Athletes and religion

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    As for homosexuality being a choice, I once asked a gay friend of mine his opinion on this. His answer was something along the lines of, "Why would I choose to subject myself to the bigotry out there?"

    Homosexuality is not an identity, that characterization is an artifice. Same sexual relations is conduct. Being inclined towards a particular conduct has no basis for it's morality. It most certainly has no basis for sexual identity. 

    The fallacy is intellectual midgets being given license to advance "gay" and "homosexual" as a physical identity. It reflects a society that isn't interested in reality and responsiblity and morality.

    Your friend is the bigot, which is simply another word, along with "hate", to buzz word and bugaboo those who denounce an obvious behavioral disorder.

    "I was born this way" will never be a basis for morality. That society would choose to use this to legitimize behavior should be clear from the pitiful history of mankind's artifices. 

    Any intelligent person would not accept the notion that a class of people is determined by their words or specific acts of sexual conduct. We have a group of politically empowered mental midgets who are leading the monolithic generation of true bigotry. My generation, by virtue of the totality of it's acts and deeds, is not a progressive generation, it is a regressive and decadent generation that lives beyonds it's means and adopts a value system based upon the desire for a life of ease and pleasure, without personal responsiblity for personal conduct.      
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]When it comes to the afterlife, I only know one thing, and that is that the believer holds an advantage over the non-believer.  Of the two, the believer is the only one with the chance of being able to say I told you so .
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]


    The fact is that God is.
    If we consider the word "believer" to be entirely subjective and an antonym to the contrived word "non-believer"...
    Isn't the position of a "non-believer" identical to one who denies that gravity is?
    How is it that a reasonable person denies gravity?
    Because it is not seen? That's funny. Mankind subdues the world. Pitches no-hitters. Hit home runs. Buys Red Sox hats...and somehow presumes that God is not.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion


    Matthew 10

    16
    "Behold, I am sending you out as sheep in the midst of wolves, so be wise as serpents and innocent as doves. 17 Beware of men, for they will deliver you over to courts and flog you in their synagogues, 18 and you will be dragged before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them and the Gentiles. 19 When they deliver you over, do not be anxious how you are to speak or what you are to say, for what you are to say will be given to you in that hour. 20 For it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you. 21 Brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death, 22 and you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved. 23 When they persecute you in one town, flee to the next, for truly, I say to you, you will not have gone through all the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes. 24 "A disciple is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master. 25 It is enough for the disciple to be like his teacher, and the servant like his master. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebul, how much more will they malign those of his household.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    WO - why do you keep posting quotes from the bible?  It's an open forum, just wondering.  I think I'll post a few quotes from (the absolutely brilliant) Richard Dawkins.

    "A widespread assumption, which nearly everybody in our society accepts- the non-religious included- is that religious faith is especially vulnerable to offence and should be protected by an abnormally thick wall of respect........."
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    It just requires common sense and belief in yourself.

    Common sense and belief in yourself requires the intellectual capacity to know that your human failings cannot be the source that defines morality.

    You listed several Biblical passages. One of them is Proverbs referencing "lamp goes out" as meaning "mortal death". In your arrogance and flippant comments on theology, you "use your common sense and believe in yourself". That you are a fool should not suprise anyone who reads your narrow minded snipets.
     
    Theology is best left to those who are highly intelligent and who have studied it for a long time. Time and context and language require scholarly study. 

      
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

     John 14

    6
    Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    This one goes out to Jessey:

    "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror."
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]It just requires common sense and belief in yourself. Common sense and belief in yourself requires the intellectual capacity to know that your human failings cannot be the source that defines morality. You listed several Biblical passages. One of them is Proverbs referencing "lamp goes out". In your arrogance and flippant comments on theology, you "use your common sense and believe in yourself". That you are a fool should not suprise anyone who reads your narrow minded snipets.   Theology is best left to those who are highly intelligent and who have studied it for a long time. Time and context and language require scholarly study.    
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr[/QUOTE]

    But some of the atheists and profound doubters are brilliant intellectuals.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : But some of the atheists and profound doubters are brilliant intellectuals.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]

