Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    When Dempster is moved to the pen for the playoffs, I think he might make a fine long relief guy, although hopefully we won't need one.

    His last 9 starts...

    9/17  4.1 IP with 0 ERs

    9/11  5.0 IP with 1 ER

    9/4    2.1 IP with 0 ERs

    8/30  4.1 IP with 0 ERs (6 IP w 1 ER)

    8/18  2.1 IP with 2 ERs

    8/13  4.2 IP with 0 ERs (7 IP with 1 ER)

    8/7    2.1 IP with 0 ERs (5.1 IP with 2 ER)

    8/1    2.1 IP with 1 ER  (4.1 IP w 2 ERs)

    7/27  4.0 IP with 0 ERs (5.0 with 1 ER)

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    Yes, he may be needed to keep a game from getting out of hand, and I'd rather he came in in such a situation than Doubront.  But I guess Doubront would be in the pen too.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to soxnewmex's comment:

    Yes, he may be needed to keep a game from getting out of hand, and I'd rather he came in in such a situation than Doubront.  But I guess Doubront would be in the pen too.




    I don't think you can have a guy in the pen who comes in and cannot throw strikes. Doubront was great for us for a large part of the season, but he seems to have hit a wall recently. In the six games since Aug 10 his ERA is 6.60 with 15 walks in 30 IP. Thats not a guy I want in the pen. This time of year you have to go with what is working well; Doubront is not working well at all. So thanks for your help getting here Felix; here's your coat.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    The answer is going to come from one of the Top 4 Starters - Lackey, Buck, Lackey, Peavy.


    With a 4 man rotation and the off days, there will be the opportunity for these guys to pitch an inning here or there in relief in between starts.

    The roster will have 7 relievers....Koji, Taz, Breslow are the locks, right?  (Koji in the 9th and mix Taz and Brewslow in the 8th).  So that's 4 spots left for:

    Doubrant, Dempster, Morales, Workman (You can keep Thorton w/ the team in case he needs to replace someone on the DL but I think that's it in terms of PS worthy guys).  All these guys can go 2 innings.


    Not a ton of confidence in the pen here so Farrell is going to have to be really prepared and really creative.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from SFBostonFan. Show SFBostonFan's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    Excellent research on stats by Moonslav and I agree with Soxnewmex that Doubront too should be in long relief but 2nd choice to Dempster.

    Demspter pitched a good game last night, 3 hits/2 runs in 6 innings. Our problem is that we only got 3 hits all night but their pitcher gave us 6 walks in 6 innings & we left a lot of men on base not able to get a key hit.

    This Balt team aggravates me as I'm reminded they knocked us out of playoffs 2 years ago. There is no way we can not win the Division but I'd like home field so I believe it's key to have the best record so let's knock them out of the playoffs !!!

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs


    I do not agree Dempster can't throw strikes because I think he definitely can.  I think he nibbles at the strike zone because he doesn't have great stuff and can get hammered if he attacks the strike zone.  If he is on the playoff roster, he might be OK for long relief, but I would not bring him into a late and close game because, as I say, he relies on nibbling. 

    Doubront could also do long relief provided the rest has rejuvenated him.  He does have good stuff, but also control issues.  Again, not an ideal for pitching late and close. 

    Right now I think the four best short relievers are Uehara, Breslow, Tazawa, and Morales or Workman, with the first two being much better than the other three. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:

    The answer is going to come from one of the Top 4 Starters - Lackey, Buck, Lackey, Peavy.


    With a 4 man rotation and the off days, there will be the opportunity for these guys to pitch an inning here or there in relief in between starts.

    The roster will have 7 relievers....Koji, Taz, Breslow are the locks, right?  (Koji in the 9th and mix Taz and Brewslow in the 8th).  So that's 4 spots left for:

    Doubrant, Dempster, Morales, Workman (You can keep Thorton w/ the team in case he needs to replace someone on the DL but I think that's it in terms of PS worthy guys).  All these guys can go 2 innings.


    Not a ton of confidence in the pen here so Farrell is going to have to be really prepared and really creative.



    This is not the time of year for pitchers to be on the roster and try to work out what is wrong with them. Doubront has sucked for over a month now. I keep Thornton, who has a shot at getting guys out, and jettison Doubront.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to maxbialystock's comment:


    I do not agree Dempster can't throw strikes because I think he definitely can. 



    Pumpsie Green was referring to Doubront when he said he can't throw strikes. 

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    If you need a long man in the playoffs, it is not a good thing.

    Stabbed by Foulke.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    In response to maxbialystock's comment:


    I do not agree Dempster can't throw strikes because I think he definitely can. 

     

     



    Pumpsie Green was referring to Doubront when he said he can't throw strikes. 

     

     



    Correct. I think Dempster CAN throw strikes and would make a good long relief man. Not so with Doubront. There is no time for him to work out his problems in the playoffs.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    If you need a long man in the playoffs, it is not a good thing.

    Stabbed by Foulke.



    It's inevitable you're going to need one at least once.

