Big Rays Royals trade

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The calculation is just too different.  Though Shields and Lester look somewhat comparable in a comparison of talent and in what the receiving team would consider their value to be, Shields meant much less to Tampa than Lester does to the Sox.  If the Sox traded Lester for prospects I would be disappointed, if not downright upset.  Lester is a proven quality pitcher they would have been selling low on.  AND he is the second best starter on their staff; a staff that is desperate for quality innings.  A trade of Lester for someone not yet ready for prime time would hurt the Sox in the near future for only the promise that they might be better in 2014 and beyond.  The Rays, meanwhile, will only be worse next season if one of their top starters gets injured, and have greatly improved their chances of being competetive in 2014 and beyond, in part because they gave up another quality arm in Davis.  Remember, he came up with the same hoopla Price and Moore came up with.  The Sox don't even have the equivalent to give up.

    [/QUOTE]

    The difference between TB and the Sox is that the Sox could replace Lester with A Sanchez. Tb could not.

    ______________________________________________________________________________


    The Sox just didnt match up well withe the Royals. 2 teams that are in need of pitching. Tampa, with their stockpile of pitchers could easily do this move and not bat an eye at it.

    I hope BC is working on a quality starter, not some retred like Dempster. That will do NOTHING for this rotation. Id rather start Morales or someone than sign some mid 30's guy for 3 years and 12M per.

    Rays go some solid prospects, which def made them better if they work out. We'll have to wait a year or two to see who "won" this trade.

    We could have traded Lester, and 1 or 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves, or Tazawa (if 1, add Lava or Brentz) to KC, and then signed A Sanchez and S Marcum (or not my choices, but Dempster or Lohse)

    My guess is that both win, unless you judge wins by only rings.

    [/QUOTE]


    Not sure Myers or the starter they got would be realy right out of the gate. Even if it were delayed just for control reasons.

    That mwans we would need 3 starters with Lester , Doubie and already in need of a good starter.

    I dont think Sanchez is on the same level as Lester, so that is paying more for a downgrade. Marcum is a question mark at best. At least we know Doubie is under control for 5 more years and finished very strong last year with no injury history.

    These teams didnt match up well. Our pitching would be worse and we would not receive the immediate offensive help (If Myers even works out)  that we would need from this trade...

    BC was smart not to make this trade.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

    [/QUOTE]


    They'd take Bogaerts, Barnes, Cecchini and 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves & Tazawa.

    They'd take Middlebrooks and prospects.

    We match up, but at what cost?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to raider3524's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to traven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to raider3524's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to traven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to raider3524's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to traven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Agree, the Sox just don't have the horses available to pull off a major deal like that.  Ells is the best they are willing to let go and he isn't worth that much since the gaining team only has control of him for 1 yr.  Not much in the minors to deal either since the Sox showcased all of them this past year due to the huge amount of injuries and none of them really looked that great.  I think their best bet is to try to sign FA Lohse for whatever it takes and hope he can pitch in the AL East.

    [/QUOTE]

    the sox didn't showcase any of our prospects...our best prospects are not even ready for the bigs...what are you talking about?are you in your own world or somthing? 

    [/QUOTE]

    They brought the whole Paw Sox team up at some point during the season...aren't any of them considered prospects?  What do you call them?

    [/QUOTE]
    who?

    carpenter?

    nava?

    kalish?

    gomez?

    mortensen?

    lavarnway?

    are you for real? prospects? did i miss anyone?

    [/QUOTE]

    You missed the two best that the Sox brought up...are you for real???

    [/QUOTE]
    because we are not trading tazawa..and iglesias? ok whatever you say...you lost boy...silly to think you are for real..my bad..you are in your own world..i'll leave you alone...

    [/QUOTE]

    Tazawa and Iglesias could be traded. They aren't real prospects. Well, Iglesias is rated #9. Big Deal.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

    [/QUOTE]


    They'd take Bogaerts, Barnes, Cecchini and 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves & Tazawa.

    They'd take Middlebrooks and prospects.

    We match up, but at what cost?

    [/QUOTE]


    too great of cost for just 3 years of upton.. switch the name to Stanton and i would give up all that and more.. much more

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to mef429's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

    [/QUOTE]


    They'd take Bogaerts, Barnes, Cecchini and 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves & Tazawa.

    They'd take Middlebrooks and prospects.

    We match up, but at what cost?

    [/QUOTE]


    too great of cost for just 3 years of upton.. switch the name to Stanton and i would give up all that and more.. much more

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats what Im saying. Unless its for a guy like Stanton, Im not ok with giving up that much  talent/potential talent.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to mef429's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

    [/QUOTE]


    They'd take Bogaerts, Barnes, Cecchini and 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves & Tazawa.

    They'd take Middlebrooks and prospects.

    We match up, but at what cost?

    [/QUOTE]


    too great of cost for just 3 years of upton.. switch the name to Stanton and i would give up all that and more.. much more

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats what Im saying. Unless its for a guy like Stanton, Im not ok with giving up that much  talent/potential talent.

