Athletes and religion

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : A litany of people in a health care bill?  You need to work on your command of the language if you hope to be taken seriously.
    Posted by soxnewmex[/QUOTE]

    Really, this is your best shot?  You need to do some research into obama care.
     
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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]"Two consenting adults" is the Leftists' religion. It's tenet is based upon pleasure, no responsiblity and an entitlement to pleasure.
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr[/QUOTE]
    So you've never been a consenting adult before?
     
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    So you've never been a consenting adult before? 

    So, is "two consenting adults" your moral standard. I thought so. 
     
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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion :
    Posted by Chilliwings[/QUOTE]


    Schadenfreude.....a great word!
     
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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE] For example it is still a mortal sin to miss mass and you do have to go to confession before you receive communion, so no changes there. 
    Posted by 67redsox[/QUOTE]

    Luke 18
    9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everyone else, Jesus told this parable: 10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’

    13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’

    14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”


     
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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : And you were blessed with a brain and there are many sources to read that just might change your mind. Don't quit with just wonder and ponder. Read about religion and why God exists to many people and why they subscribe to the teachings of Jesus. Watch reruns of Jesus movies on Netflix instead of trash. Volunteer at a hospital or a food bank and see if you feel better about yourself. Stay away from the rituals of churches that are meaningless to you, look for the presence of God in nature / on a mountain top / in a newborn baby's eyes. Give old clothes to a Thrift Shop or rummage sale and see if you feel better about yourself.
    Posted by lowelll[/QUOTE]

    Spirituality is what of which you speak.  I don't confuse spirituality with god.  I feel like I have a pretty sound grasp on "why god exists to people".

    Religion ruled the Dark Ages.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : Schadenfreude.....a great word!
    Posted by ampoule[/QUOTE]

    It's my favourite word for many reasons.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    I always thought Carl Everett was the religious-athlete standard, who after a HR, would point up to the sky to thank God, then turn to the opposing dugout and grab his crotch. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]"That's absurd. With a minimum of effort any English speaker can easily understand 16th century English. Have you ever tried? "   I took Engish literature in high school and never had a clue of what Shakespeare, Chaucer, Byron, and Shelley were talking about.  I stand corrected;  with a minimum of effort most English speakers can easily understand 16th century English

    In Sunday School, the King James version of the Bible was not unintelligible to me but I memorized it in order to be a good student regardless. I always despised poetry and wondered why poets just didn't write as if they were writing a novel or conversing with me. Why poets prefer to use such words that can be interpreted a hundred different ways was always perplexing to me. Read Poetry for Dummies by Al A. Gory.

    I don't agree with 67redsox on her interpretation of when life begins. I don't agree with her and her Church that the pill, IUDs, and condoms are equivalent to abortion. That is a stretch but yet her Church believes that.  I see no denial of a life in preventing the sperm from meeting the egg. That concept was news to me before she mentioned it and I researched it. Thank God that I never married a devout Catholic woman and found this out later on. I am firmly against abortion once a fertilized egg is growing. I see no guidance in the Bible on this issue.  I think in an ideal world there would be no demand for abortion i.e. no rape, no risk to womens' lives, no badly malformed fetuses, and no viable but unwanted pregnancies.  But the world is far from ideal and most Western countries have come to the decision that a woman's right to control her body is paramount.  I support that.  Those that don't can choose what's right for themselves and, regarding others, choose to obey the law or not.

    Posted by lowelll[/QUOTE]
     
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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : That's why faith is a hard concept for the secularist to grasp. To him, there must be concrete evidence or scientific proof of things. Without Faith, Hope and Trust, there is no promise for the future, and without a promising future,  life has no direction, no meaning and no justification" ~ Adlin Sinclair
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]

