Closers in the postseason

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Closers in the postseason

    Sometimes it seems that the vital importance, and stressful nature, of the closer position only becomes really clear in the postseason. 

    Last night Valverde blew a save that would have moved the Tigers to the next round.  Now they face elimination.

    Jim Johnson lost Game 1 and blew the save in Game 3.  If he had done his job twice it's quite possible the Yankees would now be booking tee times.

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Sometimes it seems that the vital importance, and stressful nature, of the closer position only becomes really clear in the postseason. 

    Last night Valverde blew a save that would have moved the Tigers to the next round.  Now they face elimination.

    Jim Johnson lost Game 1 and blew the save in Game 3.  If he had done his job twice it's quite possible the Yankees would now be booking tee times.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    The post season is prime choking season. Separates the men from the boys.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    I think closers are overrated in the regular season and underrated in the post-season.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think closers are overrated in the regular season and underrated in the post-season.

    [/QUOTE]

    Interesting take - I like it.

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think closers are overrated in the regular season and underrated in the post-season.

    [/QUOTE]


    Overrated, maybe, but not unimportant.

    5 of the top 10 closers in baseball this year, are still playing.

    2 others were on teams that lost the one game playoff.

    A good closer may not be vital to contend, but they certainly help.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    all great posts.

    it is entirely different closing in the PO's.

    honestly...who didnt know ibanez was gonna hit one out in the 9th?  it crossed my mind for sure.  League leader in saves made it a reality with a fat-ball in LH wheelhouse. 

    and neither the game tying nor the game winner were yankee stadium "cheapies".  (403 & 390 respectively).

     

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    I think closers are overrated in the regular season and underrated in the post-season.

    [/QUOTE]


    Overrated, maybe, but not unimportant.

    5 of the top 10 closers in baseball this year, are still playing.

    2 others were on teams that lost the one game playoff.

    A good closer may not be vital to contend, but they certainly help.

    [/QUOTE]


    What I mean by "overrated" in the regular season is that:

    • Closers can pile up lots of flashy numbers in the regular season, esp. saves, esp. if you close for a good team that gives you lots of opportunities to earn a save
    • Lots of "saves" are nothing of the kind, just 3 outs with a lead of 2 (or is it 3?)
    • It's relatively easy to find or create a closer that has a few good seasons, but few last
    • Blow a save/lose a game here or there?  Usually no big deal, though there are exceptions, aren't there Mr. Papelbon?  (I like him, btw)

     

    Whereas in the post-season:

    • Virtually every game is of critical importance so the pressure is intense and many regular season compilers just can't cut it.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    It should be noted that hardly any of the game's greatest closers have escaped blowing at least one critical save in their careers. 

    Rivera had blown saves in 2001 and 2004 that cost one title and maybe two.

    Paps had 25 scoreless postseason innings before he blew Game 3 in 2009.

    Eckersley gave up crushing blows to Gibson in 1988 and Robbie Alomar in 1992.

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think closers are overrated in the regular season and underrated in the post-season.

    [/QUOTE]


    Overrated, maybe, but not unimportant.

    5 of the top 10 closers in baseball this year, are still playing.

    2 others were on teams that lost the one game playoff.

    A good closer may not be vital to contend, but they certainly help.

    [/QUOTE]


    It is easier to pile up saves when your teams were winning going toward to the 9th innings

    Look at Boston, they never lead in most of the games this year, and how the heck the closer can pick up a save?  Who know this kid from Boston is as good as Johnson of the Orioles or the Yankees.

    Most of the times, these closers are more over-rated than the ones are under-rated.  We need to look at closers in the past five years, and whoever are in the top five every year are the real good closer.  Right now, most of them are just one year wonder!!

     

     

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:
    [QUOTE]


    What I mean by "overrated" in the regular season is that:

    • Closers can pile up lots of flashy numbers in the regular season, esp. saves, esp. if you close for a good team that gives you lots of opportunities to earn a save
    • Lots of "saves" are nothing of the kind, just 3 outs with a lead of 2 (or is it 3?)
    • It's relatively easy to find or create a closer that has a few good seasons, but few last
    • Blow a save/lose a game here or there?  Usually no big deal, though there are exceptions, aren't there Mr. Papelbon?  (I like him, btw)

     

    Whereas in the post-season:

    • Virtually every game is of critical importance so the pressure is intense and many regular season compilers just can't cut it.

    [/QUOTE]

    The maximum run differential to earn a save is 3 runs.

    But a good closer can be the difference between a team being 69-93 or 93-69.  I think Sox fans can attest to that based on the number of blown saves (22) our closers had this season. 

    What if that number was more in line with the better teams, that would have added approximately 10 or more wins to the total which would have kept the team in contention longer and might have set a winning attitude in that dugout. Although using the 2012 Red Sox as an example is not a good idea since their problems went much deeper than blown saves.

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to Soxdog67's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:
    [QUOTE]


    What I mean by "overrated" in the regular season is that:

    • Closers can pile up lots of flashy numbers in the regular season, esp. saves, esp. if you close for a good team that gives you lots of opportunities to earn a save
    • Lots of "saves" are nothing of the kind, just 3 outs with a lead of 2 (or is it 3?)
    • It's relatively easy to find or create a closer that has a few good seasons, but few last
    • Blow a save/lose a game here or there?  Usually no big deal, though there are exceptions, aren't there Mr. Papelbon?  (I like him, btw)

     

    Whereas in the post-season:

    • Virtually every game is of critical importance so the pressure is intense and many regular season compilers just can't cut it.

    [/QUOTE]

    The maximum run differential to earn a save is 3 runs.

    But a good closer can be the difference between a team being 69-93 or 93-69.  I think Sox fans can attest to that based on the number of blown saves (22) our closers had this season. 

    What if that number was more in line with the better teams, that would have added approximately 10 or more wins to the total which would have kept the team in contention longer and might have set a winning attitude in that dugout. Although using the 2012 Red Sox as an example is not a good idea since their problems went much deeper than blown saves.

     [/QUOTE]

    Hold on, that presumes a team with a "top closer" has zero blown saves!  The 2011 Sox had 16 blown saves.  The 2012 Yankees had 14 blown saves.

    A "top closer" cannot make up 24 games in the standings!

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Closers in the postseason

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    But a good closer can be the difference between a team being 69-93 or 93-69.  I think Sox fans can attest to that based on the number of blown saves (22) our closers had this season. 

    What if that number was more in line with the better teams, that would have added approximately 10 or more wins to the total which would have kept the team in contention longer and might have set a winning attitude in that dugout. Although using the 2012 Red Sox as an example is not a good idea since their problems went much deeper than blown saves.

     [/QUOTE]

    Hold on, that presumes a team with a "top closer" has zero blown saves!  The 2011 Sox had 16 blown saves.  The 2012 Yankees had 14 blown saves.

    A "top closer" cannot make up 24 games in the standings!

    [/QUOTE]

    Actually I did not assume that at all...if you notice I said the Sox might have had 10 more wins if they were at the top of the league in fewest blown saves...of the 22 blown saves they actually had in 2012 I was assuming they'd still have around 12, which would have put them around 3rd lowest.

    But as I also said, the Sox were not a good example for this argument...but maybe the Angels are...they also had 22 blown saves this year and just missed the playoffs. If they had a decent closer and won 10 more games themselves they would have won the West and might still be playing.

     

     

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