    [/QUOTE]

    U nderstand your point, but was responding to those who say we don't "match up" or we don't have what they want. We do, but we may not want to part with them.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to mef429's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

    [/QUOTE]


    They'd take Bogaerts, Barnes, Cecchini and 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves & Tazawa.

    They'd take Middlebrooks and prospects.

    We match up, but at what cost?

    [/QUOTE]


    too great of cost for just 3 years of upton.. switch the name to Stanton and i would give up all that and more.. much more

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats what Im saying. Unless its for a guy like Stanton, Im not ok with giving up that much  talent/potential talent.

    [/QUOTE]

    U nderstand your point, but was responding to those who say we don't "match up" or we don't have what they want. We do, but we may not want to part with them.

    [/QUOTE]


    gotcha moon. as long was we're all on the same page. i could see us going after upton but it would cost us too much and leave bigger holes in our organization than it would fill.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to mef429's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to mef429's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
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    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    moon,

    One of the reasons I always liked the idea of Ben getting two good starters is that he could then make Doubront available in a trade, perhaps for J. Upton.  Ells, Bradley and Douby for Upton and a PTBNL might have actually been the start to a deal.  Then we might have seen the Sox have both Sanchez and Upton, which I agree would have made them, if not instant contenders, at least a team worth the price of admission.  But letting Haren go early, and for so little (in terms of total dollars and years commited), and not signing Sanchez BEFORE Grienke set the price (though I recognize that Ben may not have had any choice in the matter) makes your vision, unfortunately, highly unlikely.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ive been saying this all winter.

    1) We have the money to sign SPs that other teams do not.

    2) Other teams need pitching as much as we do.

    3) We sign 2 starters and trade a cheap pitcher or two (out of Doubie, Morales, Aceves, and Tazawa) along with some prospects for a low or lower-than-FA cost legitimat 3/4 slot hitter. I even have mentioned J upton almost as much as Brett Anderson.

    [/QUOTE]


    WMB will suely be in any Upton discussion. Probably Doubront as well as a SS (maybe Bogaerts). They have plenty of OF help. They dont really need any.

    [/QUOTE]

    They may take Doubront, Morales, Bogaerts, Cecchini and anyone over #10.

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats a very big maybe...They'll want top 5 prospects. Still dont think they match up very good.

    [/QUOTE]


    They'd take Bogaerts, Barnes, Cecchini and 2 from Doubront, Morales, Aceves & Tazawa.

    They'd take Middlebrooks and prospects.

    We match up, but at what cost?

    [/QUOTE]


    too great of cost for just 3 years of upton.. switch the name to Stanton and i would give up all that and more.. much more

    [/QUOTE]


    Thats what Im saying. Unless its for a guy like Stanton, Im not ok with giving up that much  talent/potential talent.

    [/QUOTE]

    U nderstand your point, but was responding to those who say we don't "match up" or we don't have what they want. We do, but we may not want to part with them.

    [/QUOTE]


    gotcha moon. as long was we're all on the same page. i could see us going after upton but it would cost us too much and leave bigger holes in our organization than it would fill.

    [/QUOTE]

    Perhaps, but at today's FA costs, I'd like to know what AZ wanted and then decide.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter55. Show parhunter55's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    Personally, I do not want the Sox to trade what I believe it will take to get Upton.  Bogaerts, Bradley and Barnes are just too much of the foundation this team's future depends on to part with; even two out of the three.  I'd rather Ben offer Hamilton 4/104 with a 5th year vesting option at 28-30 million if Hamilton achieves certain milestones.  It may not win them a pennant, but at least they'd have the best hitter in the AL to build around for the next 4 to 5 seasons, and at the very least they'd be fun to watch.  Right now...not so much.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    I'd give Bradley, Cecchini, Lava and 1 from Doubs, Morales, Taz, or Aceves.

    I might give to of the 3 Bs, but then less on the back end.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    First of all, try not to overvalue the farm too much.  The overwhelming majority of prospects never turn into anything better than middle relievers and utility players.

     

    I do doubt the Sox mvoe any of the big names.  While I would like to see them get Anderson, it is much more likely they go the boring route and use Morales or Tazawa in the rotation to start the year, hoping they canb hold the fort for a month or two until one of Webster or De La Rosa seperates himself from the other. 

     

    Best case scenario is the Sox sign a free agent.  The recent phobia of long term deals means it is unlikely to be Anibal Sanchez.   If the Sox do trade for a SP, I can promise it will be a name that draws a lot of ire, regardless of how little it takes to get this pitcher.   "Hey we got Jason Vargas for a can of Spam!!"   "Not Vargas!! We could have gotten RA Dickey for that Spam plus the money we paid David Ross!!!"