    "Secularist" here!  I "grasp" Faith, I just don't accept it.  The fact that I "grasp" it is why I don't accept it.  And yes, I do seek "concrete evidence", however I often accept reason.  For example it is hard to accept the Bible once one recognizes the damn world is not flat.  People of Faith should refrain from presuming they know the mind of a "secularlist".
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : Hey jessey, I find that some people dislike the church because of false information. For example it is still a mortal sin to miss mass and you do have to go to confession before you receive communion, so no changes there.  If anyone tells you a different story then they don't know what the church teaches. You are right in saying those priests who abused kids and those who covered up the situation have committed grave sin and have caused a great scandal in the church.  I can go into what was going on in the seminaries during the 60's and 70's to produce such men but that's a whole other discussion. Where did those men come from, where do teachers, ministers and scout leaders who abuse children come from?  Society of course.  So what does that say about the morals in our country?  My younger son went to a school that uncovered a child sex abuser who was a teacher and my older son went to a school who had a teacher who sexually abused kids. Thankfully neither of my kids were involved. Does this mean all teachers are abusers, of course not.  Does this mean that kids shouldn't go to school and parents shouldn't believe in education their kids? No, that would be silly. It's just as silly to turn ones back on the teachings of Christ because of the sins of a few men. Those men will have to stand before God on judgment day.  I pray for the victims and the victimizers. The fact is the church does not teach that abusing children is ok, they teach that it's a mortal sin. If the abuse of kids was a part of church teaching then you would certainly have a right to be angry at the church. So if you want to be angry be angry with those men, not the church.  I am blessed to go to a church with good and holy priests.  I worked at a pro-life center for a couple of years.  There was an abortion mill next door.  I could tell you stories!  These mills have less oversite that vet centers.  A spoke with a young woman in early early twenties that had her uterus perforated while having an abortion.  The abortion doctor wouldn't help her so she came to us.  She had to have a hysterectomy in her early twenties. That is one of many horror stories I could tell you but I won't.  There is nothing safe about an abortion.  The child is ripped limb by limb from mom's womb, the sharp point of the broken bones can cut a women up pretty good. As far as rape goes why does the child receive the death sentence for the sins of his father?  I once heard a women speaking on chastity to high school kids.  she said she was a product of rape and very forcefully said no one has the right to tell her she shouldn't be here. Some women who have had an abortion after a rape said it felt like a second rape. They felt worse about the abortion because they had no control over the rape, they did have control on wether their child would live or die. I'm a women and I don't feel like a second class citizen in the church.  God chose a woman, Mary, to be the mother of Jesus.  He could have come into the world by any means but he chose to come through the womb of a women.  If that's not elevating womanhood then I don't know what is! If you are thinking about the priesthood there is a very good reason why men are priest.  First of all Christ chose men to be his apostles.  The eleven faithful ones were at the last supper when the holy Eucharist was established.  He breath on them and said they had the power to lose and bind sins.  You have two sacraments right there, communion and confession.  He gave those powers to men, not women. There is a great deal of marriage symbolism in the catholic church.  The church is referred to as the bride of Christ.  If the church is the bride then the bridegroom has to be a man.  During the consecration at mass the priest stands in persona Christie, in the person of Christ.  Since the church is his bride (female) the it stands that the person who is in the person of Christ, the groom should be a man. I find the story about Mary Magdalene to be one of the most beautiful stories in the bible.  The mercy and forgiveness Jesus showed her is so incredibly tender and touching.  The story gives hope to all sinners that no matter how bad they have sinned. Jesus is there to love you.  This gives me great comfort. I'm not sure how you know she wasn't a prostitute. I'm not trying to convert anyone on this board.  I am disturbed by some of the nasty anti-catholic posts however.  I would also like people to understand why the church so upset about loosing their freedom of religion.  If it is happening to catholics it's not unreasonable to think that one day it will happen to other groups. You know I luv ya jessey, and I'm still going to pray for you about your smoking.  
    Posted by 67redsox[/QUOTE]

    I think it is time to leave this conversation alone. Our differences are great and not to be discussed here. Your beliefs in the Bible & the Church are admirable. I find it all a fanciful fairytale based on some actual happenings. My beliefs are not from bad experiences or what some old Nun tried to teach me. It is based on life as I see it. I do not denounce Jesus of Nazareth as a true person. I fully believe that there is a historical Jesus who said some beautiful things to many people. Peace, love and harmony are wonderful thoughts. But that is where it ends for me. I only denounce the Church as nothing more than a political party. And remember, when I say church, I am not referring to the Catholic Church itself. Although that might be my upbringing, I have no use for any churches of any religions. It is just a bunch of men who are continuing to use superstition to reign over others.

