Catching Playing Time

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Catching Playing Time

    It is the time of year where Varitek really slides and we saw it again last night. Yes, last night he had to catch because he is Beckett's binky, but he should play no more than 3 times every two weeks. 

    After last night Varitek's average has slide to .224 and he left 4 men on base.
    At least pinch hit for him late in games. His hitting is awful as it always is this time of year.


     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    IMHO, I think Beckett should be the ONLY pitcher Tek catches, and Salty needs to play the majority of the games left.Tek should also be PH for when Beckett is out and the game is on the line..I love our Captain, but it is what it is...
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]IMHO, I think Beckett should be the ONLY pitcher Tek catches, and Salty needs to play the majority of the games left.Tek should also be PH for when Beckett is out and the game is on the line..I love our Captain, but it is what it is...
    Posted by southpaw777[/QUOTE]

    Completely agree, but of course Francona plays to Varitek, he of his .224 average and .170 since July 1.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    The catching position is not all about hitting...

    Opponents OPS when 
    VTek catches: .641
    Salty catches: .743

    Our pitcher's ERA when
    VTek catches: 3.27
    Salty catches: 4.41

    Team record when catches most of the game
    VTek: 42-19  (.689 winning pct)
    Salty: 31-26 (.544: about the same as TB's winning pct)

    Go ahead and take away all of Beckett's games with VTek (16-7).
    VTek is still 26-12 with others (.684 winning pct).

    Oh, and for those of you bashing VTek's batting average since July 1st...
     since July 1st...
       The team is 12-3 (80%) in games Vtek has played 9 or more innings.
       The team is 17-8 (68%) in games Salty has played 9 or more innings.
         (The Sox won 73% of Vtek's games in June.)

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    Tek for the most part stabilizes the staff while taking the pressure off of Salty each week...It's a great tandem.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]The catching position is not all about hitting... Opponents OPS when  VTek catches: .641 Salty catches: .743 Our pitcher's ERA when VTek catches: 3.27 Salty catches: 4.41 Team record when catches most of the game VTek: 42-19  (.689 winning pct) Salty: 31-26 (.544: about the same as TB's winning pct) Go ahead and take away all of Beckett's games with VTek (16-7). VTek is still 26-12 with others (.684 winning pct). Oh, and for those of you bashing VTek's batting average since July 1st...  since July 1st...    The team is 12-3 (80%) in games Vtek has played 9 or more innings.    The team is 17-8 (68%) in games Salty has played 9 or more innings.      (The Sox won 73% of Vtek's games in June.)
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    Nice post.

    Posters have brief memories.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    Excellent post Moon.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from therimrattler. Show therimrattler's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    saltalamacchia should play more because he is the future catcher and is a much better hitter at this time.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    It's all luck though. 

    Year after year after year after year after year...

    luck, luck, luck, voodoo, luck, voodoo, luck...

    VTek should play the lottery.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    It's similar with the numbers in hitting/pitching venues, Moon.
    Year after year after year after year after...
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    I agree that few realize the extent of venue inflation or deflation of player's numbers over large enough sample sizes.

    Maybe king Felix is just a prince.

    Maybe Fisk was just an average Joe.

    I know some metrics try to take into account home/away factors, but I don't think they give it enough influence. 

    I'm curious how they come up with their adjustment numbers.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from softylaw. Show softylaw's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    The team is 12-3 (80%) in games Vtek has played 9 or more innings.
       The team is 17-8 (68%) in games Salty has played 9 or more innings.

    Specious, just as W/L record for pitchers has anything to do with performance.

    Varitek can hardly stand up. If they had a 2nd DH for the catcher, he might make sense as a 3rd string catcher.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]I agree that few realize the extent of venue inflation or deflation of player's numbers over large enough sample sizes. Maybe king Felix is just a prince. Maybe Fisk was just an average Joe. I know some metrics try to take into account home/away factors, but I don't think they give it enough influence.  I'm curious how they come up with their adjustment numbers.
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    However it's formulated, it's not accurate, especially when referencing the older parks, like Fenway/Wrigley.

    Felix is a legit talent. H/A career splits:
    Safeco: 3.20 ERA   1.208 WHIP.   .654 OPS
    Away:  3.24 ERA   1.212 WHIP    .671 OPS

    Fisk in Boston:  .284 BA  .356 OBP  .481 SLG  .837 OPS
    Fisk in Chicago: .257 BA  .329 OBP  .438 SLG  .766 OPS


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    The team is 12-3 (80%) in games Vtek has played 9 or more innings.
       The team is 17-8 (68%) in games Salty has played 9 or more innings.

    Specious, just as W/L record for pitchers has anything to do with performance

    Silly clown! I didn't start listing team wins until you used the stat to justify Miller over Wake(after you dumped the ERA & WHIP arguments).

    Varitek can hardly stand up. If they had a 2nd DH for the catcher, he might make sense as a 3rd string catcher

    Yeah, it's all voodoo. Flip the Vtek coin every year and it always comes up heads. Just plain ole voodoo year after year after year after....

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time : However it's formulated, it's not accurate, especially when referencing the older parks, like Fenway/Wrigley. 

    You'd think they'd have used years of data to determine the adjustments, but it does seem so small.

    Maybe it is hard to seperate the home/away differential from the park differential.

