Buchholz accused of cheating.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to RSF4Life234's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    No, there not woth talking about. Just because they accuse him of it doesnt make it valid. That still photo shows nothing Hill. Nothing.

    By that reasoning, just because you accuse Dirk Hayhurst and Jack Morris of wrongdoing does not make your accusations valid ... or worth discussing. 

    I regret that you've lost your objectivity.

    Warm regards.

    Hill have you watched the video from nesn because its pretty Damn clear that he wasn't cheating. Second if he was you think not a single blue jays hitter would have seen anything? Your not being objective your being belligerent. Fact of the matter is that the sox are in first and the blue jays are in last. In a pathetic attempt to remain relevant some of the blue jays media is trying to stir the pot. Shame on them for trying to damper the fantastic job done by buch so far, and Shame on you for pushing this bs.



    I've seen only the photos, which prompted me to write earlier in this thread: "The photos alone aren't enough to prove anything but the photos should be enough to warrant further investigation."

    The video would prove little without knowing what substance that caused the apparent glare on the forearm of Clay Buchholz.

    I could care less about the team of the pitcher in those photos or that team's opponent. I'm just suggesting a follow-up (which for all I know has already been completed).

    Best regards.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    If you shoot video of a pitcher through seven innings and examine it frame-by-frame like it's the Zapruder Film,  they all look like they're  doing something fishy. Touching the  bill  of their cap, touching their arm, etc.

    Somebody made a good  point earlier, the batter (or opposing manager) can at any time ask the umpire to examine the ball  or the pitcher.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hammah29r2. Show Hammah29r2's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    If you shoot video of a pitcher through seven innings and examine it frame-by-frame like it's the Zapruder Film,  they all look like they're  doing something fishy. Touching the  bill  of their cap, touching their arm, etc.

    Somebody made a good  point earlier, the batter (or opposing manager) can at any time ask the umpire to examine the ball  or the pitcher.

     


    that was me lloyd. any real fan of the game knows that. especially those who have actually played it. same could be said about naps bat after he hit a miles worth of home runs. the oposing manager could call time and ask the ump to look at his bat.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to RSF4Life234's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    No, there not woth talking about. Just because they accuse him of it doesnt make it valid. That still photo shows nothing Hill. Nothing.

    By that reasoning, just because you accuse Dirk Hayhurst and Jack Morris of wrongdoing does not make your accusations valid ... or worth discussing. 

    I regret that you've lost your objectivity.

    Warm regards.

    Hill have you watched the video from nesn because its pretty Damn clear that he wasn't cheating. Second if he was you think not a single blue jays hitter would have seen anything? Your not being objective your being belligerent. Fact of the matter is that the sox are in first and the blue jays are in last. In a pathetic attempt to remain relevant some of the blue jays media is trying to stir the pot. Shame on them for trying to damper the fantastic job done by buch so far, and Shame on you for pushing this bs.



    I've seen only the photos, which prompted me to write earlier in this thread: "The photos alone aren't enough to prove anything but the photos should be enough to warrant further investigation."

     

    The video would prove little without knowing what substance that caused the apparent glare on the forearm of Clay Buchholz.

    I could care less about the team of the pitcher in those photos or that team's opponent. I'm just suggesting a follow-up (which for all I know has already been completed).

    Best regards.

     




    I'm betting opposing Jays coaches and players saw a lot more than still photos, not to mention the umps.

    Did anyone question Clay, during the game?

    I expect it from Yankee fans.

    I thought you were better than this

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to jasko2248's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    Lol..I guess it could.

     

    Its just a heavy accusation to make with no real proof. Jack Morris is getting in onthe action now.


    Dirk Hayhurst offered at least some evidence with the photos:

    http://nesn.com/2013/05/clay-buchholz-accused-of-doctoring-baseball-by-toronto-broadcaster-dirk-hayhurst/

     

    The photos alone aren't enough to prove anything but the photos should be enough to warrant further investigation.

     



    Hill, you were a much better poster when you just worked for Fangraphs and shredded one sided trade proposals by Sox fans.  You've grown to hate the Sox so much that you now just seem desperate.  You posted over and over how they only won 69 games last year like they were the '62 Mets, but refused to acknowledge the talent on this roster.  This team is here to stay, get on the bandwagon and eat some humble pie.  No one will think less of you...

     




    Bingo.  Hill, you are in a 1.5 season long funk.  You went over the top to try to explain that at the end of 2012 the Mariners were moving up and the Sox were moving down.  Your comparisons of Middlebrooks minor legue stats to long-shot prospects is nothing more than trying to put down a RS player.  I know that you know that Middlebrooks is consistently making adjustments/improvements with his D and with his contact hitting.  The raw power is already there.

