Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade? : I'm still waiting for a response to that Squiggy comment.   He was one of Bavasi's guys, right?
    Posted by notin[/QUOTE]
    The Mariners hired David "Squiggy" Lander as an "associate scout" in 2004 and Lander's website claims Squiggy is still serves as an associate scout for Seattle.

    I had forgotten about Squiggy, who apparently does not play a prominent role with the Mariners.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from GhostofTito. Show GhostofTito's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    I've seen plenty of games with Cabrera, smug man.
    You're comparison of Braun and Bettencourt is asinine.
    Cabrera lead his team in atting average, hits, runs and RBI.
    What did Bettencourt lead the Brewers in?
    You're not nearly as knowledegable as you think you are.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from siestafiesta. Show siestafiesta's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    "Despite an awful 2011, Shin Soo Choo is a much, much better player than either of them... "

    I'll admit that I forgot about Choo, probably because he was injured last yr.  Still not sure he is "much, much better" than Cabrera or Santana but you can make a case for him as their best player.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jgallag1. Show jgallag1's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    I would rather see my players never make the top 10 for their fielding. The best fielders are those who make the plays look routine.  Jeter was always making those amazing jump throws from deep in the SS/3B hole....that's because he couldn't et to them in time to make the easy play
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?:
    [QUOTE]I would rather see my players never make the top 10 for their fielding. The best fielders are those who make the plays look routine.  Jeter was always making those amazing jump throws from deep in the SS/3B hole....that's because he couldn't et to them in time to make the easy play
    Posted by jgallag1[/QUOTE]

    ...and one of the worst fielding SSs (at least range-wise) in my time wins GG awards based on highlitghts on ESPN and the one play where he dives into the stands to make a catch.

     
  6. This post has been removed.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mfymfy. Show mfymfy's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    and one of the worst fielding SSs (at least range-wise) in my time wins GG awards based on highlitghts on ESPN and the one play where he dives into the stands to make a catch.---moonslav
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ESPN highlights and diving into the stands while Nomar pouted are not why Jeter wins GGs. It's because any ball that's been hit to him since 1996, he's made the play. Absolute flat out money. Seems simple and that everyone should be able to do it, but the Sox have tried  24 guys in recent memory and still can't find it. As have many other teams.

    In fact, he's fielded pretty much how he's hit. No long ball, no hitting for the cycle---just a lot of hits. Unless you've had the luxury of having him as your SS, I get that it's hard to appreciate.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?:
    [QUOTE]I've seen plenty of games with Cabrera, smug man. You're comparison of Braun and Bettencourt is asinine. Cabrera lead his team in atting average, hits, runs and RBI. What did Bettencourt lead the Brewers in? You're not nearly as knowledegable as you think you are.
    Posted by GhostofTito[/QUOTE]

    Wow, you don’t get how exaggerations and extreme examples work. “Asinine” was the point, and meant to counter your “asinine” and incomplete logic. Your only support previously for Cabrera was that he played SS, and there you decided to end your argument.  With that on the table, what choice did I have to refute that but to go with the team that had the reigning MVP and the worst shortstop in MLB?  The stars aligned for it.

     

    If you like, I can use an example closer to your heart.  Who is the better player for the Red Sox – Rick Burleson or Dwight Evans?  Burleson was very, very good all around SS who was an important offensive cog, but Evans was an elite RF, particularly defensively.  However, as you said, Burleson played a more important position.  (Don’t respond with some stupid “Are you comparing Choo to Evans”? or similar avoidance.  Just answer the question.) 

     

    However, now you are using batting average, hits, runs, RBI.  I should warn you, those are stats, and you always want to refute statistical evidence.  But if you like, I could easily support it by reminding you that Choo has topped Cabrera in all of those categories the previous years.  Now, had you said “Cabrera was their best player last year” or “in 2011”, I’d be more inclined to agree.  But that is only one season of his 4 year career and happened because all their more talented players were injured.  In some cases (Grady Sizemore) this was not very surprising.  But as an overall player, I’d take Choo, because he is a much, much better overall player.  The only reason Cabrera lead the team in those categories was because Choo was injured, as Choo has topped him in every one every previous year. 

