Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from razcreation. Show razcreation's posts

    Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Clay is 29 years old. Will be hitting 30 years of age in August. He can never last a full season. He always hits the DL. He struggled last fall and it continues into this season. His career record is 58-34(could be 58-35 if they lose today) with ERA around 3.70. He not getting any younger. I think we seen his best. Maybe package him in a deal to land another bat? Call up top prospect Henry Owens to replace Clay in rotation?


     


    Some team may take a flyer on Clay.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Buch does not have a long history of missing a lot of starts.


    Games started (all leagues combined):


    2007: 26


    2008: 26


    2009: 32


    2010: 29


    2011: 14


    2012: 30


    2013: 18


     


    Sox4ever

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac35. Show pinstripezac35's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Buch does not have a long history of missing a lot of starts.


     


    Games started (all leagues combined):


     


    2007: 26


     


    2008: 26


     


    2009: 32


     


    2010: 29


     


    2011: 14


     


    2012: 30


     


    2013: 18


     


     


     


    Sox4ever


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


    U might want 2 double check those numbers moon

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:


     


    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


     


     


    Buch does not have a long history of missing a lot of starts. 


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    Games started (all leagues combined):


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2007: 26


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2008: 26


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2009: 32


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2010: 29


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2011: 14


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2012: 30


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    2013: 18


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    Sox4ever


     


     


     





    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


     


     


     


     


     


     


    U might want 2 double check those numbers moon


     


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


     


     


    They are combined ML and minor league starts totals as I stated in my post above.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    I think it's too early to call for that. For the moment I will just say that Clay doesn't do very well when he starts after spending the night at Fenway. Perhaps he should forgo this strategy for the future and just spring for a room at the Commonwealth or the Lenox for these quick turnaround games.


    "It is not down in any map...trueplaces never are...." ( Melville)

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from razcreation. Show razcreation's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Clay has not pitched well to start this season and spend months last year on DL. When he returned he was not the same SP hence why we never heard much about him during post season. He cannot stay healthy. He will be turning 30 this August. I think it maybe time to deal him instead of paying him. We got a tall lefty in minors named Ownens who has very good stuff.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac35. Show pinstripezac35's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    They are combined ML and minor league starts totals.


     


    ok got it wasn't sure had no idea what U meant by all leagues


    stiil I think his point has merit


    over the last few yrs


    not once 200 inn


     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to razcreation's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Clay is 29 years old. Will be hitting 30 years of age in August. He can never last a full season. He always hits the DL. He struggled last fall and it continues into this season. His career record is 58-34(could be 58-35 if they lose today) with ERA around 3.70. He not getting any younger. I think we seen his best. Maybe package him in a deal to land another bat? Call up top prospect Henry Owens to replace Clay in rotation?


     


     


     


    Some team may take a flyer on Clay.


    [/QUOTE]WOW !!!!!      RADICAL to say the least !!   You make BILL-806 look mild here !!!!    BTW, it is now 6-3 as the Sox have just scored 3 runs !!


     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?


    They are combined ML and minor league starts totals.


     



    ok got it wasn't sure had no idea what U meant by all leagues



    stiil I think his point has merit



    over the last few yrs



    not once 200 inn


     


    I never tried to claim he was an iron man. He is far from that.


    Buch is young enough that expecting several seasons of 200+ IP is not such a big deal. Many SP'ers have their innings limited until 25 or 26 years old. 


    Buch has been hurt 2 of the last 3 years. That is concerning to me. I get it.


    The intital post claimed he never lasts a full season. I'd say 26 starts at ages 22 & 23 is more than the norm. I'd say 32 and 29 starts at ages 24 & 25 is better than the norm. 30 starts in 2012 could be considered a full season, so basically, he's had 2 of the last 7 seasons with less than expected games started numbers. That's hardly supportive evidence of his claim.


     


    Sox4ever

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BogieAt12oclock. Show BogieAt12oclock's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Buchholz is like this 'new, improved' web site; he stinks.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    I've been saying for years they need to deal him while they can still get something in return for him.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    I've been saying for years they need to deal him while they can still get something in return for him.


    [/QUOTE]B I N G O    DAT  !!!!


     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    I believe Buchholz had an ERA over 9.00 after about a month in 2012, as did Doubront in 2013. The Sox haven't seemed inclined to yank guys from the rotation after the first few starts...they will give Clay plenty of time to turn things around.


     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Out of the rotation is too mild.  The Sox should apply to the Commissioner to have him banned from MLB.  I mean that's what needs to happen when a guy misses starts and/or has a lousy start to a season. 


     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to Flapjack07's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    I believe Buchholz had an ERA over 9.00 after about a month in 2012, as did Doubront in 2013. The Sox haven't seemed inclined to yank guys from the rotation after the first few starts...they will give Clay plenty of time to turn things around.


     


     


    [/QUOTE]

    In 2012, Bucholz was horrible in his first six starts, then had an ERA around 3.50 the rest of the year. And he was more dominant than the 3.50 ERA suggests, because if you exclude the last start of the year against the Yankees when everyone basically had it packed in, his ERA was 3.16 during that span.


    His problem at the start of that year is the same problem he's had this year -- leaving stuff up. I suspect that within a start or two, he'll get his form back and go on another tear.


