DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    AS richy Dick harden's A's get ready to take the ball versus the rangers today i just couldnt help but review another one that potentially got away again from theo as the team continues to struggle with healthy starter bodies and performances. the results have been a wash since the trade deadline deal but harden has been healthy and taking the ball plus theo had the opportunity to get dicky for even less than it eventually cost him to get bedard and dick's younger with a better pitching history. it all came down to medicals and the injury metereologists and fortune tellers in the sox organization failed AGAIN!  

    just last month, dicky went 7 innings in a team-shutout win of the jays while striking out 11 (still packs heat) and throwing 115 pitches. if bedard ever did that, he will have body parts literally falling off right on the mound and would need an ambulance and stretcher to exit the ballpark and be out for at least 3 starts AGAIN. right now, its his chronic knee, back and elbow that has him out due to overcompensating on his delivery and bla bla. it wasnt obvious that harden had more of an injury and stuff upside? bedard cant go more than 6 on a perfect day of 90 pitches, dont we have enough of these types on the staff already? 

    who's in charge of the sox medical department? those guys make a lot of errors, more so than average, they are more wrong than lindsey lohan's career advisor. they miss on everything from misdiagnosing injuries of guys on their own team to exaggerating injuries to guys like jason bay to create a self-prophesy to avoid re-signing them and to ignoring clear injury disasters in waiting like the 2 free agent JDs (monsieurs lackey and drew) and of course bedard to give up prospects and pay aking's ransom even when you're only bidding against yourself!
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from aussiewill. Show aussiewill's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    The Mandarins , who give advice to the front office , from high. They are all Theo syncopates. They just confirm what ever thought is floating through the boy wonders cranium at the moment. Yes men to Lord Theo.

    No one has the gonnadddes to disagree with his highness, so they rubber stamp all of the geniuses, grandiose concepts. If The Sox lose, and are overtaken by TB or the Angels, we may see some of syncopates saying I told you so. Kind of like rats abandoning a sinking ship.

    We may get to see the Emporer has no clothes, after all.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    Not sure if Harden would have been better than Bedard.  Theo should have tried to acquire another starting pitcher after it was determined Dice-K needed season ending surgery.  He may had more options available a little earlier in the season.   Maybe he had been looking for a while, but he determined that the Red Sox would have to give up too much to acquire another pitcher. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Myles-Standish. Show Myles-Standish's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    Harden was rejected after the front office and medical staff reviewed his medical history.

    Bedard has pitched much better than I expected since arriving. Compare the stats for Harden and Bedard since the trading deadline and Bedard's are much better. The facts don't lie despite what Aussie says.

    Of course, the Theo haters would blame Theo is Harden came here and went onto the DL. They play the game of "Heads I win, Tails you lose" all of the time. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    The Mandarins , who give advice to the front office , from high. They are all Theo syncopates. They just confirm what ever thought is floating through the boy wonders cranium at the moment. Yes men to Lord Theo. No one has the gonnadddes to disagree with his highness, so they rubber stamp all of the geniuses, grandiose concepts. If The Sox lose, and are overtaken by TB or the Angels, we may see some of syncopates saying I told you so. Kind of like rats abandoning a sinking ship. We may get to see the Emporer has no clothes, after all.
    Posted by aussiewill



    Good use of numbers.  At my job, if I don't like a decision, and I voice my concern, the first question out of someone's mouth will be 'why?'.  And I would explain why, in detail.

    Forget the job.  If I questioned something at the local pub, I'd expect to be able to explain why.  Even at the pub, with alcohol flowing, I'd be expected to supply with more than 'just because', followed by a string of insults.

    Now, do you have a reason for preferring Harden?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from aussiewill. Show aussiewill's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    Not sure if Harden would have been better than Bedard.  Theo should have tried to acquire another starting pitcher after it was determined Dice-K needed season ending surgery.  He may had more options available a little earlier in the season.   Maybe he had been looking for a while, but he determined that the Red Sox would have to give up too much to acquire another pitcher. 
    Posted by susan250


    As stated Harden struck out 11 Jays, threw 115 pitches, in a shutout. Among his six other starts. Since Bedard was acquired.What part of that statement aren't you getting? Oh your a Theo syncopate, I get it.

    Harden has been a number one on two staffs. He's young, got electric stuff. I know he's no way near as good as Lackey, but hey, the syncopates agreed with the Boy Wonder on Johnny boy , and K.Krawford. Let's see who they saddle Boston with next.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    just last month, dicky went 7 innings in a team-shutout win of the jays while striking out 11 (still packs heat) and throwing 115 pitches.

    At least this has numbers attached to it.

    While 11 Ks are impressive, it only counts as one game.

    Let's take the names out to make the exercise more meaningful.  Which would you rather have-

    A-7 GS   5.08 ERA   39 IPs  .807 OPSa
    B-6 GS   3.66 ERA   32 IPs  .640 OPSa

    Basically, player A has one extra start, for 7 IPs, and allowed 9 extra runs in what amounts to one extra start.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    the word is sychophant
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?



    NO GM is perfect.  Some of us would not last a week being the Red Sox GM. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    just last month, dicky went 7 innings in a team-shutout win of the jays while striking out 11 (still packs heat) and throwing 115 pitches . At least this has numbers attached to it. While 11 Ks are impressive, it only counts as one game. Let's take the names out to make the exercise more meaningful.  Which would you rather have- A-7 GS   5.08 ERA   39 IPs  .807 OPSa B-6 GS   3.66 ERA   32 IPs  .640 OPSa Basically, player A has one extra start, for 7 IPs, and allowed 9 extra runs in what amounts to one extra start.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    Joe,don't use facts to support your position,it just confuses people.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Myles-Standish. Show Myles-Standish's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In the last 28 days:

    Harden
    IP    22.1
    H     26
    HR     5
    ERA  5.24
    WHIP  1.52

    Bedard
    IP     22
    H      21
    HR     2
    ERA    3.27
    WHIP  1.37
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    As stated Harden struck out 11 Jays, threw 115 pitches, in a shutout. Among his six other starts.

