posted at 8/5/2012 1:43 AM EDT
I don't think they should count as much as comparing him to other starting level catchers. they should count but why should sme guy with 20 games played be compared with Salty when we can compare Salty with other starting level catchers. It's similar to like saying some OF is as good a pitcher as Verlander after he throws 1 inning of SO ball. It is not as good a data point IMO.
Boom, you were saying Salty was the worst or 2nd worst MLB catcher at certain things, but the group was only 14-15 catchers. Are there, or are there not 30 MLB starting catchers?
There are only 35 MLB catchers with over 350 innings caught this year.
To get to 30 catchers, the innings cutoff has to be 400 innings. That's a pace of about 600 innings over a season.
I think you are trying to play it both ways by saying salty has played 5 MLB seasons, but wont count 600 innings as a starting catcher.
I quoted ESPN, FANGRAPHS, a leading writer on Fangraphs who had him 84th out of 88 catchers in defensive value.
This is ewactly what I mean by using selective sample sizes. You won't let me expand fangraphs to 30 catchers to more accurately reflect where Salty places among the MLB 30 team's top catchers, but you are OK to use a list of 88 catchers, because it works in favor of your position?
You don't see a contradiction here?
A lot of reputable references. Look at soxprospects on this issue. To them he is a consensus negative defensive catcher who should have been traded at the deadline.
The numbers do show he is a negative this year and over his career, but you don't seem to want to acknowledge that Salty has much better numbers since May 1st.
Had Salty done great in April, but poorly over the last 3 months, I'd be with you 100% on giving Lava his chance sooner than he is probably ready for.
We can agree to disagree. He is not getting traded at this point anyway right. He gets traded next winter or he probably platoons with Lavarnway. We will see what happens. I sincerely hope I'm wrong and he hits 20 more HR in the next month. I just want to win and right now, we are not winning. I'm open to change. I've seen enough to think just maybe we should change our starting catcher. I agree we might lose some value with Salty but i sure would like to see what Lavarnway has got, and allow him to develop a little at the mlb level so we can improve our options next year with him or without him.
Boom, we all want us to win now. What we are questioning is the choice of one of our strengths to try and improve on. You have spent a large percent of your energy on trying to show that of all the positions on this team, a change at catcher is the most called for...
-despite the fact that Salty has done well with the staff for 3 months.
-despite the fact that Salty actually rates as about the 21st worst out of 30 MLb starting catchers on defense, not 29th, and these numbers incluse a pathetic April.
-despite the fact that the area you are most critical of Salty on (defense) is the area everyone says Lava needs more work on.
-despite the fact that Lava is just 24 and would have lost a year of team control in exchange for a few more days or weeks this year.
-despite the fact that increasing Salty's trade value depends on him playing FT or near FT.
Trading Salty this past deadline might have been the best idea, but none of us know of any specific deals mentioned, if any. Trading Lava might turn out to be the team's choice as well, but it better be as par of a package for a top notch starter.