    I am sorry, but if there truly was a God, then at certain times in the last 12,000 years, he/she would have revealed themselves and done something right for humanity. You know, like slapping Hitler, Stalin, Nero and a few others from committing the attrocities that they did.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hk41Gbjljfo
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from gr82bme. Show gr82bme's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Some interesting posts, especially those in regards to the "contraception" issue so I guess one more person's "two cents" won't hurt the topic.  Consider, if you will, removing the religious, moral, ethical, and politically-driven aspects of the issue.  For example:

    -  A baby cannot be born absent (less rape, incest, something illegal), a conscious decision by a man and a female to engage in the sex act.  No body but those two people make that decision.
    -  A baby cannot be aborted sans the conscious decision made by the female.  She may or may not have her partner's consent - but it really doesn't matter.  At the end of the day, if a female wants an abortion, it's her choice.
    -  Neither abortions nor contraceptives are "free."  Doctors that perform abortions and drug manufacturers that make contraceptives are in the business of making money.  Thus someone or something/entity must "pay" for these things.  Also, please consider that both of these options are legal and certainly available on the open market (clinics, pharmacies, etc.).
    -  If covered by an insurance stipulation, both of these things' cost is considered by way of an insurance premium....ergo, the cost is distributed among those responsible for paying the premiums.  If covered by a government program, those costs are absorbed by taxpayers.
    -  Neither abortion nor contraceptives in most, repeat most, incidences pertain to a woman's health.  I.e there isn't a preventive medial issue involved (again, in most cases).
    -  Given the above, to me it's not a matter of religion, politics, etc.  It's a matter of who pays for, at the end of a day, a conscious decision made by two consenting people.
    -  If I'm not one of those consenting people making that type of decision, why should I "pay" in one way or another, "FOR" a decision that those people make?

    At the end of the day, I don't feel anyone other than the two people involved in a pregnancy (absent rape/incest/illegal activities), people who made conscious decisions to do activity that could lead to a pregnancy (whether or not a pregnancy was their intention) should have to pay for their decisions.  To me, it's not a matter of religion or politics - it's a matter of common sense.  People make decisions, and should be held responsible for all aspects of their decisions.  Standing by for "blasts" from all sides of the isle - LOL :).  If someone wants to prevent or end a pregnancy, it's their choice......and their cost to bear.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : The first amendment states that congress shall make no law prohibiting the free excercise of one's religion.  You are making the leap that a church can then enter into the private sector, run a business, and does not have to comply with legislation governing that business or industry. That argument pretty much allows church-run institutions to do whatever they want.  They would not have to respect any employment laws - they would only hire Catholics because Jews and Muslims and Atheists have false gods, and that breaks a commandment.  Christian Scientist institutions would not offer health care of any kind.  Scientologist institutions would implement their own payroll tax withholdings that went directly back to the church. The first amendment is not meant to protect businesses - it's meant to protect people.  Nobody is stopping Catholics from practicing their religion, but if you run a business, you have to abide by the laws that govern that business.  And it's not like the Catholic Church isn't aware of this and prepared to make compromises for the sake of its businesses - how many Catholic hospitals are closed on the Sabbath?
    Posted by slomag[/QUOTE]

    Unbelievable! Do you not know how much the Catholic church has done in the way of education and helath care for this country? They are undoubtedly the most charitable organization this country has.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : I will say, however, I don't believe that is absolute. For instance, we've all heard stories about a child dying his/her parents refuse to allow a blood transfusion or medical help because of their religious beliefs. That, to me, is child neglect, pure and simple, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
    Posted by LloydDobler[/QUOTE]

    But it's perfectly legal to kill a child in the womb! That's insanity!!!!!!!
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    But the world is far from ideal and most Western countries have come to the decision that a woman's right to control her body is paramount.  I support that. 

    Really? How do you feel about prostitution?
     
