Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

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    Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    Fangraphs is the best stat crunching website out there that shows true monetary values for a players season. It is unbiased and used by all major league teams as a resource.

    Pedroia - 30.1 million
    Ellsbury - 26.4 million
    Gonzalez - 23.1 million
    Youkilis - 16.8 million
    Ortiz - 12.4 million

    Our 1-5 lineup is nasty with 3 MVP candidates and two professional hitters. The fact that one doesn't field and the other is the 2nd worst defensive third baseman in the AL hurts their value (but Ortiz was at 20.4/25.7 in 06/07).

    Everyone else is really in injury/platoon situations that downgrade value.
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]Fangraphs is the best stat crunching website out there that shows true monetary values for a players season. It is unbiased and used by all major league teams as a resource. Pedroia - 30.1 million Ellsbury - 26.4 million Gonzalez - 23.1 million Youkilis - 16.8 million Ortiz - 12.4 million Our 1-5 lineup is nasty with 3 MVP candidates and two professional hitters. The fact that one doesn't field and the other is the 2nd worst defensive third baseman in the AL hurts their value (but Ortiz was at 20.4/25.7 in 06/07). Everyone else is really in injury/platoon situations that downgrade value.
    Posted by rameakap[/QUOTE]


    Thanks Rameakap ...

       Impressive.  With a top 5 like that ... the others CAN afford to be much more average.  Yet, I think Reddick is a move up as well and Salty is learning and playing well enough to be near the top in his postition.  If we get "No Pop" Lowery back at his hot bat pre-injury self ... we will really be incredible.  Uh, more incredible.
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters : Thanks Rameakap ...    Impressive.  With a top 5 like that ... the others CAN afford to be much more average.  Yet, I think Reddick is a move up as well and Salty is learning and playing well enough to be near the top in his postition.  If we get "No Pop" Lowery back at his hot bat pre-injury self ... we will really be incredible.  Uh, more incredible.
    Posted by SinceYaz[/QUOTE]

    Scutaro has been a better SS since the start of 2010 than Jeter... stats prove it:-)

    Drew earned his contract/14m in his first 4 years, I never attacked him or Theo for it during that span... but this season has been a disaster obviously, thankfully we've had Reddick do so much better than expected.

    Best catching duo as well


     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    It has only been Crawford who has really kept the lineup from being amazing as he was worth nearly 30 million (fangraphs) last season.

    Luckily, since his return from injury, he's looked good, especially of late in August with a .406 avg and 1.112 OPS.

    If people can accept that a 20 million man is a 6-7 hitter, and Crawford can focus on his own play in that role and not let the contract or how he's percieved bug him, then a return to his .305/.355 numbers of the past few years with more steals should be expected.
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    I think Scott Boras pays off fangraphs
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]It has only been Crawford who has really kept the lineup from being amazing as he was worth nearly 30 million (fangraphs) last season. Luckily, since his return from injury, he's looked good, especially of late in August with a .406 avg and 1.112 OPS. If people can accept that a 20 million man is a 6-7 hitter, and Crawford can focus on his own play in that role and not let the contract or how he's percieved bug him, then a return to his .305/.355 numbers of the past few years with more steals should be expected.
    Posted by rameakap[/QUOTE]

    I believe that Crawford will be much better next year.  I still think he is overpaid, but may feel differently after next season. 
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    It has only been Crawford who has really kept the lineup from being amazing as he was worth nearly 30 million (fangraphs) last season.

    Evidently, Theo plays fantasy goo goo ga ga baseball and awards a 142m Contract based upon "WAR". It's a joke!

    No GM with a grain of intelligence pay any attention to WAR. This is what fantasy minds who follow baseball for a couple of months google ga ga.

    AGon is the key to the offense. If Ellsbury spent another year at API, AGon would still have big numers. Ellsbury is not an MVP candidate in any minds but Boston bigoted minds.

    Granderson is a far superior baseball player, and a terrific role model for work ethic. Reddick and Kalish can replace Ellsbury for next to zero. WAR, what a joke!

     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    I hope he is his old self and hot thru October Susan

    I agree about him being much better next year, but just like Ells may never have a 2011 again, Carl may never have a 2010 again.

