1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    "Shane Victorino's three-year, $39 million contract with the Boston Red Sox vaults to the top of the rankings of the worst contracts signed so far this offseason, giving him virtually the same total dollars that Angel Pagan -- a superior player -- will receive in a contract that's a year longer. The Sox have now squandered a substantial amount of the payroll flexibility they obtained over the summer when they traded Adrian Gonzalez to the Los Angeles Dodgers just to rid themselves of two awful contracts, yet they have little to show for their recent spending spree." -- Keith Law, ESPN Insider, 'Victorino's deal doomed to fail'

    "Within, oh, 30 seconds of the Victorino news breaking, many executives in the Opryland Cascades lobby thought it was the silliest thing they'd ever heard. A switch-hitter traded from the Phillies to the Dodgers last summer, Victorino's splits against right-handers in 2012 were .229/.296/.333. Against lefties, he was almost 100 points higher at .323/.388/.518. Gomes, whom the Red Sox signed for two years, $10 million last month, was a platoon player in Oakland in 2012. Over the course of his 10-year career, Gomes' splits against right-handers are .223/.307/.425. Against lefties, they're .284/.382/512." -- Scott Miller, CBSSports.com

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ChronicNYY13. Show ChronicNYY13's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    I will drink to that!

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    How many threads do you need to make?

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    How many threads do you need to make?

    [/QUOTE]


    Obviously there's not enough negativity on the forum yet.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    "Shane Victorino's three-year, $39 million contract with the Boston Red Sox vaults to the top of the rankings of the worst contracts signed so far this offseason, giving him virtually the same total dollars that Angel Pagan -- a superior player -- will receive in a contract that's a year longer. The Sox have now squandered a substantial amount of the payroll flexibility they obtained over the summer when they traded Adrian Gonzalez to the Los Angeles Dodgers just to rid themselves of two awful contracts, yet they have little to show for their recent spending spree." -- Keith Law, ESPN Insider, 'Victorino's deal doomed to fail'

    "Within, oh, 30 seconds of the Victorino news breaking, many executives in the Opryland Cascades lobby thought it was the silliest thing they'd ever heard. A switch-hitter traded from the Phillies to the Dodgers last summer, Victorino's splits against right-handers in 2012 were .229/.296/.333. Against lefties, he was almost 100 points higher at .323/.388/.518. Gomes, whom the Red Sox signed for two years, $10 million last month, was a platoon player in Oakland in 2012. Over the course of his 10-year career, Gomes' splits against right-handers are .223/.307/.425. Against lefties, they're .284/.382/512." -- Scott Miller, CBSSports.com

    [/QUOTE]

         Amen! This is the second stupid FA signing by this clueless franchise. Can someone please explain to me why the Sox have chosen to pay a 32 year old, .250 hitter, with a low OBP, and with no power, $13 mil. per season, for 3 years? I'm still choking over the Napoli deal....but this deal is much worse. DUMB!!   

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    those three guys could have easily paid for hamilton or grienke for 5 years..

     

    sad

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to georom4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    those three guys could have easily paid for hamilton or grienke for 5 years..

     

    sad

    [/QUOTE]

    um.  no they couldn't.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]


    He did not leave cash on the table. Please get your facts straight.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]


    He did not leave cash on the table. Please get your facts straight.

    [/QUOTE]

    Rosenthal reported that Cleveland offered 4 year for 44 million.  44 - 39 =5.  So he's right.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to georom4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    those three guys could have easily paid for hamilton or grienke for 5 years..

     

    sad

    [/QUOTE]


    hamilton will get 100+ and grienke will get 160+ (making him the highest paid pitcher ever.)

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    Whine much?

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]


    He did not leave cash on the table. Please get your facts straight.

    [/QUOTE]

    Your wrong.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]

         Wish he had gone to Cleveland. This signing makes no sense. Didn't the Sox learn anything from the Carl Crawford experience? And, Victorino is no Crawford.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]

         Wish he had gone to Cleveland. This signing makes no sense. Didn't the Sox learn anything from the Carl Crawford experience? And, Victorino is no Crawford.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    True dat. Victorino can actually throw the ball.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]

         Wish he had gone to Cleveland. This signing makes no sense. Didn't the Sox learn anything from the Carl Crawford experience? And, Victorino is no Crawford.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You can say that again.  Victorino doesn't wither on the big stage (see Philadelphia), doesn't have a lollipop arm, actually has some power, and is significantly cheaper even with his ridiculous overpay.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]

         Wish he had gone to Cleveland. This signing makes no sense. Didn't the Sox learn anything from the Carl Crawford experience? And, Victorino is no Crawford.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Well, that didnt take long. Crawford couldn't live up to his contract when he was here, now Victorino's here and can't live up to Crawford.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to J-BAY's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Victorino left a year and cash on the table. I guess Boston is still a better option than Cleveland.

    [/QUOTE]

         Wish he had gone to Cleveland. This signing makes no sense. Didn't the Sox learn anything from the Carl Crawford experience? And, Victorino is no Crawford.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Well, that didnt take long. Crawford couldn't live up to his contract when he was here, now Victorino's here and can't live up to Crawford.