     


     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Well think about it.  He's good for 20 starts a year, right?  So he's had 4 starts already or 20% of what his feeble body can give us.  Half of those starts were major stinkers.  If he's got 16 starts left in him, do you really want to allow him to stink up the place 8 more times; remembering he will heavily tax our pen when he does that.  Just so we can maybe get 8 QS between now and the end of the season? 

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     So he's had 4 starts already ... Half of those starts were major stinkers.  If he's got 16 starts left in him, do you really want to allow him to stink up the place 8 more times[/QUOTE]



    Hahaha...this is great. Because everyone knows the results of your first 4 games are guaranteed to repeat themselves proportionally all season long.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    As DAD would say ...........    "SON, are we CONCERNED yet " ????

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    Mr. Softy out already....What a complete Joke.  How can anyone defend this guy?  He's the equivalen of a 1st round bust in Football.  Just cut the guy already.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    SOFTY ????   Who is that ????

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to tcal2-'s comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Mr. Softy out already....What a complete Joke.  How can anyone defend this guy?  He's the equivalen of a 1st round bust in Football.  Just cut the guy already.


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    Even with his injuries, since 2010, Buchholz i #46 in WAR, #13 in ERA, and maybe the 3rd or 4th highest winning percentage.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from 67redsox. Show 67redsox's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Well think about it.  He's good for 20 starts a year, right?  So he's had 4 starts already or 20% of what his feeble body can give us.  Half of those starts were major stinkers.  If he's got 16 starts left in him, do you really want to allow him to stink up the place 8 more times; remembering he will heavily tax our pen when he does that.  Just so we can maybe get 8 QS between now and the end of the season? 


    [/QUOTE]



    Buch is fragile there is no doubt about that.  His slow starts combined with his stints of the DL makes me wonder if he is worth the money.


    Unfortunatly buch isn't the only problem the sox have!











     


     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


     


    They are combined ML and minor league starts totals.


     


     


     



    ok got it wasn't sure had no idea what U meant by all leagues


     



    stiil I think his point has merit


     



    over the last few yrs


     



    not once 200 inn


     


     


     


    I never tried to claim he was an iron man. He is far from that.


     


    Buch is young enough that expecting several seasons of 200+ IP is not such a big deal. Many SP'ers have their innings limited until 25 or 26 years old. 


     


    Buch has been hurt 2 of the last 3 years. That is concerning to me. I get it.


     


    The intital post claimed he never lasts a full season. I'd say 26 starts at ages 22 & 23 is more than the norm. I'd say 32 and 29 starts at ages 24 & 25 is better than the norm. 30 starts in 2012 could be considered a full season, so basically, he's had 2 of the last 7 seasons with less than expected games started numbers. That's hardly supportive evidence of his claim.


     


     


     


    Sox4ever


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


    I would argue Buccholz can't be considered 'young' anymore, and expecting any 200 inning seasons at any point over the rest of his career would be extremely optimistic.


    As he approaches 30, 2 of 3 years have been seriously hampered by injury. That, combined with what has been a widely talked about issue of him NOT taking eating seriously...within the past year, I believe it was Bradford who stated Clay eats fast food more than you'd imagine, or like to think. He's not in his early 20s, and I think the cumulative effects of seriously bad habits are catching up to him...perhaps already have. After he threw his no hitter in his second career start, the stories started to come out about how much he was loving the night life, supermodels, and being young. Not so different from Gronk or Seguin.


    If he can turn that corner, and treat this like a FULL TIME, YEAR ROUND JOB, and take better care of himself...he COULD turn the corner and surprise many, including me. But this is the post-PED era, he does not have a large frame, and he's almost 30. I honestly think he has maybe 3-4 effective years left, if that. At 32, he'll have about 10 major league years on that thin arm and frame. Combined with poor habits. 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?


    Just checked. Clay has NEVER had a 200 inning season. His 3 highs are 189, 173, 108. 200 isn't happening this year, I'll go out on a limb and state that now. Next season at 30? 2016 at 31?


    His ceiling is realistically 175 innings. HOPING for more is fine, but it's hard to justify that optimism after looking at the facts.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from youkillus. Show youkillus's posts

    Re: Clay Buchholz Out Of Rotation?

    The story on Buch was always one of "potential", everyone fell in love with the command of his four pitches.


    The hope that he would develop and be a force in the league can now be put to rest, he ain't getting any better.


    The sad reality is that something is missing, one might suspect it's his diet, but it's not. It's that thing that Schilling had, that heart beyond his tremendous talent. Buch would rather grease up his hair to gain a "potential" edge on the hitter, than to settle down and really work on his craft. I heard another team's announcer marvel at Buchholz's running speed, and that he was a "tremendous" athlete, and there might be the problem. Everything has always come easy for Buch, heck he threw a no-hitter in his second start! 


    We all have known that natural born athlete that just didn't have the ability to be a true winner, Buch is not the pitcher that Jon Lester is, and never will be. It was a nice story, all this potential, but at the end of the day, you can't eat potential. 


    Buch is no longer young, he turns thirty this season, meanwhile, Jon Lester is also thirty, is there any doubt, as to which pitcher is the "veteran", which one is a gamer, and which pitcher you would throw out there to win one game?

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share