    These accusations are not only baseless but they are also malicious.  Using goop only works on fastballs, and Buchh has been getting his K's on curveballs and changeups.  Not to mention, the fastballs that he has been throwing are not moving any more than natural two-seam movement.

    I've come to expect better from you.  If there was an award for most regressed poster , it would be a toss up between you and Zillagod....Snap out of it, bro.

    Most improved is Pike in a landslide. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    No, there not woth talking about. Just because they accuse him of it doesnt make it valid. That still photo shows nothing Hill. Nothing.



    By that reasoning, just because you accuse Dirk Hayhurst and Jack Morris of wrongdoing does not make your accusations valid ... or worth discussing.

     

    I regret that you've lost your objectivity.

    Warm regards.

     




    Sorry about your Mariners..not as good as you thought huh...

    best regards

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from scash2013. Show scash2013's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to BurritoT-'s comment:

    What is the difference between 14 and 54 as compared to 9 and 32? Not a lot.

     

    BTW you used "14" when it should be "16" .....  padded the number by 2




    No, his average for the previous 4 years was 14. If you want to be that percise, Ellsbury's average for his only two ful big league seasons was 7.5

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    I would take the Blue Jays more seriously if they were a competitive team like the Tigers, Rangers or Yankees but nay.    LOL

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to hill55's comment:

    In response to RSF4Life234's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    No, there not woth talking about. Just because they accuse him of it doesnt make it valid. That still photo shows nothing Hill. Nothing.

    By that reasoning, just because you accuse Dirk Hayhurst and Jack Morris of wrongdoing does not make your accusations valid ... or worth discussing. 

    I regret that you've lost your objectivity.

    Warm regards.

    Hill have you watched the video from nesn because its pretty Damn clear that he wasn't cheating. Second if he was you think not a single blue jays hitter would have seen anything? Your not being objective your being belligerent. Fact of the matter is that the sox are in first and the blue jays are in last. In a pathetic attempt to remain relevant some of the blue jays media is trying to stir the pot. Shame on them for trying to damper the fantastic job done by buch so far, and Shame on you for pushing this bs.



    I've seen only the photos, which prompted me to write earlier in this thread: "The photos alone aren't enough to prove anything but the photos should be enough to warrant further investigation."

     

    The video would prove little without knowing what substance that caused the apparent glare on the forearm of Clay Buchholz.

    I could care less about the team of the pitcher in those photos or that team's opponent. I'm just suggesting a follow-up (which for all I know has already been completed).

    Best regards.



    How do you investigate something that's over?  The penalty for doctoring the ball is an ejection and a 10-game suspension.  That's one start.  We'll know in four days - if he is lights out and there's no controversy, then he's probably innocent.  If he's knocked around or caught with vasoline on his arm, he's probably guilty.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    I doubt he is but if he is I hope he is smart enough that does not get caught.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Promise4you2. Show Promise4you2's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    Lol..I guess it could.

    Its just a heavy accusation to make with no real proof. Jack Morris is getting in onthe action now.

    Dirk Hayhurst offered at least some evidence with the photos:

    http://nesn.com/2013/05/clay-buchholz-accused-of-doctoring-baseball-by-toronto-broadcaster-dirk-hayhurst/

    The photos alone aren't enough to prove anything but the photos should be enough to warrant further investigation.

    You think? It looks like rosin mixed with his own sweat...At least thats what I got after I saw the pic. Nesn showed the video and not some still photo, whatever though...Morris was saying he thought he saw something on Taz's arm tonight. A little overboard with that one.

    Hey, if they want to investigate, thats cool. I think toronto is just bitter is all. Maybe they should find out first before guys like Jack Morris and this other clown keep saying that Clay is without a doubt cheating. kinda premature. There going to look real dumb when/if they find out he isnt cheating.

    Maybe you should read Dirk Hayhurst's series of tweets in the link I provided. No tweet claimed "Clay is without a doubt cheating." The word "cheating" is never mentioned in the tweets.

    theyre accusing him of doctoring the ball, which is cheating...lets not have a play on words here Hill. Morris said he was doing it. Which means hes accusing him of cheating.

    wow, you really have something against the sox huh? Any chance to take a jab.

     

    Just this week I used the words "formidable" and "impressive" to describe the 2013 Boston Red Sox:

    http://www.boston.com/community/forums/sports/red-sox/on-the-front-burner/best-team-in-mlb-is/100/6618936?ia=17245000

    I've also heaped praised on Mike Napoli recently. On this forum I publicly bemoaned not retaining Clay Buchholz at a modest salary in my fantasy league.

    Pardon my objectivity.

    The questions raised by Hayhurst's tweets are worth discussing regardless of the pitcher's team.