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    Uehara Tazawa Breslow Morales Dempster Workman Thorton Doubront, that's 8.  What about Britton, does he have a shot?  He seemed to be in favor for a while then sort of disappeared.  I know they're talking good about Morales right now, Doubront they're resting and intend to start again soon.  Workman has been good at times, and he gets the call more often than Britton, but he's been inconsistent recently.  Thorton I guess they're hoping starts pitching well consistently.  If they go with 7 then they very well may leave Doubront off the roster.  If they need a long reliever or go into extra innings then you have Dempster Workman and Morales who can go mutiple innings.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    You need someone who can throw 3 innings.

    There may be a game where a starter throw a lot of pitches and needs to come out after 4 IP.  Even if that happens once it's worth having a "long man".

    You also need one for extra innings assuming you've already used your primary relievers.  If that happans once it's also worth it.

    What we don't need is more than 1 long reliever.  Which is why there is some redundancy w/ Doubrant AND Dempster and to an extent Workman.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to andrewmitch's comment:

    You need someone who can throw 3 innings.

    There may be a game where a starter throw a lot of pitches and needs to come out after 4 IP.  Even if that happens once it's worth having a "long man".

    You also need one for extra innings assuming you've already used your primary relievers.  If that happans once it's also worth it.

    What we don't need is more than 1 long reliever.  Which is why there is some redundancy w/ Doubrant AND Dempster and to an extent Workman.

     



    I tend to agree in theory, but Workman, Dempster & Doubront can also go 1 inning. Are they any worse than Thornton, Morales, or Britton.

    My guess is that we go with 10-11 pitchers, since we should have plenty of rest going into the first series and there are more days off than the regular season. The 7 sure pitchers:

    1) Buccholz

    2) Lester

    3) Peavy

    4) Lackey

    5) Uehara

    6) Tazawa

    7) Breslow

    My current ranking of the rest

    8) Dempster

    9) Morales

    10) Doubront

    11) Thornton/ Workman

     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to manosome's comment:

    In response to soxnewmex's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Yes, he may be needed to keep a game from getting out of hand, and I'd rather he came in in such a situation than Doubront.  But I guess Doubront would be in the pen too.

     



    I agree. Watching Doubront pitch is a painful experience.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I had a long argument with a poster earlier this year about Doubront's conditioning and attitude. I am still wondering if the wall Doubront has apparently hit is related to his off-season conditioning.

    He should have been rested back in early August. I hope it's not too late. Doubront had a very nice stretch this year. If he can regain that level again, he can be very valuable.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    I think the only reason I would be surprised if Doubront was not on the playoff roster is that I cannot think who else would take in his place.

     

    de la Rosa?  Villareal?  Britton?  (Do they really need another lefty in the pen?  If so, why not Doubront?)

     

    Also, if Doubront's decline is related to conditioning and attitude, I think he will not be with the Sox in 2014...

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to notin's comment:

    I think the only reason I would be surprised if Doubront was not on the playoff roster is that I cannot think who else would take in his place.

     

    de la Rosa?  Villareal?  Britton?  (Do they really need another lefty in the pen?  If so, why not Doubront?)

     

    Also, if Doubront's decline is related to conditioning and attitude, I think he will not be with the Sox in 2014...



    It was one reason I included him in so many of my suggested winter trades.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to notin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    I think the only reason I would be surprised if Doubront was not on the playoff roster is that I cannot think who else would take in his place.

     

    de la Rosa?  Villareal?  Britton?  (Do they really need another lefty in the pen?  If so, why not Doubront?)

     

    Also, if Doubront's decline is related to conditioning and attitude, I think he will not be with the Sox in 2014...

     



    It was one reason I included him in so many of my suggested winter trades.

     

    [/QUOTE]


     

    If he goes, I'd like Billy Butler coming back.  I know I would make that deal.  But would Dayton Moore?

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    Interestingly, one of my last winter trade suggestions was Lester and Doubront for Myers and Butler, and then we sign Anibal Sanchez.

    Sox4ever

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    That Wil Meyers is one stud

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazyworldoftroybrown. Show crazyworldoftroybrown's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    One difference between 2 is Dempster gives up a lot more HRS.
    Dempster 26 HRS 168 innings
    Doubront 12 HRS, 154 innings. (Thats a pretty impressive ratio.)
    Not good for a reliever.

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    I am hoping for a 2005 White Sox like run where their starters were going 7+ innings every game.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    In response to crazyworldoftroybrown's comment:

    One difference between 2 is Dempster gives up a lot more HRS.
    Dempster 26 HRS 168 innings
    Doubront 12 HRS, 154 innings. (Thats a pretty impressive ratio.)
    Not good for a reliever.

     


    Dempster also walks more- also not good for a RP, but...

    The point shown by my numbers is that Dempster does good the first 1-2 times around the opp's line-up. He usually falters after 3-4 innings, hence the position that he'd make a good long man. Doubront often struggles early and then settles down- not good for a long man.

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Dempster as the Long Man in the Playoffs

    Remember, Peavy could pitch in relief G1 and your #1 Starter could pitch relief in G3

     

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