     

    It is also not necessarily the end of the season, either.  If the Sox trot out a rotation of Lester, Buchholz, Lackey, Doubront and Morales/Capuano, I am sure a lot of people will immediately label that a last place team.  Just like they labeled the team last season that started the year with a rotation of Jason Hammel, Jake Arrieta, Wei-Yin Chen, Brian Matusz, and Tommy Hunter.   Which one of them is the required "ace" again?

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to notin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    First of all, try not to overvalue the farm too much.  The overwhelming majority of prospects never turn into anything better than middle relievers and utility players.

     

    I do doubt the Sox mvoe any of the big names.  While I would like to see them get Anderson, it is much more likely they go the boring route and use Morales or Tazawa in the rotation to start the year, hoping they canb hold the fort for a month or two until one of Webster or De La Rosa seperates himself from the other. 

     

    Best case scenario is the Sox sign a free agent.  The recent phobia of long term deals means it is unlikely to be Anibal Sanchez.   If the Sox do trade for a SP, I can promise it will be a name that draws a lot of ire, regardless of how little it takes to get this pitcher.   "Hey we got Jason Vargas for a can of Spam!!"   "Not Vargas!! We could have gotten RA Dickey for that Spam plus the money we paid David Ross!!!"

     

    It is also not necessarily the end of the season, either.  If the Sox trot out a rotation of Lester, Buchholz, Lackey, Doubront and Morales/Capuano, I am sure a lot of people will immediately label that a last place team.  Just like they labeled the team last season that started the year with a rotation of Jason Hammel, Jake Arrieta, Wei-Yin Chen, Brian Matusz, and Tommy Hunter.   Which one of them is the required "ace" again?

    [/QUOTE]

    Excellent post notin.

    You know I am fully on board with B Anderson.

    I understand team can win with rotations nobody loved in spring, but if possible, we should try to improve our odds that we find the right 5 to mesh.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    I think they do need to add an arm, and obviously would like the best one they can get.  But I do not think they are going to agree to 5 or 6 years for Sanchez just because he was the prettiest girl left at last call.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    Food for thought even though he writes for the Herald:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/baseball/red_sox/view.bg?articleid=1061181014

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to traven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Food for thought even though he writes for the Herald:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/baseball/red_sox/view.bg?articleid=1061181014

    [/QUOTE]


    read that yesterday. Good article.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to notin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think they do need to add an arm, and obviously would like the best one they can get.  But I do not think they are going to agree to 5 or 6 years for Sanchez just because he was the prettiest girl left at last call.

    [/QUOTE]

    I doubt we end up with Sanchez as well, so it might be down to Lohse, Liriano, or Marcum.

    I wouldn't mind seeing Joe Saunders as our 6th starter.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    i know people have been bashing chris capauno lately but i could see him as a trade target. last season he pitched 198 innings with a 3.72 ERA and a 1.22 WHIP (better than anyone on our staff last season). he cant cost anymore than "farm scraps" as softy would call them because LA has 8 starters on their roster.

    i also wouldn't be opposed to signing loshe for 3 years or trading for johan santana. the mets say they're willing to eat most of that money but its safe to say we could give up considerably less prospects and take on most/all of the remaining contract. we certainly have the space to do that and it would keep our farm system intact.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    Even though Capauno's numbers were helped by playing in LAD and against NL West teams, he's still pretty goo: not the #1/2 slot guy I want, but not a bad pick-up.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from tom-uk. Show tom-uk's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    Neyer listed the past Minor League Players of the Year like Wil Meyer 2012 winner:

    Trout    Heyward     Weiters     Bruce     Alex Gordon     Delmon Young      Mauer     Baldelli     Chavez    Konerko     Andruw Jones 2x       Jeter      Manny      Salmon

    I agree with those who think KC got fleeced.   Davis did well as a releiver but so did Bard.  

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to tom-uk's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Neyer listed the past Minor League Players of the Year like Wil Meyer 2012 winner:

    Trout    Heyward     Weiters     Bruce     Alex Gordon     Delmon Young      Mauer     Baldelli     Chavez    Konerko     Andruw Jones 2x       Jeter      Manny      Salmon

    I agree with those who think KC got fleeced.   Davis did well as a releiver but so did Bard.  

     

    [/QUOTE]

    But unlike Bard, Davis has had some success as a starter and a lot more experience as one than Bard:

    Davis  64 GS  25-22  4.22  1.355

    Bard   10 GS  4-6  5.30  1.620

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    I think the deal was great for both teams.  KC needed SP - they have hitting.  Rays needed hitting - they have SP.  Teams were well matched for that trade.  It remains to be seen who faired better.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Big Rays Royals trade

    In response to traven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think the deal was great for both teams.  KC needed SP - they have hitting.  Rays needed hitting - they have SP.  Teams were well matched for that trade.  It remains to be seen who faired better.

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree, but going by past histories, Shields will get hurt or decline sharply, and the 4 prospects may or may not help the Rays in the future, but the sheer stockpiling of massive quantities of other team's top prospects, their own picks and the unprecedented accumulation of supplemental comp picks over the last few years has set this team up well to compete for the near, mid and longterm.

     

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