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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]But the world is far from ideal and most Western countries have come to the decision that a woman's right to control her body is paramount.  I support that.  Really? How do you feel about prostitution?
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]

    I am all for prostitution. It is the oldest profession in the world and if it was legalized as opposed to keeping in the back alleys, both the workers and their customers would probably live safer lives. Not to mention that this is more taxable income that can be used in government budgets.
     
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    I'm thinking this thread has enough steam to make opening day.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]Some interesting posts, especially those in regards to the "contraception" issue so I guess one more person's "two cents" won't hurt the topic.  Consider, if you will, removing the religious, moral, ethical, and politically-driven aspects of the issue.  For example: -  A baby cannot be born absent (less rape, incest, something illegal), a conscious decision by a man and a female to engage in the sex act.  No body but those two people make that decision. -  A baby cannot be aborted sans the conscious decision made by the female.  She may or may not have her partner's consent - but it really doesn't matter.  At the end of the day, if a female wants an abortion, it's her choice. -  Neither abortions nor contraceptives are "free."  Doctors that perform abortions and drug manufacturers that make contraceptives are in the business of making money.  Thus someone or something/entity must "pay" for these things.  Also, please consider that both of these options are legal and certainly available on the open market (clinics, pharmacies, etc.). -  If covered by an insurance stipulation, both of these things' cost is considered by way of an insurance premium....ergo, the cost is distributed among those responsible for paying the premiums.  If covered by a government program, those costs are absorbed by taxpayers. -  Neither abortion nor contraceptives in most, repeat most, incidences pertain to a woman's health.  I.e there isn't a preventive medial issue involved (again, in most cases). -  Given the above, to me it's not a matter of religion, politics, etc.  It's a matter of who pays for, at the end of a day, a conscious decision made by two consenting people. -  If I'm not one of those consenting people making that type of decision, why should I "pay" in one way or another, "FOR" a decision that those people make? At the end of the day, I don't feel anyone other than the two people involved in a pregnancy (absent rape/incest/illegal activities), people who made conscious decisions to do activity that could lead to a pregnancy (whether or not a pregnancy was their intention) should have to pay for their decisions.  To me, it's not a matter of religion or politics - it's a matter of common sense.  People make decisions, and should be held responsible for all aspects of their decisions.  Standing by for "blasts" from all sides of the isle - LOL :).  If someone wants to prevent or end a pregnancy, it's their choice......and their cost to bear.
    Posted by gr82bme[/QUOTE]

    I believe this is kind of a simple way of looking at things. I feel that the minute Bin Laden was killed, we should have shipped our troops out of Afghanastan, but we haven't. Our government continues to spend my tax payer funds on decisions (war) which I have no say in. This anaology can be made for a hundred other things which I am paying for; campaign financing which is my biggest issue. Although I know that some Presidential candidates have not taken these funds lately because of the restrictions attached to it.

    If you don't want your money to go to federally funded abortions, are you okay with your money going to Federal Gov't assistance to those who cannot afford to care for this same child?

    Simple questions do not have simple answers.
     
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    Re: Athletes and religion

    67Redsox,

    You are way too easily offended. I meant no disrespect in telling you to put down the bible and read the constitution, I just figured it would be easier to do the latter if you did the former.
     
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    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]I'm thinking this thread has enough steam to make opening day.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

    Mark 15

    2And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto them, "Thou sayest it."

    3And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing.

    4And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee.

    5But Jesus yet answered nothing; so that Pilate marvelled.


    A worthless, mindless (everyone HAS to voice their thinking, right spaceman?), opinionated thread. The more I view mankind the more I like baseball AND walk closely with the Lord in ignoring men.

    Play ball spaceman, play ball!

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

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    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : Mark 15 2 And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto them, "Thou sayest it." 3 And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing . 4 And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee. 5 But Jesus yet answered nothing ; so that Pilate marvelled. A worthless, mindless (everyone HAS to voice their thinking, right spaceman?), opinionated thread. The more I view mankind the more I like baseball AND walk closely with the Lord in ignoring men. Play ball spaceman, play ball!
    Posted by WesternOregon[/QUOTE]

    Amen West-O.  
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Roadrunner9234. Show Roadrunner9234's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    Lowell,

    I don't think you regard the US constitution with sufficient reverence.