    Proverbs 22
    Words of the Wise
    17 Incline your ear, and hear the words of the wise, and apply your heart to my knowledge, 18 for it will be pleasant if you keep them within you, if all of them are ready on your lips. 19 That your trust may be in the LORD, I have made them known to you today, even to you.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    "It is unfair to attack such an easy target. I am not attacking the particular qualities of Yahweh, or Jesus, or Allah, or any other specific God such as Baal, Zeus, or Wotan. Instead I shall define the God Hypothesis more defensibly: there exists a super-human, supernatural intelligence who deliberately designed and created the universe and everything in it, including us. This book will advocate an alternate view: any creative intelligence, of sufficient complexity to design anything, comes into existence only as the end product of an extended process of gradual evolution. Creative intelligences, being evolved, necessarily arrive late in the universe, and therefore cannot be responsible for designing it. God, in the sense defined, is a delusion."
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

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    "Mr. Hanky is arguably the most unpleasant character on the board: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Some of those familiar with his ways have become desensitized to their horror."  

    If you are going to cut and paste from the Leftist book of character assasination, at least stick to the standard "homophobic hater bigot". "Bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser genocidial" unsmasks the deep seated anger and hatred you have with those who disagree with your distrubed views on human behavior.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]" Mr. Hanky is arguably the most unpleasant character on the board: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser ; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal , filicidal , pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic , capriciously malevolent bully. Some of those familiar with his ways have become desensitized to their horror."   If you are going to cut and paste from the Leftist book of character assasination, at least stick to the standard "homophobic hater bigot". "Bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser genocidial" unsmasks the deep seated anger and hatred you have with those who disagree with your distrubed views on human behavior.
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr[/QUOTE]

    That's fair, adjustments made, with compliments.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from lowelll. Show lowelll's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Jesus was against many of the rules of the Jewish townspeople of the Old Testament. The Old Testament is full of stories about injustice and cruelty, Stonings, war, murders, violence, bloody sacrifices, human sacrifices, etc. Many stories are symbolic and should not be taken literally such as Noah's Arc, Jonah and the Whale, the Parting of the Red Sea, the Burning Bush. Christians rely on the New Testament. If you want to nitpick the Old Testament then you should be debating someone of the Jewish faith.

    Jesus threw the money changers out of the Temple, forgave prostitutes, forgave criminals, was against many laws made by the locals, and was despised by the Jews in power and the Romans. Many of the verses being quoted by WO from the Old Testament aren't going to promote the message of the New Testament and Jesus Christ. Cherry-picking inconsistencies found in the Old Testament and using that to disregard the entire Bible is nonsense. Read the Remix interpretation of the New Testament ( Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, +++) to get a better handle on a loving and forgiving God and his Son.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    I sent by son to a military academy in high school, he was ADD so the structure really helped him to do well.

    Welcome to the club.  Part of the reason we sent our son to the overtly religious school was class size.  We took him to a shrink and he was diagnosed with ADD, and every single thing the doc said sounded like he was referring to me.

    Oddly enough, while I am probably not all I could be, my inability to focus moment to moment is offset by the fact that I can concentrate incredibly hard on a single issue for a short period of time, and usually resolve it.  So the ADD, at least in my case, does get more manageable.

    How is your son doing, other that one incident?
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    I was told that some parents complained about the rules,  that seemed illogical to me.  I knew what the rules were and I respected them.

    I remember one woman complaining about our girl's softball league.  This was mostly Bronx-based and softball is more like a club.  We're really known more for a basketball.  OTOH, the East Yonkers league is well-known for baseball for the boys and softball for the girls.

    Everybody was better off when she simply switched.  I actually applaud her for wanting the best for her kid, but when she joined our league, she was getting 'x' and wanted 'y'.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Why, oh Brain of Boston, if being lefthanded is normal are only 10% of people lefthanded?  Perhaps they are sinister....

    Surely even a secularist like yourself would agree that Pettitte should've been locked up about 20 years ago.

    And since Telluride is telling jokes, I'll add one of my own, that you've all heard, but for a reason.

    There was a flood, and a Christian was stranded on a roof.  A boat comes by to rescue him, and he says 'I don't need one, God will provide'.  Later, a helicopter appears and he declines saying again, 'God will provide'.  When he is eventually swept away, he ask God why He didn't help.  God's response was 'I sent a boat and a helicopter.  What more do you want Me to do?'