    [/QUOTE]

    Crawford was signed for Manny Ramirez money...7 years for $20mil. per season, on a guy who has a poor OBP, and who doesn't hit for power. As a result, where does a guy like that fit into a line-up? In the end, the idiot Sox had to bat him 7th!!! Victorino isn't as good as Crawford...hit .255 last year, with a low OBP, and has no power. Where are the Sox going to bat him? Lead-off?? The guy doesn't get on base! Take your head out of the sand, and tell me how Victorino makes this team better?

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    "Shane Victorino's three-year, $39 million contract with the Boston Red Sox vaults to the top of the rankings of the worst contracts signed so far this offseason, giving him virtually the same total dollars that Angel Pagan -- a superior player -- will receive in a contract that's a year longer.

    [/QUOTE]

    Please explain how these career stats indicate that Pagan is the "superior" player:

    •              Victorino      Pagan
    • Years        9 Yrs          7 Yrs  
    • GP             1076           695
    • PA             4295         2653
    • AB             3852         2414
    • Runs           616           358
    • Hits           1060           678
    • 2B               195           138
    • 3B                 65             42
    • HR                 90             41
    • RBI              409           265
    • SB               201           124
    • CS                 43             33
    • BB                334           197
    • SO                498          390
    • BA              0.275       0.281
    • OBP            0.341       0.333
    • SLG            0.430       0.424
    • OPS            0.770       0.757
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Medic87. Show Medic87's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    Your clueless for starting so many threads.  We get it already, your not happy with the signings.  crystal clear.

    They got Victorino for mostly def, not for his hitting prowess.  Totally agree how is Pagan considered the "superior player"  yeah right, what a joke Law is.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to carnie's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    How many threads do you need to make?

    [/QUOTE]


    Obviously there's not enough negativity on the forum yet.

    [/QUOTE]

         The anger being unleashed by frustrated Sox fans is quite understandable. What's the plan? Why not plow big money into the farm system, and go with the kids? In other words, rebuild. Sometimes when a team does that, great things happen (Dwight Evans, Fred Lynn, Jim Rice, Carlton Fisk, Rick Burleson, Cecil Cooper, Ben Oglivie, Wade Boggs, Bruce Hurst, Roger Clemens, Bill Lee...etc). 

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to carnie's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    How many threads do you need to make?

    [/QUOTE]


    Obviously there's not enough negativity on the forum yet.

    [/QUOTE]

         The anger being unleashed by frustrated Sox fans is quite understandable. What's the plan? Why not plow big money into the farm system, and go with the kids? In other words, rebuild. Sometimes when a team does that, great things happen (Dwight Evans, Fred Lynn, Jim Rice, Carlton Fisk, Rick Burleson, Cecil Cooper, Ben Oglivie, Wade Boggs, Bruce Hurst, Roger Clemens, Bill Lee...etc). 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    All great examples of homegrown stars.  But nothing to do with rebuilding.  How about Kevin Youkilis, Jonatahan Papelbon, Dustin Pedroia, Jon Lester, Jacoby Ellsbury.  Also great homegrown talent come to fruition.  Nothing to do with rebuilding.  You can bring up good farm talent without having to go back to formula.

    But that is actually beside the point.  

    Because, by shedding long-term expensive contracts, and then taking on signifcantly shorter 3 year deals this winter, they are doing exactly what you want, giving the potentially great homegorwn talent, all at the very least a year a way from being ready, a chance to prove themselves.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    How many threads do you need to make?

    [/QUOTE]

    yes, that will make the news go away

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    And another writer's thoughts:

    We can only imagine what Boston’s newest outfielder might have received were he comfortable with the situation last season. As it turns out, the Red Sox were more than happy to dish out $39 million for a player whose career numbers are comparable to Coco Crisp. Yay?

    Look, we all understand the Red Sox’ need to go short-term with free agents, and it’s indeed a welcome process, but I can’t come away from this deal without asking, “Shane Victorino?"

    I don’t mind overpaying for Mike Napoli for three seasons, $39 million, mainly because he’ll potentially crush balls at Fenway Park. What does Victorino bring that a Type B free agent – the kind you sign in January – wouldn’t? He’s got the glove and the personality. He had a great OPS (.906) batting lefty against righties last season.

    Thirty-nine million?

    Hate the contract, not the player.

    Dumb contract. Could have saved $15M. Reminds me of the J.D Drew contract and John Lackey. Realistically, negotiated against yourself and overpaid.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from emp9. Show emp9's posts

    Re: Ben Cherington, You are Clueless for Giving Victorino 3/38. That says the Baseball World.

    Let the kids play? W/ Middlebrooks, Iglesias, Lava, Doubront, Nava, Kalish,Salty ( yeah, I'm including Saltalamacchia on this because no other team gave him more time to develop than the Sox ). The Kids ARE playing!  ...just not ALL of them. 

     
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