Athletes and religion

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In God We Trust

    I don't like those who wear hedonism on their shirt sleeve, using it to try and inculcate a State value system. Two consenting adults as a virtue standard should be a private matter and should not be used to impose a public value system on those who consider it offensive.

    There is no separation of church and state in the U.S. Constitution. Only the requirement that no single denomination shall be the established state religion and that the state shall not become entagled with a single domination. Thus, despite the replusive cries of secular public policy socialists, judeo-christian values always have been an integral part of the central government established by the U.S. Constitution. "Endowed by our Creator" is not "two consenting adults in a secular collectivist utopia".

    It is very important for athletes like Jeremy Lin and Tim Tebow to carry on, publicly, their faith, regardless of whether or not it offends those who want to impose a State creed of "two consenting adults".  
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : An interesting position, perhaps even a tasty one. But I can assure you the faith that Adrian, Tim and myself hold, to will have no AFFECT on you...    EFFECT?  Possibly.  One could only hope.    Chili, if you would like to meet someone who won't  melt away in the heat of the solar surface, I'd be happy to talk with you about Him.  You have a good mind and an even better wit ... imagine what it could do with someone giving you good advice for living ...   But that would EFFECT your life.   I am at your beck and call, friend.   :o)
    Posted by SinceYaz


    If I ever had such an interest Yaz, you seem like the sort of person that I would choose.  But that is unlikely.  Thanks anyway, though. 

    Also, re Tebow, Agon, etc. I don't really have a problem with what they do, or Papi pointing upward, etc.  Those acts cost nothing to other people.  But that's where I draw the line; zero affect on others.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    It's funny that no one has mentioned my avatar (which I've had for ages).
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : If I ever had such an interest Yaz, you seem like the sort of person that I would choose.  But that is unlikely.  Thanks anyway, though.  Also, re Tebow, Agon, etc. I don't really have a problem with what they do, or Papi pointing upward, etc.  Those acts cost nothing to other people.  But that's where I draw the line; zero affect on others.
    Posted by Chilliwings




    Hmmm  a lost post.... sorry Chili
     

    I said thank you for your kindess in consideration.  And that I am truly at your call.

    And that I know we can agree on thjis...GO RED SOX!!!!

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    Wow, pretty deep stuff here. I'll just say I respect everyone's right to believe what they believe (with some limits). But I'll also quote George Carlin: "Organized religion should never be confused with God."
    Posted by LloydDobler


    Lloyd - Are the limits you mention in regard to peoples' extreme beliefs, or are the limits you mention actually regarding peoples' actions?

    I believe all beliefs should be permitted, whether they are harmless and provable (2+2=4) or the worst examples of bigotry e.g. Klan, Nazis, etc.  Actions are a different thing all together. 

    If some people think that blue-eyed people like me are lazy, or dishonest, or counter to their beliefs then that is their right to hold such views.  But they cannot be allowed to discriminate against me by withholding a job, or health benefits, or refusing to rent me a hotel room.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from peanutandme. Show peanutandme's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    As a Born Again Believer, while I like to see people come out and say they are believer's in Jesus Christ, I also don't believe God is concerned about the outcome of a game. The only game God is concerned with is this game called LIFE, and the choices we as individuals make. Life has many choices, eternity has two. Choose you this day who you will serve. And  as the BIBLE states, THE FOOL HAS SAID IN HIS HEART,THEIR IS NO GOD.

    While do not try to save every person I see, I try to live my life by example, and help just one person each day, but of course I find that hard to do at times, as because of my human nature, I often fail  my GOD.

    While One's choice to believe or not should be personal, we also should be ready to be a witness and help other's.

    After all, I'm really a old sinner, saved by GRACE. 

    After saying all this, I will proudly say I also love the Sox, and can hardly wait for the seaason to begin, and I will probably say something foolish, and step on some one's toes at some point, but I really just wear my Baseball Heart on my sleeve sometime's, thus making myself open to some foolishness at times. 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    As a Born Again Believer, while I like to see people come out and say they are believer's in Jesus Christ, I also don't believe God is concerned about the outcome of a game. The only game God is concerned with is this game called LIFE, and the choices we as individuals make. Life has many choices, eternity has two. Choose you this day who you will serve. And  as the BIBLE states, THE FOOL HAS SAID IN HIS HEART,THEIR IS NO GOD. While do not try to save every person I see, I try to live my life by example, and help just one person each day, but of course I find that hard to do at times, as because of my human nature, I often fail  my GOD. While One's choice to believe or not should be personal, we also should be ready to be a witness and help other's. After all, I'm really a old sinner, saved by GRACE.  After saying all this, I will proudly say I also love the Sox, and can hardly wait for the seaason to begin, and I will probably say something foolish, and step on some one's toes at some point, but I really just wear my Baseball Heart on my sleeve sometime's, thus making myself open to some foolishness at times. 
    Posted by peanutandme


    Would that everyone did that, no matter what they believe.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    God had NOTHING to do with the touchdown catch/throw, homerun, three-pointer or hat trick.