    Of course no doom and gloom from me.... multiple seasons where they are both around .305/.360/.490 with 12-16 HR's (Craw) and 17-22 HR's (Ells), 33-38 2B's, 5-8 triples, 40-50 steals, 115 (Ells) and 100 (Craw) runs about 85 RBI's and excellent D (Craw) and good D (Ells) should be expected. They are both in their primes.

    And those would both be fangraphs seasons over 20 million:-)
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]Fangraphs is the best stat crunching website out there that shows true monetary values for a players season. It is unbiased and used by all major league teams as a resource. Pedroia - 30.1 million Ellsbury - 26.4 million Gonzalez - 23.1 million Youkilis - 16.8 million Ortiz - 12.4 million Our 1-5 lineup is nasty with 3 MVP candidates and two professional hitters. The fact that one doesn't field and the other is the 2nd worst defensive third baseman in the AL hurts their value (but Ortiz was at 20.4/25.7 in 06/07). Everyone else is really in injury/platoon situations that downgrade value.
    Posted by rameakap[/QUOTE]

    If you take just the batting component of fangraph's value metric:
    AGon  #6
    Ellsb   #11
    Pedey #12
    Papi    #16
    Youk   #26

    By team and by position:
    C:    7th at $13.6M (Great value compared to their contracts)
    1B:  1st at $23.1M (Still a value, even at avg salary) 
    2B:  1st at $ 32M    (What a bargain!)
    SS: 17th at $8M      (Still a plus)
    3B:  3rd at $18.9M  (A great bargain as well)
    LF: 10th at $12.2M (about a $10M loss so far)
    CF:  2nd at $26.4M (Anothe super bargain)
    RF: 22nd at $6.4M  (About a $9M loss, but improving)
    DH:  2nd at $12.4M (About even)
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    Wow, according to Moonslow, great value in record setting payroll. WAR is a joke!
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    By team and by position:
    C:    7th at $13.6M (Great value compared to their contracts)
    1B:  1st at $23.1M (Still a value, even at avg salary) 
    2B:  1st at $ 32M    (What a bargain!)
    SS: 17th at $8M      (Still a plus)
    3B:  3rd at $18.9M  (A great bargain as well)
    LF: 10th at $12.2M (about a $10M loss so far)
    CF:  2nd at $26.4M (Anothe super bargain)
    RF: 22nd at $6.4M  (About a $9M loss, but improving)
    DH:  2nd at $12.4M (About even)

    Well I'd say Theo has done a solid job and most of the players have done what is expected of them with some, esp those who slightly exceeded, being GREAT value guys. Drew is gone after this season, RF in the next few years will be a great way to determine his GM skills.

    Scutaro, Lowrie and Iglesias will have SS and 9 hitter covered just fine. I can't wait to see the value fangraphs gives a SS who hits .245/.310/.390 with 3 HR's,17 doubles and 40 RBI's but wins multiple gold gloves. They value defense very much.

    As for Crawford, he prob won't ever be a near 30m value guy again. But all he has to do is be almost his 2009 self to earn more than his salary.

    That year was 156 games of excellent D. .305/.364/.462 w/ 15 HR's, 68 RBI's, 96 runs and 60 steals.

    Put him down for 142 games of very good D, .302/.347/.473 w/ 17 HR's, 83 RBI's, 91 runs and 45 steals next year:-) Boom 22-23 million in value.
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]I think Scott Boras pays off fangraphs
    Posted by softybabe[/QUOTE]

    Softybabe? LOL  That's funny.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    As for Crawford, he prob won't ever be a near 30m value guy again. But all he has to do is be almost his 2009 self to earn more than his salary.