     

    In fact, I would think you of all posters would have appreciated my Choo/Cabrera comparisons.  I only used “use your eyes” evidence with no stats like WAR or UZR.  Just simple observed facts.  Choo is a terrific outfielder who has a cannon for an arm; this is a fact.  He is on base all the time - fact.  He has accomplished 20/20 multiple times – fact. (Cabrera – never.)   How Choo has never made an All Star team is a complete travesty. 

     

    And defensively, you still overvalue Cabrera.  He has a weak arm for a SS and does not cover much ground.  He does make his share of diving stops, because he has to.  As a shortstop, he is probably what you would see if Pedroia switched back over to the position.  Tolerable, but certainly not the stellar defender he can look like with the occasional WebGem.  I would think the Indians should switch him to 2B or 3B, those positins are where all the Indians’ younger talent is, any switching Kipnis, Phelps or Chisenhall to SS would probably be worse.  The Indians also have very little left at shortstop except the defensively superior Jack Hannahan, but he is a pure out machine at the plate.  Basically, he is playing shortstop by default.

     

    If your argument is that Cabrera had a breakout offensive season and a team is smarter building around a SS (even a default one) than a RF, there is merit to that, however, I am hesitant to call Cabrera a breakout player until he does it twice, or at least comes close a second time.  And none of that changes his defensive limitations.  Also, don’t undervalue the importance of a good defensive RF.  As a frequent advocate and obvious fan of Dwight Evans, I think you would understand that. 

     

    I do agree with you on the point that the Indians are not going to trade Cabrera any time soon.  In fact, they probably try to extend him at some point this year…

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?:
    [QUOTE]"Despite an awful 2011, Shin Soo Choo is a much, much better player than either of them... " I'll admit that I forgot about Choo, probably because he was injured last yr.  Still not sure he is "much, much better" than Cabrera or Santana but you can make a case for him as their best player.
    Posted by siestafiesta[/QUOTE]

    Carlos Santana is very good.  By the end of the year, the argument for best all around catcher in the AL could easily be between Santana and Wieters.  This does assume Mauer doesn’t catch very much and depends on what Mike Napoli shows up (and where he plays).

     

    As for Cabrera, I have a hard time even putting him in the argument for best all around shortstop in the American League.  I would draft him for my fantasy team over someone like Alexei Ramirez or Erick Aybar, but that’s not exactly the same.  Cabrera had a good year at the plate, and is doing what he can for a guy pressed into shortstop duty.

     

    But Choo is one of those guys who is just outstanding but unnoticed and the case for him as their best player is complete.  One year ago, I threw out some sabermetric numbers that suggested Shin Soo Choo was the best all around OF in all of MLB, over many more popular names like Ryan Braun, Matt Holliday, Josh Hamilton, Carl Crawford, and the usual all star crowd.  (Holliday was a close second.)   Personally, I think it’s a stretch to call him the definitive best OF in all of MLB, but if you look at what he has done, he is absolutely a good candidate and the only argument for not putting him in the top ten is sheer ignorance…

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    As for Cabrera, I have a hard time even putting him in the argument for best all around shortstop in the American League.  I would draft him for my fantasy team over someone like Alexei Ramirez or Erick Aybar, but that’s not exactly the same.  Cabrera had a good year at the plate, and is doing what he can for a guy pressed into shortstop duty.

    I'd expect some regression.  He had a weak 119/44 K/W, and I assume that is what lead to his .662 OPS after 8/1.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?

    In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Can we get Asdrubal Cabrera in a trade? : FanGraphs does not separate out the per-team WAR for a player -- such as Shin-Soo Choo, Eduardo Perez or Ben Broussard -- who plays for two or more teams in one year. I still prefer FanGraphs for most citations.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    If I'm correctly understanding what you're looking for, Fangraphs does separate out per-team WAR for a player.   Click on "Show Partial Seasons" on the player's page.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share