    And you know that how? Do you have a direct line to the Almighty?
    It seems to me that these athletes are praising God for giving them the ability to play, and giving Him the glory.
    Everything a Christian does in his/her life should be to the glory of God. Sometimes it can be perceived as self-glorification.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from 67redsox. Show 67redsox's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    God had NOTHING to do with the touchdown catch/throw, homerun, three-pointer or hat trick. And you know that how? Do you have a direct line to the Almighty? It seems to me that these athletes are praising God for giving them the ability to play, and giving Him the glory. Everything a Christian does in his/her life should be to the glory of God. Sometimes it can be perceived as self-glorification.
    Posted by Alibiike


    Agreed,

    God gives people gifts, some play piano, some can paint, some can mend hearts, some are good listeners, some are good athletes, etc.

    It's wise to thank God for His gifts and to ask His help in using His gifts wisely.  I don't believe God cares who wins a ball game.  I do believe God is pleased when someone acknowledges where the gift came from and gives thanks.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : Lloyd - Are the limits you mention in regard to peoples' extreme beliefs, or are the limits you mention actually regarding peoples' actions? I believe all beliefs should be permitted, whether they are harmless and provable (2+2=4) or the worst examples of bigotry e.g. Klan, Nazis, etc.  Actions are a different thing all together.  If some people think that blue-eyed people like me are lazy, or dishonest, or counter to their beliefs then that is their right to hold such views.  But they cannot be allowed to discriminate against me by withholding a job, or health benefits, or refusing to rent me a hotel room.
    Posted by Chilliwings

    Fair question. When I wrote that, I was thinking of those whack jobs at the Westboro Baptist Church with the "Thank God for Dead Soldiers" signs. They have the right to be inconsiderate weirdos, but I have the right to have absolutely no respect for it.

    If I read you right, you're saying you believe someone has the right to be a racist piece of garbage, but their rights end when they go out and hurt or kill. I would agree with you on that. You can't legislate thought. (Please correct me if I mischaracterized you).

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : Fair question. When I wrote that, I was thinking of those whack jobs at the Westboro Baptist Church with the "Thank God for Dead Soldiers" signs. They have the right to be inconsiderate weirdos, but I have the right to have absolutely no respect for it. If I read you right, you're saying you believe someone has the right to be a racist piece of garbage, but their rights end when they go out and hurt or kill. I would agree with you on that. You can't legislate thought. (Please correct me if I mischaracterized you).
    Posted by LloydDobler


    Exactly correct.  Some people, however, seem to think their their beliefs are more important than other peoples' rights. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : Exactly correct.  Some people, however, seem to think their their beliefs are more important than other peoples' rights. 
    Posted by Chilliwings

    I will say, however, I don't believe that is absolute. For instance, we've all heard stories about a child dying his/her parents refuse to allow a blood transfusion or medical help because of their religious beliefs. That, to me, is child neglect, pure and simple, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Roadrunner9234. Show Roadrunner9234's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    67,

    Institutions don't have rights under the 1st amendment, people do. Put down the bible for a while and read the constitution.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    "The Bible is a book. It's a good book. But it's not the only book."
    Spencer Tracy in "Inherit the Wind"
    (Don't know if Darrow actually said that, so I'll credit the actor).

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from davidap. Show davidap's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Institutions don't have rights under the 1st amendment, people do. Put down the bible for a while and read the constitution.

    Supreme Court precedent recognizes corporations and institutions as "people."
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    Institutions don't have rights under the 1st amendment, people do. Put down the bible for a while and read the constitution. Supreme Court precedent recognizes corporations and institutions as "people."
    Posted by davidap


    Good point D.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Still having at it I see. There is a reason religion is not discussed in bars - guaranteed fight. Personal choices regarding religion are exactly that. That is a right given to us as citizens of the U.S. As to how the Federal Gov't views the handling of contraceptives through hospitals is not any one religions decision. If a devout Catholic wishes to observe this most archaic belief, that that is their choice. But conception of children through rape or incest and where an abortion is needed for the mental well being of the mother or ending the term of a fetus that will almost be assured to develop with serious medical issues should be treated as a medical condition and the church needs to stay out of that conversation.

    Personally, I find abortion as a means of contraception to be a horrible decision. And that happens way too often because of the beliefs of some when it comes to true contraception. Maybe if the Church (doesn't matter which religion) would look at life in the terms of reality instead of what some old men decided some 4,500; 2,000 years ago, & 1300 years ago, depending on your religion. then more people would move away from the religious guilt and use these protection devices.