     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]Why, oh Brain of Boston, if being lefthanded is normal are only 10% of people lefthanded?  Perhaps they are sinister.... Surely even a secularist like yourself would agree that Pettitte should've been locked up about 20 years ago. And since Telluride is telling jokes, I'll add one of my own, that you've all heard, but for a reason. There was a flood, and a Christian was stranded on a roof.  A boat comes by to rescue him, and he says 'I don't need one, God will provide'.  Later, a helicopter appears and he declines saying again, 'God will provide'.  When he is eventually swept away, he ask God why He didn't help.  God's response was 'I sent a boat and a helicopter.  What more do you want Me to do?'
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]

    I've always liked that joke.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    I on the other hand have lived a completely different life, filled with things that one only sees in the movies. If you had looked up the word decadent between 1978 - 2008, you would have seen my photo next to it. That being said, I have never killed anyone, inflicted purposeful pain on anyone (except an enemy) and have never turned my back on someone because they were different or their views were diffferent. I believe in charity and helping those who need it. I have even walked little old ladies across the street. I have walked into churches and bowed my head out of respect for those around me who do believe. I learned this from growing up with two wonderful parents, not because some book told me to.

    There's nothing wrong there.  Been there, done that.

    But here's the thing.  That doesn't work for everyone.

    It's like alcohol.  I probably drank more beer in my 20s than 99.9% of the population.  TG, I'm okay.  But others didn't have the same experience.  My ex-roommate is a recovering alcoholic.  One of my old co-workers is a Born Again.  He embraced being Bron Again because his lifestyle of alcohol, drugs and women was putting everything else in his life at risk.

    I'm sure there are a lot of people out there that do fine without going to Mass.  But there are probably a lot more out there that need a certain amount of grounding in their lives.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]Jesus was against many of the rules of the Jewish townspeople of the Old Testament. The Old Testament is full of stories about injustice and cruelty, Stonings, war, murders, violence, bloody sacrifices, human sacrifices, etc. Many stories are symbolic and should not be taken literally such as Noah's Arc, Jonah and the Whale, the Parting of the Red Sea, the Burning Bush. Christians rely on the New Testament. If you want to nitpick the Old Testament then you should be debating someone of the Jewish faith. Jesus threw the money changers out of the Temple, forgave prostitutes, forgave criminals, was against many laws made by the locals, and was despised by the Jews in power and the Romans. Many of the verses being quoted by WO from the Old Testament aren't going to promote the message of the New Testament and Jesus Christ. Cherry-picking inconsistencies found in the Old Testament and using that to disregard the entire Bible is nonsense. Read the Remix interpretation of the New Testament ( Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, +++) to get a better handle on a loving and forgiving God and his Son.
    Posted by lowelll[/QUOTE]

    The point is what makes the writing of the New Testament more truthful than that of the Old? Where do you draw the line in what is real and what is not.

    And what is a remix - did someone re-engineer the New Testament? Is that like the remastering of Sgt. Pepper? Who decides who gets to do this stuff? As for this loving and forgiving God, don't even let me start putting together a list of things that show a loving and forgiving God cannot exist.

    And there is no such thing as non-believers. I believe in science and historical accounts backed with evidence. I believe that Jesus of Nazareth did exist and that he was a Holy man who preached very cool things. As for everything that follows, well that is where you lose me.

    And if to say that I have been wrong all these many years and when I die, I wound up at the Pearly Gates and questions are being asked of me, I will remember your words here about this loving and forgiving God and will surely walk right through. Unfortunately for you, if I am right, you will not be able to look back at this conversation and go, wow - those heathens were right because you will be like me, worm food who becomes part of the circle of life.

    And remember all, no disrespect is meant to any of you of true religious conviction. I applaud your deep sincerity towards your beliefs. And nothing I say is meant to change your opinions. This is just a conversation, except for Hanky, who obviously has no clue about anything. He likes to talk down to people and that certainly is not the ways of a good Christian.

    And FTR - I posted those writings from the Old Testament to show WO that we can all pick and choose different things from these books to prove a point.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : I've always liked that joke.
    Posted by Chilliwings[/QUOTE]

    There is kind of a free will theme in there that I like.  I think some very devout, well-meaning Christians can be a little heavy-handed in the 'my way or the highway' issue, though far less worse than the Muslims.