    If all parks were exactly the same, I am sure most teams would do better at home. Sports that play with uniform sized fields show significant home/away splits. It must be hard to factor that into a baseball equation as it relates to the actual venue.

    Is Felix a freak who just does better away from home, even though Seattle is a huge park? (if you adjusted his numners, he'd be way better away.)
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from softylaw. Show softylaw's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    No doubt MLB GMs see the huge value in Varitek transformimg team ERA. Expect a bidding war when Varitek becomes a FA and Boras entertains competing offers.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time : [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time : However it's formulated, it's not accurate, especially when referencing the older parks, like Fenway/Wrigley.  You'd think they'd have used years of data to determine the adjustments, but it does seem so small. Maybe it is hard to seperate the home/away differential from the park differential. If all parks were exactly the same, I am sure most teams would do better at home. Sports that play with uniform sized fields show significant

    home/away splits
    . It must be hard to factor that into a baseball equation as it relates to the actual venue. Is Felix a freak who just does better away from home, even though Seattle is a huge park? (if you adjusted his numners, he'd be way better away.)
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    This is the interesting gray area..
    1) You've got the actual park varience in comparison to other parks.

    2) You've got the home advantage factor.

    3) Then you've got a talent like Felix, who has the stuff to make the proper adjustments. I've watched him for years now. This is my take on him:
    There was a ton of hype surrounding this young kid here in Seattle.
     
    He answered it well in his rookie year. He pitched a bit better on the road, possible due to the pressure factor.
    In his first full season, there was a huge H/A differential:
    Safeco: 90 IP   78 H  3.47 ERA  1.147 WHIP  .645 OPS
    AWAY: 100 IP  117 H  5.47 ERA  1.505 WHIP  .800 OPS

    After that, he began to mature (at all levels) and the splits were closer.
    Now the question, beyond having the stuff to make the necessary adjustments to other venues, is If a pitcher pitches as well away from a home pitching venue, isn't he in fact pitching better than the numbers indicate given the fact the home advantage is missing on the road?

    In the same fashion, if RedSox pitchers have a 3.54 road ERA, as opposed to a 4.25 Fenway ERA, aren't they really pitching better on the road than perceived, given the absence of home advantage? 
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    My gut tells me go with Tek but after he gave up 5 runs the other day I don't know now.
     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]It is the time of year where Varitek really slides and we saw it again last night. Yes, last night he had to catch because he is Beckett's binky, but he should play no more than 3 times every two weeks.  After last night Varitek's average has slide to .224 and he left 4 men on base. At least pinch hit for him late in games. His hitting is awful as it always is this time of year.
    Posted by ADG[/QUOTE]

    I think Salty can more than hold his own behind the plate so adding a kid like Lavarnway to the 40 man roster could work well.  The majors certainly are not the minors but considering how quickly Ryan has adapted to every level he could get some key hits for us down the stretch.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]My gut tells me go with Tek but after he gave up 5 runs the other day I don't know now.
    Posted by BurritoT[/QUOTE]

    It's the Sox MO to go with the veterans so Jason will probably be playing as much the remainder of the year.  He is a veteran "like Drew" so hopefully he can dig down deep and help us when it counts most.

    Next season may be the year our team gets much younger.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]The catching position is not all about hitting... Opponents OPS when  VTek catches: .641 Salty catches: .743 Our pitcher's ERA when VTek catches: 3.27 Salty catches: 4.41 Team record when catches most of the game VTek: 42-19  (.689 winning pct) Salty: 31-26 (.544: about the same as TB's winning pct) Go ahead and take away all of Beckett's games with VTek (16-7). VTek is still 26-12 with others (.684 winning pct). Oh, and for those of you bashing VTek's batting average since July 1st...  since July 1st...    The team is 12-3 (80%) in games Vtek has played 9 or more innings.    The team is 17-8 (68%) in games Salty has played 9 or more innings.      (The Sox won 73% of Vtek's games in June.)
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]
    Moon,

    You cannot dispute the numbers but you only removed Beckett's stsrts when looking at Win PCtge. If you remove his starts then those OPS and ERA numbers would get alot closer and thats what Posters are advocating.....let Tek catch Beckett, clearly Beckett is most comfortable with him.....and play Salty the other 4 games....any remaining difference in Opponent Era/OPS would be made up by the dramaticllay widening difference between their offensive capabilities. I love Tek and appreciate what he does for this team but why put blinders on to the fact that he is worn down as he has every year lately....not blaming him....he's up there in age......but we need to put the best team out there.
     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]It gets to a point where it is unbelievable with 2 outs and Runners in Scoring Position. Lots of runs left on base. Good catcher but not the hitter anymore, in the clutch. .162 07 .151 08 .182 09 .111 10 .050 11
    Posted by bobbysu[/QUOTE]

    bobbysu,

    There really isn't an easy way of telling Tek fans the time may be near without upsetting them so it's best just to leave it alone.  Guys like Jason and Wake had some great years but no career is endless.  That's something they need to understand and come to terms with.  Every big hit, or low number of runs allowed when Tek plays just fuels their argument as to why we should keep him.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Catching Playing Time

    In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Catching Playing Time : bobbysu, There really isn't an easy way of telling Tek fans the time may be near without upsetting them so it's best just to leave it alone.  Guys like Jason and Wake had some great years but no career is endless.  That's someting they need to understand and come to terms with.
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    So true.....alot of Yankee fans are going through the same with Jorge Posad now.
     

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