     



    Hill,

     

    You know baseball better than that. If a guy is doing those things they get caught real quick in todays game! But, I will give those guys doing the Jays games credit, they have now put the thought into the head of every batter in basball. Lets hope the batters concentrate on that and not on how great Buch is pitching! The mental part of the game can be very big. Im sure Buch and Farrell are laughing all the way to another win.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to slomag's comment:

    How do you investigate something that's over?  The penalty for doctoring the ball is an ejection and a 10-game suspension.  That's one start.  We'll know in four days - if he is lights out and there's no controversy, then he's probably innocent.  If he's knocked around or caught with vasoline on his arm, he's probably guilty.


    I hope you're not a cop.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    It's hard to imagine an opposing player wouldn't pick up on vaseline on a ball - no goop on the bats, nothing a ball girl brings to anybody's attention?  Four times a Blue Jay struck out to end an inning - wouldn't Ross have flipped the ball to the ump before heading into the dugout?

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to hill55's comment:

    In response to slomag's comment:

    How do you investigate something that's over?  The penalty for doctoring the ball is an ejection and a 10-game suspension.  That's one start.  We'll know in four days - if he is lights out and there's no controversy, then he's probably innocent.  If he's knocked around or caught with vasoline on his arm, he's probably guilty.



    I hope you're not a cop.

     



    I'm actually Clarence Thomas.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to slomag's comment:

    It's hard to imagine an opposing player wouldn't pick up on vaseline on a ball - no goop on the bats, nothing a ball girl brings to anybody's attention?  Four times a Blue Jay struck out to end an inning - wouldn't Ross have flipped the ball to the ump before heading into the dugout?




    do players rat each other out? I am home early today and watching felger and mazz.  They claim Jerry Remy says that players never rat each other out because it can back fire.  They talked about all the suspicion around toronto so they would never accuse Buch, because Farrell knows all their deamons.

    The accuser seems to be a nobody. 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to slomag's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to slomag's comment:

    How do you investigate something that's over? The penalty for doctoring the ball is an ejection and a 10-game suspension.  That's one start.  We'll know in four days - if he is lights out and there's no controversy, then he's probably innocent.  If he's knocked around or caught with vasoline on his arm, he's probably guilty.



    I hope you're not a cop.

     

     



    I'm actually Clarence Thomas.

     



    So did you really harrass that woman?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to jackbu's comment:

    In response to slomag's comment:

     

    It's hard to imagine an opposing player wouldn't pick up on vaseline on a ball - no goop on the bats, nothing a ball girl brings to anybody's attention?  Four times a Blue Jay struck out to end an inning - wouldn't Ross have flipped the ball to the ump before heading into the dugout?

     




    do players rat each other out? I am home early today and watching felger and mazz.  They claim Jerry Remy says that players never rat each other out because it can back fire.  They talked about all the suspicion around toronto so they would never accuse Buch, because Farrell knows all their deamons.

     

    The accuser seems to be a nobody. 




    The fact is jackbu, that if you look at video from a couple years ago, Buch does a lot of the stuff he does now. Not the hair because it was short then. But he rubbed his neck, forearm etc.. Justin Verlander is forever rubbing his neck and doing some of the same things. Pitchers try and get their hands moist, not wet, then get the rosin to get it tacky for a solid grip.

    If Morris swears he has evidence, then Id LOVE to see it with him explaining what hes seeing.

    To your point about Toronto not saying anything for fear of being "ratted out" themselves...Most, if not all teams have something on the other team, whether from a player that was trade from that team traded, a manager, coach, GM, etc.. Thats why theres a unwritten rule to not say anything. Every once in a while its broken though. Im not saying Toronto thought Buch was guilty, but if they did and didnt say anything, thats a valid argument as to why.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    southpaw:

    I am not up to date on what a pitcher can touch or not touch.  I would guess once the game starts, most pitchers will forget the rules and the umpires have to decide whether it was intentional or not.

    What I am sure of is, if buch were 0 and 6 he could have a bucket of spit on the mound and no one would care.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to slomag's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to RSF4Life234's comment:

    In response to hill55's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    No, there not woth talking about. Just because they accuse him of it doesnt make it valid. That still photo shows nothing Hill. Nothing.

    By that reasoning, just because you accuse Dirk Hayhurst and Jack Morris of wrongdoing does not make your accusations valid ... or worth discussing. 

    I regret that you've lost your objectivity.

    Warm regards.

    Hill have you watched the video from nesn because its pretty Damn clear that he wasn't cheating. Second if he was you think not a single blue jays hitter would have seen anything? Your not being objective your being belligerent. Fact of the matter is that the sox are in first and the blue jays are in last. In a pathetic attempt to remain relevant some of the blue jays media is trying to stir the pot. Shame on them for trying to damper the fantastic job done by buch so far, and Shame on you for pushing this bs.