    I'm pretty sure I can get most secularists to pray, depending on how much pain you are willing to endure.  But I think even the most devout can see that has no meaning whatsoever.  I can force my kids to study and play sports, but it will have no lasting value unless they truly want to do so.

    So the trick, imho, is to convince someone to follow their path to God.  Not necessarily YOUR path, but rather THEIR path, and to encourage them by example rather than words.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : The point is what makes the writing of the New Testament more truthful than that of the Old? Where do you draw the line in what is real and what is not. And what is a remix - did someone re-engineer the New Testament? Is that like the remastering of Sgt. Pepper?
    Posted by jesseyeric[/QUOTE]

    He was selling this the other day.  It's a dumbed-down version of the KJ bible for those too challenged by medieval English:

    "At last. An easy to read and understand interpretation of the New Testament. I feel this will please Christians of most denominations, and as a Catholic, I am delighted to say that I would recommend this version to anyone. The reason, in my humble opinion, that many Catholics are supposedly not familiar with the New Testament, is that most of the versions that we are encouraged to obtain and read, are usually quite difficult for some people to read. However, this version is easy going and uses plain up to date english, for everyone in the twenty first century to understand and most of all, relate to!"
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Every story in both the old and new testament & Qu'ran, as far as I am concerned, is a complete falsehood or an embellishment on something else.

    The arrogance of a hypocritcal fool, supra.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : There is kind of a free will theme in there that I like.  I think some very devout, well-meaning Christians can be a little heavy-handed in the 'my way or the highway' issue, though far less worse than the Muslims. I'm pretty sure I can get most secularists to pray, depending on how much pain you are willing to endure.  But I think even the most devout can see that has no meaning whatsoever.  I can force my kids to study and play sports, but it will have no lasting value unless they truly want to do so. So the trick, imho, is to convince someone to follow their path to God.  Not necessarily YOUR path, but rather THEIR path, and to encourage them by example rather than words.
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]

    Couldn't agree more.  I have some interest in religion in detached, scholarly way and ask a lot of question of my believing friends.  And my communication toward 3 or 4 posters on this thread belies the fact that I am normally very polite and respectful to all, never raise my voice, rarely swear.  And my comms to them is simply because I have no tolerance for the intolerant and hateful.

    Incidently, I also have no tolerance for proselytisers at my door, either....interrupting my life, my time with my family, friends and self, to selfishly push their personal beliefs at me.  If I can tell through the window what they are by their appearance - and it's pretty easy sometimes - I often will take off my shirt (I'm pretty a big guy, too), answer the door with a baseball bat in one hand and a bottle of JD in the other and scream at them to get off my property before I sick the dogs on them, etc.  Works like a charm, and I don't even have dogs!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    The point is what makes the writing of the New Testament more truthful than that of the Old? Where do you draw the line in what is real and what is not.

    Free will.  That's for you to decide.  Everything you need to know about God is already inside of you.  Just for the fun of it, buy a small Bible.  Read the new Testament.  Specifically, read what Christ said.

    Clear your mind before you read it.  No pre-conceived notions.  Don't think about whether or not God exists.  And if you are on the fence, don't think about whether Jesus is God or not.  I believe He is, but I don't know for certain.  So if it makes you feel more confortable, just think of Him as a philosopher.

    After that, either like what He has to say, or you don't.  I don't think it's much more complicated than that.  I'm also not sure why people that don't believe in God don't refer to Jesus as a great philosopher, like they would anyone else.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Incidently, I also have no tolerance for proselytisers at my door, either....interrupting my life, my time with my family, friends and self, to selfishly push their personal beliefs at me. 

    I'm not a big fan of having my personal space violated either, and could live without anyone ever knocking on my door.

    However, I do remember one young couple that knocked.  They seemed very nice and sincere, looking to help others.  I'm sure that knocking on strangers' doors wasn't all that fun for them, and they could've stayed home and played video games.  But just as I was giving them the cold shoulder, they handed me a piece of paper and asked me to think about it.

    After I thought about it, their appearance bothered me less, and I came to beleive that they might be right.

    FWIW, their belief was that the minimum wage law in NYS was too low.
     
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