can probably rule out that theory that he worked extra hard to get into very good shape and dropped weight in doing so. Also if he had a operation to his pitching arm, wouldn't he have had sometime for his arm and body to recover, instead he comes to spring training and immediately starts to throw light's out and has continued to do so.

    Now I hope he is doing it the right way, but even if you like the Yankee's or don't like them, step back and ask yourself if he truly got better just thru a simple operation lasta fall or early winter, and just worked harder than anyone else to get back to where he is now. Also I believe him pitched this past winter, because Tony Pena saw him and recommended him to the Yankee's It just seems like a very short period of time to come back and be so effective, if all this happened in a releatively short period of time.

    I'm sure Bud Sellig has plenty of anxicious days and really does not want to deal with another performance enhancing problem. I do feel sorry for him as this seemingly will never go away. But anain at some point he will have to answer the question that is mounting about Bartoto Colon. I even as a Sox fan hope he is cleand, if only for the sake of baseball.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]I've been reading on this board about Bartolo Colon and his recent success and of course if you are not a Yankee fan, then you tend to believe that certainly Colon is or has been doing something to enhance his performance. When Bonds was accused of doing or taking illegal drugs, the only people who defended him were not surprisely, San Francisco fans. To them Bonds did nothing illegal, he just got better as he got older, you know by hard work and putting in more training time than most other players. At least that was their story, and of course they were sticking to it. Everyone else in the sports world suspected otherwise, and as of this date in time, he has not really been proven guilty, but of course all[except Giant fans] fans really know something different. We can say the same thing about any other player whose name has come up in illegal or performance enhancing drug talk. Now we all agree that player's don't tend to get better or stronger as they approach their later years in the sports world. Or at least if they don't play on our team. And then if someone on the team we like and root for is suspicious of doing something illegal, then we start picking on player's from other teams and accuse them of doing drugs or other thing to enhance their performance. It seems know one on the old town team can possible be doing anything but just playing hard and working at their game more than others. People can we just stop being like little chrildren and except the facts and realize just because some one play's for our team he is above board and just a hard dedicate person. In Colon's case we all know he went home and had a operation, preformed by a Doctor who is known for using Human growth hormones in some of his operations. Now we are all expected he had this operation and thru hard work has come back to be better than he has been for the last five years. Also let's look at his body, he sure looks the same to me, physically he looks as he always has, a liitle overweight and not in the best of shape, so we can probably rule out that theory that he worked extra hard to get into very good shape and dropped weight in doing so. Also if he had a operation to his pitching arm, wouldn't he have had sometime for his arm and body to recover, instead he comes to spring training and immediately starts to throw light's out and has continued to do so. Now I hope he is doing it the right way, but even if you like the Yankee's or don't like them, step back and ask yourself if he truly got better just thru a simple operation lasta fall or early winter, and just worked harder than anyone else to get back to where he is now. Also I believe him pitched this past winter, because Tony Pena saw him and recommended him to the Yankee's It just seems like a very short period of time to come back and be so effective, if all this happened in a releatively short period of time. I'm sure Bud Sellig has plenty of anxicious days and really does not want to deal with another performance enhancing problem. I do feel sorry for him as this seemingly will never go away. But anain at some point he will have to answer the question that is mounting about Bartoto Colon. I even as a Sox fan hope he is cleand, if only for the sake of baseball.
    Posted by peanutandme[/QUOTE]

    Well said peanut!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ---The-Babe---. Show ---The-Babe---'s posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    2 things......

    was it really necessary to start ANOTHER Colon thread?

    secondly, why should we feel sorry for selig when he was one of if not the biggest enabler of the steroid era?
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from bald-predictions. Show bald-predictions's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    He is like the new version of David Wells. A low maintanence fat pitcher.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    Peanut-
    There IS an pending investigation. What part of that do you NOT understand? (To the point you felt it necessary to start another thread?) 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from fancy-shamanski. Show fancy-shamanski's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    Its so freakin obvious colon is on PEDs.  All the blatant signs are there, wake up.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]Its so freakin obvious colon is on PEDs.  All the blatant signs are there, wake up.
    Posted by fancy-shamanski[/QUOTE]

    I'm awake. However, obvious or not, it has to be proven, just like a few other players we dare not name.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from peanutandme. Show peanutandme's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    To NYSTEVEN, I 'm sorry  you took offense to my thread dealing with Colon

    Afte reading another  discussion about Colon, it seemed that others wanted to drag in other players on opposing teams without any merit as to why they would do so, other than to try to  justify their own player's actions, by trying to imply that othes did it, so why not Colon.