    You really don't think people are better off under a Constitutional Republic than the forms of government our founders were fleeing?
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]So you've never been a consenting adult before?   So, is "two consenting adults" your moral standard. I thought so. 
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr[/QUOTE]
    You don't even know me, Junior. Which I'm for keeping that way.
    But to answer your question, I don't impose my "moral standards" on others. What goes on between two "consenting adults" is none of my business. Or yours.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from 67redsox. Show 67redsox's posts

    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Athletes and religion : I think it is time to leave this conversation alone. Our differences are great and not to be discussed here. Your beliefs in the Bible & the Church are admirable. I find it all a fanciful fairytale based on some actual happenings. My beliefs are not from bad experiences or what some old Nun tried to teach me. It is based on life as I see it. I do not denounce Jesus of Nazareth as a true person. I fully believe that there is a historical Jesus who said some beautiful things to many people. Peace, love and harmony are wonderful thoughts. But that is where it ends for me. I only denounce the Church as nothing more than a political party. And remember, when I say church, I am not referring to the Catholic Church itself. Although that might be my upbringing, I have no use for any churches of any religions. It is just a bunch of men who are continuing to use superstition to reign over others. I am sorry, but if there truly was a God, then at certain times in the last 12,000 years, he/she would have revealed themselves and done something right for humanity. You know, like slapping Hitler, Stalin, Nero and a few others from committing the attrocities that they did. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hk41Gbjljfo
    Posted by jesseyeric[/QUOTE]

    Hey jessey,

    I watched your video, very sad.

    I agree we should move on but I would like to say one last thing.  All the horrible things described in the video are due to sin.  Man has free will and God will not take that away from him.

    There is evil in this world no doubt, for those who don't believe in the devil just look around.  We are all given the right to choose between good and evil.  No one not even God forces our hand.

    There is enough food in this world to feed everyone, it is man's greed that prevents that from happening, not God's.

    Those who don't believe in heaven or hell think this life is all there is so I can understand why they are disappointed in life here.

    Those of us who believe in God, the bible, their faith etc. believe this world is a journey to eternal life.

    We believe that we are in exile because of the sins of Adam and Eve.  This world is not meant to be paradise because this world is run by sinners. 

    We believe that due to original sin we and the whole world are disordered.  We don't like suffering, but we understand that the 80 short years we spend in this vale of tears is nothing compared to eternal life.

    Those of us who believe help the poor, sick, lonely as Christ has asked us because we know when we do it to the least of our brothers we do it for Him.

    God is with us in His people and in the Eucharist.  Think of Mother Theresa, Fr. Groeshel and the many others who help the poor.  Think of all the saints through out the ages who have sacrificed to help others.  We are His hands in this world, we who believe are called to care for His people.

    If you study WWll as I have you will understand that the reason Hitler gained so much power was because of the sins of the masses. 

    There was a deep hatred of the jews in europe.  He played on that hatred to incite the masses to join him in his evil atrocities.  The reason he had so much power is because those who had evil in their hearts allowed it to happen.

    God was there in His people.  So many sacrificed their lives to help.  Maxamilian Kolbe was one of them.  He was a catholic priest who offered his life in the death camps to save another.


    There is suffering in this world no doubt.  My father was an alcoholic, I wasn't wanted by my mother and I have been in varying degrees of pain since I was 13 and it's only getting worse.  I have suffered physical, emotional and yes sexual abuse as a child.

    If I were to believe this is it, that there was no God I would be singing along with your video!  But God has surely intervened in my life in ways too sublime and too lengthy to go into here.

    Let us resume our friendship which I value.  I can't wait for the season to start so we can give each other a hard time.  Sox rule!Wink
     
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    Re: Athletes and religion

    In Response to Re: Athletes and religion:
    [QUOTE]I'm thinking this thread has enough steam to make opening day.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

    This thread can probably go on until the end of time.

    Evolution vs creationism. Free will vs free thought. Faith vs science.

    I guess one day we will all find out. Hopefully later rather than sooner (d*mn Mayans).

    One thing is for sure, all are to be respected.
     

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