Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from sday4x4. Show sday4x4's posts

    Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    This year's team looks strong. Trades seem to be focused on what can effect this year. Would it be worth considering a big trade....if it helped the Sox over the next few years? Are there any targets that could be focused on that would help 2012 and beyond?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from titletownfan. Show titletownfan's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    For Hunter Pence, yes.  We'd have the best outfield in the MLB for years to come.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    I wouldn't trade for Pence until Reddick played his way out of RF. Reddick has all the same tools as Pence and may be faster. Now if Theo could pull off a trade and sign for Reyes, that might be another story.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsox0426. Show redsox0426's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    I think the Red Sox should pursue Ubaldo. He isn't performing at his best, so Sox could buy low on him (relatively, as it will still cost a boatload of prospects)...hold on to Middlebrooks, Reddick Lavarnway, but be willing to trade anyone else, including Kalish and Ranaudo.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]I think the Red Sox should pursue Ubaldo. He isn't performing at his best, so Sox could buy low on him (relatively, as it will still cost a boatload of prospects)...hold on to Middlebrooks, Reddick Lavarnway, but be willing to trade anyone else, including Kalish and Ranaudo.
    Posted by redsox0426[/QUOTE]That's also a good idea 0426. You can never have too much good starting pitching.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from JB-3. Show JB-3's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]I think the Red Sox should pursue Ubaldo. He isn't performing at his best, so Sox could buy low on him (relatively, as it will still cost a boatload of prospects)...hold on to Middlebrooks, Reddick Lavarnway, but be willing to trade anyone else, including Kalish and Ranaudo.
    Posted by redsox0426[/QUOTE]

    I would have agreed with you in May, but you would no longer be buying low on him.  His ERA's were (are) 2.45 and 2.77 in June and July with his K/BB rate doubling from April/May.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    A two game lead going into Aug-Sep is hardly a lock.
    I know many on here feel that as long as the pitching gets healthy, we are in good shape, and are a lock to make the PS.
    Other teams in contention will be making moves to improve, and to stand pat thinking we are "good enough", would be repeating 2010.
    Theo threw in the towel in August of last year, by not getting some rentals to get us over the hump.
    If the non-waiver TD comes and goes, without us making at least one significant gain, we may be in for another long October with no baseball.
    Right now there are at least 5 players on the active roster that add little or no value to the team:

    Dmac
    Wheeler
    Williams (Jenks on DL but worthless as well)
    Navarro
    Drew

    Morales has pitched well and why Oki is not on the active roster baffles me.
    The bench is very weak and we need to get a veteran IF and OF to come off the bench in lieu of Drew of Navarro.
    Drew should be released and Navarro sent downI might keep Dmac but only because he played well going down the stretch last year.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]A two game lead going into Aug-Sep is hardly a lock. I know many on here feel that as long as the pitching gets healthy, we are in good shape, and are a lock to make the PS. Other teams in contention will be making moves to improve, and to stand pat thinking we are "good enough", would be repeating 2010. Theo threw in the towel in August of last year, by not getting some rentals to get us over the hump. If the non-waiver TD comes and goes, without us making at least one significant gain, we may be in for another long October with no baseball. Right now there are at least 5 players on the active roster that add little or no value to the team: Dmac Wheeler Williams (Jenks on DL but worthless as well) Navarro Drew Morales has pitched well and why Oki is not on the active roster baffles me. The bench is very weak and we need to get a veteran IF and OF to come off the bench in lieu of Drew of Navarro. Drew should be released and Navarro sent downI might keep Dmac but only because he played well going down the stretch last year.
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]Few points. You are wrong about Wheeler. IMO you made a determination about Wheeler in May when he was hurt and his results stunk and you haven't let his sub 1.000 WHIP since coming off of the DL persuade you to change that opinion and think that his early appearances were actually the result of pitching hurt.

    Navarro is here as a utility guy that plays multiple positions, IF and OF. I am pretty sure when Lowrie comes off of the DL, Navarro returns to Pawtucket.

    If the RS can trade their mid-level prospects to get a RH OF bat I think they will. But it sure as heck won't be a blockbuster.

    If you really think the RS were a deadline trade or two away from making any kind of a post season run, please share with us who the players were they should have gotten to compensate for Pedey, Youk, Cameron, Ellsbury all being on the DL and Beckett playing hurt.

    I am not sure if you are one of those people who when blasting Theo always brings up the deadline trade for Gagne in 2007 but keep in mind they don't always work out even when they make sense at the time of the trade.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxpride34. Show redsoxpride34's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    yes it is worht it but the only guy i would go after is ubaldo jimenez. In fact we could potentially fill 2 needs in a deal with the rox. Send them a package of prospects for ubaldo and ryan spilbourgs. Fills our 2 biggest needs in one trade. And ya we are by no means a lock to make the playoffs this year and are certainlt not even close to being a lock to win the division. A trade for ubaldo and spilbourghs would make a huge difference and I believe would put us over the top. Our rotation is pretty bad right now and our top 3 starters have all been injured this year. 2 of which are not even back yet. Lester will be back soon, but who knows how effective/durable he will be for the rest of the season. And buchholz would be back till mid august and even then he has never been durable and is not as good as many people think. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter1. Show parhunter1's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    I have to disagree with redsoxpride on two counts.  First, Buchholz is as good as most people here think, when healthy.  He is the best #3 guy around, and would be a #2 or even ace for many other teams.