    We all should stop playing the blame game, and see each player [or their actions] as to what they are really doing.

    I'm not trying to come down hard on Colon, or accuse others because they don't play for my team.

    It seems as long as we have people and the game of baseball[or sports] some will try to bend the rules or do anything to get the edge.

    If Colon were to be found guilty tomorrow of doing or taking something to enhance his ability, would all games that he appeared in be thrown out and any wins he had, would they be deducted from the Yankk's win coluum?

    Of course the answer is probably NO, so as humans if  we can bent the rules  or do something to illeally help us, we will until caught.

    How much cheating is going on in sports right now that we are not aware of. he answer is we really don't know, but if someone does something illegal, then as long as they are on our team, it seems to be OK, but let's come down hard on any player on a opposing team.

    As sportrs fans we really do have two set's of rules for the  player's, one for player's on our team, and one for player's on the other teams.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from peanutandme. Show peanutandme's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    I just read my latest post and saw many spelling errrors. I  am sorry for the many mistakes, but that's happens when you are trying to type something and still watch the Sox on TV.
     I just didn't realize how bad was typing really was.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion : Do you mean the same blatant signs the ortiz and agone are showing?
    Posted by ---The-Babe---[/QUOTE]

    Babe,

    There are no blatant sign of either using PEDS. If you hadn't noticed Ortiz is having a good year but except for his batting average his other stats are in line with the past few years, and over the long term players have great years when stats can reach much higher levels than other years. 

    As for Agon, sure he's driving in more runs and his batting average is high, but he's also in a line up much better than he ever had with Tampa Bay's punch n judy hitting teams. Most thought that if he played in Boston, he'd be having exactly the type of year he's having, so why your surprise !!

    Hetchinspete.     
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion : Do you mean the same blatant signs the ortiz and agone are showing?
    Posted by ---The-Babe---[/QUOTE]

    Gonzalez?  Really?  They've invented a steroid that, in the prime of your career, increases your average but not your power numbers?
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from heobrien. Show heobrien's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    "Also if he had a operation to his pitching arm, wouldn't he have had sometime for his arm and body to recover, instead he comes to spring training and immediately starts to throw light's out and has continued to do so. ...It just seems like a very short period of time to come back and be so effective, if all this happened in a releatively short period of time."

    Your time frame is off by a lot.  He actually had the surgery April 2010.  So essentially he had about 6 or 7 months to rehab.  He pitched Winter ball in the DR, which was where Pena saw him as you noted.  Then went to spring training.  In fact his pitching in the DR actually gave him a head start for spring training and might be what causes him to run out of gas in August.  But, it would also explain him throwing "light outs" from the very beginning.  


    As a Yankee fan I'm happy and surprised by his performance thus far but until and unless it is verified that he did anything wrong I'll just except it.  Not because he's on the Yankees but because if you go down that road it doesn't stop.  You can point to just about any player having a good year start the "what is he on" conversation. 

    It's very possible that the procedure that Colon had might someday be referred to as "Colon" surgery much like "Tommy John" is spoken about today.  I hope that Colon's procedure is on the up and up not because of the grief it will cause Yankee fans but because the grief it will cause baseball fans if that's not the case.  Regardless, as of right now there is no definitive word one way or the other.  

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    Failing to disclose the operation IS wrong-doing.  Tommy John's surgery was performed by a team doctor in full view of MLB.  Don't you think if Tommy John had instead retired from baseball, and returned two years later throwing harder than when he left, and had never made any attempt to explain his recovery, that we would see it in a different light?

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    The surgery is being investigated by MLB. What the outcome will be, I don't know and I am not even willing to venture a guess. The Dr. has sworn that no HGH was used even though this same procedure has used HGH in the past. I am not sure how a Dr. lieing would be to his benefit.

    If it is found that HGH was used and Colon knew about it, then he needs to be shown the door and never to return. That being said, I am sure he has had to test during the season, so I prefer waiting for those test results before claiming anything with certainty.

    As for the Yanks, I don't see them having any fault at their feet. But I certainly understand there being skeptics out there.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from peanutandme. Show peanutandme's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    Thank you Jerseyeric for your insight, it was very good.

    I am not at all  trying to diss on Colon or the Yankee orginazation, but only am concerned that this continues to be a hot topic for baseball and every time someone comes back and has a good game or year for any team, immediately the question arises about his success, espically after apparent downslide as a player.
    And for anyone to accuse a player for something without knowledge because he plays for a team you don't like is absurd.