    I've seen only the photos, which prompted me to write earlier in this thread: "The photos alone aren't enough to prove anything but the photos should be enough to warrant further investigation."

     

    The video would prove little without knowing what substance that caused the apparent glare on the forearm of Clay Buchholz.

    I could care less about the team of the pitcher in those photos or that team's opponent. I'm just suggesting a follow-up (which for all I know has already been completed).

    Best regards.

     



    How do you investigate something that's over?  The penalty for doctoring the ball is an ejection and a 10-game suspension.  That's one start.  We'll know in four days - if he is lights out and there's no controversy, then he's probably innocent.  If he's knocked around or caught with vasoline on his arm, he's probably guilty.

     

     




    Thats not quite true. Bucky has pitched incredibly well. If he has an off day during his next start, as all pitchers do from time to time, it does not imply that he was doctoring the ball during his previous start at all. Furthermore, since the game is over we will never know whether the accusations were true or false. No one examined the ball during the game. I don't think we can just disregard Morris' accusation without proof that it is false. I believe it didn't happen, but thats as far as I would go with it.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to jackbu's comment:

    southpaw:

    I am not up to date on what a pitcher can touch or not touch.  I would guess once the game starts, most pitchers will forget the rules and the umpires have to decide whether it was intentional or not.

    What I am sure of is, if buch were 0 and 6 he could have a bucket of spit on the mound and no one would care.




    I agree 100%.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to jackbu's comment:

     

    southpaw:

    I am not up to date on what a pitcher can touch or not touch.  I would guess once the game starts, most pitchers will forget the rules and the umpires have to decide whether it was intentional or not.

    What I am sure of is, if buch were 0 and 6 he could have a bucket of spit on the mound and no one would care.

     




    I agree 100%.

     




    thank you

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    Bingo.  Hill, you are in a 1.5 season long funk.  You went over the top to try to explain that at the end of 2012 the Mariners were moving up and the Sox were moving down.  Your comparisons of Middlebrooks minor legue stats to long-shot prospects is nothing more than trying to put down a RS player.  I know that you know that Middlebrooks is consistently making adjustments/improvements with his D and with his contact hitting.  The raw power is already there.

    These accusations are not only baseless but they are also malicious.  Using goop only works on fastballs, and Buchh has been getting his K's on curveballs and changeups.  Not to mention, the fastballs that he has been throwing are not moving any more than natural two-seam movement.

    I've come to expect better from you.  If there was an award for most regressed poster , it would be a toss up between you and Zillagod....Snap out of it, bro.

    Most improved is Pike in a landslide.

    I come home from a root canal to this.Laughing

    I'll assume you're referring to an upward regression on my part ... and I thank you.

    I rarely single out another poster because, well, that often comes off as malicious. I typically provide raw data and leave the conclusions to the reader. Forum members are free to embrace, ignore or challenge my posts ... that's the nature of a public forum. Responses range from simple name-calling to well-constructed substantive replies that occasionally change my opinion.

    Drewski5, I found it curious that you tried to support your argument by citing Will Middlebrooks, who this season has posted a .198/.239/.406/.645 line with five walks and 34 strikeouts in 113 plate appearances. I'm confident that Middlebrooks will improve those hitting numbers. It's possible that Mark Reynolds is not Middlebrooks' hitting ceiling, but I'm not convinced that Mark Reynolds is Middlebrooks' floor, either. For example, we'll see whether the 24-year-old Middlebrooks can match the 189 career homeruns Reynolds has hit before his 30th birthday.

    Baseball is indeed a game of adjustments. Middlebrooks is making adjustments to MLB pitching while at the same time MLB pitchers are making adjustment to Middlebrooks. The early returns suggest that the pitchers are winning that battle of adjustments.

    I will continue to look forward to Drewski5's more substantive posts.

     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ms_obstinate. Show ms_obstinate's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to ConanObrien's comment:

    U are not up to date on quite a bit.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Buchholz accused of cheating.

    In response to seannybboi's comment:

     

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:

     

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    At first look I could tell it was rosin mixed with the sweat on his arm. Pretty heavy accusation to make with little to no proof. careless on Dirks part.

     




    I'm in no position to comment

     

    1 way or another

    only that the soaking hair does make one wonder

    enough to open the conversation

     



    Yup, just like the time when there was a video clip floating around Mo's spitting on the ball right?

     

     



     

    A pretty desperate insinuation directed at a player with a career now spanning 18 years.

    Doesn't square up with some suggesting a unanimous vote into the hall.

    The video that went nowhere.

    And just how does this become an issue about a Yankee?

    This was started by 2 Jay announcers.

     
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