    Second, this current Sox team is the best team in MLB over the last 84 games.  They are about as certain a lock on a playoff spot as any team in MLB.  Yes, the Yankees could top the division, but which second place team in the Cental or West is going to overtake the Sox, barring an uncharacteristic (for this current squad) collaps over the last 66 games.
     
    I would say no to Jimenez, unless the Rockies would leave the top ten prospects off their list of necessary trade partners.

    I would trade for Pence if Reddick and a second lesser prospect were enough.

    In other words, I would not look to trade for Pence or Jimenez at this time; they will almost certainly cost more than they are worth.

    The Sox should actually consider trading some pitching.  Millwood and Okajima are being wasted in Pawtucket, and deserve to be on a big league roster.  They might bring some low level prospects with upside.  Maybe those prospects could be used to get a LH reliever and/or RH OF bench player to help down the stretch (since these are two things the Sox have lost with Hill going down and Cameron being a bust).
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from WE5NUTS. Show WE5NUTS's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]yes it is worht it but the only guy i would go after is ubaldo jimenez. In fact we could potentially fill 2 needs in a deal with the rox. Send them a package of prospects for ubaldo and ryan spilbourgs. Fills our 2 biggest needs in one trade. And ya we are by no means a lock to make the playoffs this year and are certainlt not even close to being a lock to win the division. A trade for ubaldo and spilbourghs would make a huge difference and I believe would put us over the top. Our rotation is pretty bad right now and our top 3 starters have all been injured this year. 2 of which are not even back yet. Lester will be back soon, but who knows how effective/durable he will be for the rest of the season. And buchholz would be back till mid august and even then he has never been durable and is not as good as many people think. 
    Posted by redsoxpride34[/QUOTE]
     Even if NY does win the division who could possibly steal the wild card? The Sox aren't a lock to win the division, but they are a lock to make the playoffs.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    parhunter1 is a cockeyed optimist, and I completely agree with him. 

    Theo should certainly be looking for trades, big or small, but I don't think he needs to pull the trigger unless it's a good deal. 

    A couple of years ago, we all thought Masterson for V-Mart was a good deal, but right now V-Mart is playing for the Tigers--as a DH, which we don't need--and Masterson is starting and throwing very well for the Indians.  V-Mart very definitely helped the Sox, but now he's gone. 

    As fivekatz says, last year was all about injuries, and loading up on temps was not a good idea. 

    The AGon deal alone gives Theo all kinds of credibility--with me, anyway. 
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter1. Show parhunter1's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    max, thanks for the compliment?

    Your example of Masterson for V-Mart couldn't be a better illustration of my position.  And V-Mart is something the Sox needed far more at the time than they currently have a need for.  At that time, the Sox needed an offensive power, and catcher to help spell Tek (and make the Kevin Cashes of the world unnecessary).  But the Sox do not need a big offensive upgrade in RF.  Reddick is providing quite enough offense right now.  And Scutaro is providing enough offense from the SS position, with Lowrie on his way back (an upgrade offensively if his shoulder is really better), and Iglesias around if the bigger need is a defensive upgrade.  (I have argued that if RF is providing enough offense, they Sox would be fine to have a SS who had an OBP around .300, provided the defense was outstanding).

    The biggest need right now is starting pitching.  But what starter out there is really available at reasonable cost who is going to be better than Miller, Wakefield, Weiland, and Dubront or Millwood?  Yes.  Jimenez is better, but not enough better to justify trading say:  Reddick, Ranaudo and Iglesias (and every indication is that Colorado is looking for even more than that).  A trade like that would be regrettable in a year or two; of that I am almost certain.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from NUSoxFan. Show NUSoxFan's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]A two game lead going into Aug-Sep is hardly a lock. I know many on here feel that as long as the pitching gets healthy, we are in good shape, and are a lock to make the PS. Other teams in contention will be making moves to improve, and to stand pat thinking we are "good enough", would be repeating 2010. Theo threw in the towel in August of last year, by not getting some rentals to get us over the hump. If the non-waiver TD comes and goes, without us making at least one significant gain, we may be in for another long October with no baseball. Right now there are at least 5 players on the active roster that add little or no value to the team: Dmac Wheeler Williams (Jenks on DL but worthless as well) Navarro Drew Morales has pitched well and why Oki is not on the active roster baffles me. The bench is very weak and we need to get a veteran IF and OF to come off the bench in lieu of Drew of Navarro. Drew should be released and Navarro sent downI might keep Dmac but only because he played well going down the stretch last year.
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]'