    Look every team has[had]player's  who try to bend the rules or push the envelope as far as they can.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from dustcover. Show dustcover's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]I just read my latest post and saw many spelling errrors. I  am sorry for the many mistakes, but that's happens when you are trying to type something and still watch the Sox on TV.  I just didn't realize how bad was typing really was.
    Posted by peanutandme[/QUOTE]

    Try typing your thoughts using Microsoft Word which has a spell correction feature and when completed, simply copy and paste on the forum board. :)
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from fizsh. Show fizsh's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    jessey, not for nothing, but I do not believe there is a test for HGH, if that is what happened with Colon.  I accept that there may be still players trying to get any advantage they can, whether it is within the rules or not.  However, unless there is concrete evidence to the contrary, I take players at their word.  It may be naive, but that is the way I feel it should be.

    Also, I am not one to be grammar police, as I understand this is just an informal space to express ideas.  But please, the word is accept, not except.  To use this in a sentence:  Except for a few posters, most posters do not check their grammar and spelling, and I can accept that.  I had to read a couple of posts a few times to understand what was being said.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from heobrien. Show heobrien's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    "Failing to disclose the operation IS wrong-doing."

    Where was it reported that he failed to disclose or attempted to hide the procedure?  

    "Tommy John's surgery was performed by a team doctor in full view of MLB."

    Aside from the fact that players can and frequently do use Doctors other than the team's, Colon was effectively out of baseball.  Which team affiliated Doctor would he or should have gone to?  

    "Don't you think if Tommy John had instead retired from baseball, and returned two years later throwing harder than when he left, and had never made any attempt to explain his recovery, that we would see it in a different light?"

    That's the thing, he neither tried to hide the operation nor was he throwing harder than he's been known to throw.  He was always known as a power pitcher that pounded the strike zone.  

    Unless there is direct evidence wrong doing there is no story here other than an aging pitcher using an untested procedure to prolong his career.  And, if it works he'll only be one of the first but certainly not the last.  In fact, the odds are that you will see a lot more of it based solely on his performance this year.  



     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]To NYSTEVEN, I 'm sorry  you took offense to my thread dealing with Colon Afte reading another  discussion about Colon, it seemed that others wanted to drag in other players on opposing teams without any merit as to why they would do so, other than to try to  justify their own player's actions, by trying to imply that othes did it, so why not Colon. We all should stop playing the blame game, and see each player [or their actions] as to what they are really doing. I'm not trying to come down hard on Colon, or accuse others because they don't play for my team. It seems as long as we have people and the game of baseball[or sports] some will try to bend the rules or do anything to get the edge. If Colon were to be found guilty tomorrow of doing or taking something to enhance his ability, would all games that he appeared in be thrown out and any wins he had, would they be deducted from the Yankk's win coluum? Of course the answer is probably NO, so as humans if  we can bent the rules  or do something to illeally help us, we will until caught. How much cheating is going on in sports right now that we are not aware of. he answer is we really don't know, but if someone does something illegal, then as long as they are on our team, it seems to be OK, but let's come down hard on any player on a opposing team. As sportrs fans we really do have two set's of rules for the  player's, one for player's on our team, and one for player's on the other teams.
    Posted by peanutandme[/QUOTE]

    This is TRUE for every cheater, and is unfortunate. You want to throw out the last 20 yrs? How about the last 70 yrs, because use of greenies was widespread since the 40s? (Even Aaron admitted to taking them, along with TW, Mays, Mantle, and most of the players in those days.) You're just as homerish as anybody else.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]Failing to disclose the operation IS wrong-doing.  Tommy John's surgery was performed by a team doctor in full view of MLB.  Don't you think if Tommy John had instead retired from baseball, and returned two years later throwing harder than when he left, and had never made any attempt to explain his recovery, that we would see it in a different light?
    Posted by slomag[/QUOTE]

    You like to repeat your whines verbatim, despite previous debates where you backed off some? Once (and if) this surgery is cleared, and is done often, then the analogy is apt. And that was his point; how this surgery could become routine someday. And, FWIW, many come back from TJ throwing harder than they ever did.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Another Colon discussion

    In Response to Re: Another Colon discussion:
    [QUOTE]Thank you Jerseyeric for your insight, it was very good. I am not at all  trying to diss on Colon or the Yankee orginazation, but only am concerned that this continues to be a hot topic for baseball and every time someone comes back and has a good game or year for any team, immediately the question arises about his success, espically after apparent downslide as a player. And for anyone to accuse a player for something without knowledge because he plays for a team you don't like is absurd. Look every team has[had]player's  who try to bend the rules or push the envelope as far as they can.
    Posted by peanutandme[/QUOTE]

    But isn't that what you're doing?

     

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