    For me personally, I have no idea what is out there waiting for us. I have my personal beliefs, but what I think and you think are two different things. But let us all agree that at no time did Moses, Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha or anyone else every actually discuss same sex marriages, contraception, and all the other trappings of the religious right. There are absolutely no texts found where the text was created directly from word to page at the specific time the word was preached by any of these individuals. They are at the earliest 3 and 4 generations later. And if you do not think that a story will not change over the course of 50 - 70 years and longer, the I have some serious junk that you may be interested in buying. That is human nature aand there are no perfect humans, not even Mother Teresa or the Dhali Lama. Maybe my Mama, but that is just a prejudice on my part.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : I will say, however, I don't believe that is absolute. For instance, we've all heard stories about a child dying his/her parents refuse to allow a blood transfusion or medical help because of their religious beliefs. That, to me, is child neglect, pure and simple, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
    Posted by LloydDobler


    I agree, but that's compatible with my view i.e. if an adult chooses to refuse a blood transfusion for themselves....fine with me, adios amigo.  But they should not be able to force their beliefs on their children.  Extend the logic:  if a parent believes in incest should they be able to force it on their children?
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    67, Institutions don't have rights under the 1st amendment, people do. Put down the bible for a while and read the constitution.
    Posted by Roadrunner9234


    Roadrunner, let me explain 67's "thinking"* on the subjet:
    • she demands her constitutional rights to freedom of religion (I agree that is right);
    • she expects her church to be subsidised by the state i.e. tax-exemption (I disagree with that, but can live with it);
    • other peoples' rights and other laws of the state have to bow down to her personal beliefs on religion i.e. my beliefs are more important than your rights. (this sickens me)

    * - I have yet to see evidence of a working brain from her
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from davidap. Show davidap's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Extend the logic:  if a parent believes in incest should they be able to force it on their children?

    Yes, we should permit incest in the name of religious freedom. After all, there's tons of incest in the Bible, including from heroes like Noah. That makes it okay. Who are we mere mortals to question it?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Kind of interesting how one's religious views seem to influence one's political views, or vice versa. Or maybe it just seems that way from reading through this thread. My last comment in this thread is that , no matter how intelligent some of us humans are , or think we are , there are some things that are still beyond our grasp. That is where faith comes in.  Keep the faith.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    Extend the logic:  if a parent believes in incest should they be able to force it on their children? Yes, we should permit incest in the name of religious freedom. After all, there's tons of incest in the Bible, including from heroes like Noah. That makes it okay. Who are we mere mortals to question it?
    Posted by davidap


    If we take it one step further and follow Genesis, then we are all descendents of incest. If only Adam and Eve roamed the earth at one time, then they had to have daughters as well as Cain and Abel, otherwise where did their wives come from? Or we can take it to a lower level, but I won't go there.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : If we take it one step further and follow Genesis, then we are all descendents of incest. If only Adam and Eve roamed the earth at one time, then they had to have daughters as well as Cain and Abel, otherwise where did their wives come from? Or we can take it to a lower level, but I won't go there.
    Posted by jesseyeric


    And even one step further, if we were to truly follow Genesis, we would know that

    There must be some misunderstanding
    There must be some kind of mistake
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from antibody. Show antibody's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    But when you pray, go into your innermost room (closet? soul?), and pray to your Father, who is un-seen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you openly.

                                   Matthew 6:6
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    But when you pray, go into your innermost room (closet? soul?), and pray to your Father, who is un-seen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you openly.                                Matthew 6:6
    Posted by antibody


    I prayed to my father a few times and he responded, usually in Italian and rarely with what I wanted to hear.

    Here is an old childhood memory; I was in my catechism class as I prepared for my first communion. I guess I was around 7 at the time. The Nun who was teaching the class was trying to explain to us about our Heavenly mother and father. She didn't do a very good job doing this and I walked out of the class thinking that my parents weren't really my parents. I went home that afternoon and went straight to my Mama and told her about this. I tell you, I didn't know that a person could turn so many different shades of red in such a short time period. As you might imagine, this beautiful Sicilian woman I called Mama grabbed me by the hand and we walked back to the school and my mother confronted the  Mother Superior and the Nun. Again, not understanding too much Italian, I am not sure of what was said, but I do recall something about carrying me for 9 months and the word pain. Mind you, Mama was a strict Catholic; church twice a week and only the Latin or Italian masses. Anyway, it was pretty funny. Thought I would share. Funny thing now - she is 93, and she has stopped going to church and has become pretty fed up with them. She still loves her religion, but she dislikes what the people behind it have done to it.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share