    Wheeler has been fantastic since coming off the DL.
     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]max, thanks for the compliment? Your example of Masterson for V-Mart couldn't be a better illustration of my position.  And V-Mart is something the Sox needed far more at the time than they currently have a need for.  At that time, the Sox needed an offensive power, and catcher to help spell Tek (and make the Kevin Cashes of the world unnecessary).  But the Sox do not need a big offensive upgrade in RF.  Reddick is providing quite enough offense right now.  And Scutaro is providing enough offense from the SS position, with Lowrie on his way back (an upgrade offensively if his shoulder is really better), and Iglesias around if the bigger need is a defensive upgrade.  (I have argued that if RF is providing enough offense, they Sox would be fine to have a SS who had an OBP around .300, provided the defense was outstanding). The biggest need right now is starting pitching.  But what starter out there is really available at reasonable cost who is going to be better than Miller, Wakefield, Weiland, and Dubront or Millwood?  Yes.  Jimenez is better, but not enough better to justify trading say:  Reddick, Ranaudo and Iglesias (and every indication is that Colorado is looking for even more than that).  A trade like that would be regrettable in a year or two; of that I am almost certain.
    Posted by parhunter1[/QUOTE]

    Hold off and let's see how Barnes does. He was the draft compensation for Vmart. And you can say Vmart allowed them to go get Gonzo. If they had Vmart, maybe no trade for Gonzo.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]Pence is a popular trade rumor for the wrong reasons. Gagne was not the right trade idea, at the time. Independent of that fact, PED issue was overt and in the file.   A blockbuster trade involving Ellsbury and parts, for an extended Kemp, would be worth it short and long term.  
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    Except LA would have to be willing to deal Kemp, and no one wants to because Ellsbury is an allstar and people are happy with him here. 

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter1. Show parhunter1's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    Hold off and let's see how Barnes does. He was the draft compensation for Vmart. And you can say Vmart allowed them to go get Gonzo. If they had Vmart, maybe no trade for Gonzo.

    I am unclear how this pertains to my post at all.  I was suggesting that the Sox spent too much to land V-Mart by trading Masterson, and that they would end up overpaying for Pence or Jimenez as well.  So, following my position, I would have preferred the Sox not trade for V-Mart for a 1 1/2 year rental, therefore, the Sox would still have room and money for Gonzalez.  I was never suggesting that the Sox should have resigned V-Mart to help justify their trade.  He was a great hitter while here, but he never fit their long-term plan and fit their needs only in the very short-term.  His DH/poor 1B play is extremely redundant to what the Sox have in Ortiz, no?
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    Kind of senseless to discuss a blockbuster trade without knowing who is in it, with all due respect.  If we're trading Reddck for Pineda, I'll be pretty comfortable with it.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from patrickford. Show patrickford's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    The Sox do not need more offense.
    Injuries to the starters make me nervous, but I don't like trading prospects to plug short term holes.
    Shifting gears: This year has shown us that Beckett is Larry Bird in spikes.
    He won't tell you he's hurt, in fact he'll go out hurt, and tell you he never felt better. We can stop scratching our collective heads wondering what was going on. The guy is a warrior.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]The Sox do not need more offense. Injuries to the starters make me nervous, but I don't like trading prospects to plug short term holes. Shifting gears: This year has shown us that Beckett is Larry Bird in spikes. He won't tell you he's hurt, in fact he'll go out hurt, and tell you he never felt better. We can stop scratching our collective heads wondering what was going on. The guy is a warrior.
    Posted by patrickford[/QUOTE]

    I agree with you--Boston does not need more offense. 
    Boston needs pitching.  Half of the pitching staff is on the DL and Lackey has been as unpredictable as the weather. 

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from bettersoftthanlaw. Show bettersoftthanlaw's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    Jake and two B prospects for Matt Kemp. We will win the World Series this year, and for years to come, with a right-handed stud in the OF and middle of the order.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    In Response to Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?:
    [QUOTE]Jake and two B prospects for Matt Kemp. We will win the World Series this year, and for years to come, with a right-handed stud in the OF and middle of the order.
    Posted by bettersoftthanlaw[/QUOTE]Yeah, because that formula always worked so well for the Red Sox in years past. How many championships did the Sox win with Jimmie Foxx or Jim Ed Rice as the heart of their order, as great as those guys were? And I don't think Matt Kemp or Hunter Pence will ever be compared to Foxx or Rice.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from william93063. Show william93063's posts

    Re: Blockbuster trade........even though we are good....worth it?

    I don't see Jiminez coming back here or going to New york anytime soon, same for King Felix.  The only realistic blockbuster would be Hunter Pence.  Reyes is going to cost you the moon and has a shaky injury past so I doubt Theo does this(particularly with Iglesias not far away from the majors), Beltran is old, creaky and expensive plus you don't get any draft picks if he leaves in Free Agency, Theo doesn't want people like that.  The sox brass will target Pence only if they believe Reddick has some major flaws that have yet to be exposed through advanced scouting.  If they are totally comfortable with Josh in RF then they'll probably stand pat.  It all comes down to how much Houston will ask in return for Pence.

    A lefty out of the pen would be nice but I'm not sure there is much out there that is better than what we  already have which admittedly isn't much.
     
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