    For fangraphs, yes, but I think they over-rate defense for LF'ers, especially in Fenway. To me, even if CC puts up 2009 numbers x 7, he's still overpaid.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]Fangraphs is the best stat crunching website out there that shows true monetary values for a players season. It is unbiased and used by all major league teams as a resource. Pedroia - 30.1 million Ellsbury - 26.4 million Gonzalez - 23.1 million Youkilis - 16.8 million Ortiz - 12.4 million Our 1-5 lineup is nasty with 3 MVP candidates and two professional hitters. The fact that one doesn't field and the other is the 2nd worst defensive third baseman in the AL hurts their value (but Ortiz was at 20.4/25.7 in 06/07). Everyone else is really in injury/platoon situations that downgrade value.
    Posted by rameakap[/QUOTE]

    Interesting ram thanks, I haven't been much a Stat guy in years and don't really believe half of them have much significance, but this ones refreshing because it's not the same old repetitive stuff.
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    Your welcome craze

    and yes Moon, sometimes fangraphs make you go 'what?' or at leats 'thats a lot more than I thought' like when it claimed 2008 seasons by Ellsbury and Cameron were worth around 20 million
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    I still thin WAR is better than any other single stat in evaluating how good a player is overall.
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]I still thin WAR is better than any other single stat in evaluating how good a player is overall.
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    Moon,

    I see you were careful to highlight "Single Stat"....so on that I would agree but no GM or team should use one Single Stat to judge players or make personnel decisions.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    Yes, or a single metric as well.

    I am sure that most teams have their own rating system. Some may be simila to WAR, some may not.

    Bill James has been used by the Sox. He really values OBP, but also recognizes Slg% as important as well. I think I read once that he thinks OPS overemphasizes Slg%, and that he would prefer something that counted OBP as a 3:2 ratio with Slg% as more valuable.

    I like the OPS stat a lot, but know that it is not everything, and that OBP is more important to Slg%. I trust James to know that after studying stats complied over decades. He worked out that the stat that had the highest correlation to runs scored was his adjusted OPS. 

    (James experts, please correct me if I am wrong.)
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    On defensive metrics, I found this interesting blurb in a Sports Illustrated piece about childhood teammates Carl Crawford and Michael Bourn:

    A new metric developed by statistician John Dewan and his team at Baseball Info Solutions sheds more dramatic light on Bourn's defensive prowess. Its Batted Ball Timer, which will be covered in Fielding Bible, Vol. III next spring, times how long a batted ball is airborne, giving a new perspective on range. Its findings suggest that nearly every ball in the air less than three seconds to the outfield is a sharply hit line drive and almost always a hit; almost every ball with a hang time of five seconds or more is a lazy fly ball that's inevitably caught.

    Outfield defense, therefore, is what happens in that two-second interval between three and five, and as rated by the Timer Plus/Minus System, Bourn saved a staggering 26 runs in 2010 alone.


    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/joe_lemire/08/08/Crawford.Bourn/index.html#ixzz1UlU1CFxR
     
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    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]I think Scott Boras pays off fangraphs
    Posted by softybabe[/QUOTE]

    i think you just HATE to be wrong all the time!
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from canetime. Show canetime's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]It has only been Crawford who has really kept the lineup from being amazing as he was worth nearly 30 million (fangraphs) last season. Evidently, Theo plays fantasy goo goo ga ga baseball and awards a 142m Contract based upon "WAR". It's a joke! No GM with a grain of intelligence pay any attention to WAR. This is what fantasy minds who follow baseball for a couple of months google ga ga. AGon is the key to the offense. If Ellsbury spent another year at API, AGon would still have big numers. Ellsbury is not an MVP candidate in any minds but Boston bigoted minds. Granderson is a far superior baseball player, and a terrific role model for work ethic. Reddick and Kalish can replace Ellsbury for next to zero. WAR, what a joke!
    Posted by softylaw[/QUOTE]
    YOU LOSE AGAIN!
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxforlife22. Show soxforlife22's posts

    Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters

    In Response to Re: Current fangraphs value of Sox top hitters:
    [QUOTE]Yes, or a single metric as well. I am sure that most teams have their own rating system. Some may be simila to WAR, some may not. Bill James has been used by the Sox. He really values OBP, but also recognizes Slg% as important as well. I think I read once that he thinks OPS overemphasizes Slg%, and that he would prefer something that counted OBP as a 3:2 ratio with Slg% as more valuable. I like the OPS stat a lot, but know that it is not everything, and that OBP is more important to Slg%. I trust James to know that after studying stats complied over decades. He worked out that the stat that had the highest correlation to runs scored was his adjusted OPS.  (James experts, please correct me if I am wrong.)
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]
    i once read about a sabermetrics guy who said obp is three times as important as slg%
     
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