    That doesn't make much sense.  You're saying he has one great start and 6 other starts.  Heck, Lackey's been the worst in the league, and he'll even have a good start once in a while.

    Since Bedard was acquired.What part of that statement aren't you getting? Oh your a Theo syncopate, I get it.  

    Oh, I get it.  You're one of the ones that think insults are a form of debate.  You know, when the numbers aren't working for you, revert to insults.  Impressive.

    Harden has been a number one on two staffs. He's young, got electric stuff.

    He's got a live arm, but hasn't had a Whip under 1.340 since 2008.  Since he's never won more than 11 games in a season, how was he a #1 on two staffs, and even if he was, how does that help us now?

     I know he's no way near as good as Lackey, but hey, the syncopates agreed with the Boy

     Wonder on Johnny boy , and K.Krawford. Let's see who they saddle Boston with next.

    The subject was Harden v Bedard, not Harden v Lackey.  If you want to debate Harden v Lackey, you should start a different thread.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG? : Joe,don't use facts to support your position,it just confuses people.
    Posted by mrmojo1120


    I do it because this portends the downfall of the country.  We simply have way too many people for whom research and data are dirty words.

    The first guy thought Theo made a mistake because Harden had a great game against TO.  He actually had two good games against TO, but basically stunk in his other five games, with 21 runs in 21 innings.  Did the contrarian think getting absolutely shelled in the other 5 games not matter?

    The second guy had two posts, not one detail in either.  I don't necessarily agree with Susan that perhaps we should've acted sooner to replace Dice, but it is still a very valid point, and one worth debating.  Assie, instead of agreeing with Susan, and using that to attack Theo, missed the point completely.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from aussiewill. Show aussiewill's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    Joe, your right I didn't research Harden's numbers. I however believe that Harden is a better pitcher than Bedard. So do the Orioles and the Mariners, probably. As far as taking a shot at Theo, heaven forbid.

    My case is that he obviously makes decisions from the hip, this is just another. Salty came out and said , when harden might be coming to Boston, that the guy has electric stuff. I'm sure you would know better about Harden's potential than Salty would. Him being a catcher and Harden being a pitcher, and you being an expert. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    We should have gotten both.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    How is it that the majority have voted 'Yes' in this poll? Joe's post pretty much said it all.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    Joe, your right I didn't research Harden's numbers. I however believe that Harden is a better pitcher than Bedard. So do the Orioles and the Mariners, probably. As far as taking a shot at Theo, heaven forbid. My case is that he obviously makes decisions from the hip, this is just another. Salty came out and said , when harden might be coming to Boston, that the guy has electric stuff. I'm sure you would know better about Harden's potential than Salty would. Him being a catcher and Harden being a pitcher, and you being an expert. 
    Posted by aussiewill


    All I know is what the numbers tell me.

    The numbers tell me that Bedard has pitched much better than Harden since the trade deadline.  If you disagree, please feel free to post, using some sort of support, as to why you disagree.  

    I don't disagree that Harden has a live arm, but Bedard has never had a bad year.  In the past three years, Harden's ERA has been 4.09, 5.58, and 4.74.  The best of those three ERAs is 4.09 from 2009.  Bedard's worst ERA since 2005 is 3.76.  I don't see how you could argue that Harden is a better pitcher. Neither one can pitch a full season, so that's not an advantage.

    Sorry if I'm wrong, but it seems like you just felt like bashing Theo, but didn't feel like thinking of a reason why.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    We should have gotten both.
    Posted by moonslav59


    I was thinking the same thing.  Circumstances have changed, but he'd be better than Miller or Wake or Weiland.

    On this one, I think Theo overplayed his hand.  He was trading for a guy he knew to be injured.  Then he comes back and tries to change the price because of said injury.  Once he calls off the trade because of the injury, how does he now trade for the guy without losing a lot of credibility?

    FWIW, it's not too late.  He should tell Beane circumstances have changed and he is now willing to make the trade.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Myles-Standish. Show Myles-Standish's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    Joe, your right I didn't research Harden's numbers.
     
    Yet you were adamant and headstrong that Harden was the better pitcher in recent weeks.

    I however believe that Harden is a better pitcher than Bedard. So do the Orioles and the Mariners, probably.
     
    Everyone has an opinion, good for you.

    As far as taking a shot at Theo, heaven forbid. My case is that he obviously makes decisions from the hip, this is just another.
     
    He made the decision to void the Harden signing after carefully analyzing the medical reports of Harden. Is that impulsive "shooting from hip"?

    Salty came out and said , when harden might be coming to Boston, that the guy has electric stuff. I'm sure you would know better about Harden's potential than Salty would. Him being a catcher and Harden being a pitcher, and you being an expert. 

    Now you are moving the goalposts since you struck out on the facts and statistics debate. Did Salty also compare Bedard to Harden? Did he say that Bedard had terrible stuff". Should Theo do a survey of catchers when contemplating a trade for a pitcher in the future?


    Posted by aussiewill
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG? : I was thinking the same thing.  Circumstances have changed, but he'd be better than Miller or Wake or Weiland. On this one, I think Theo overplayed his hand.  He was trading for a guy he knew to be injured.  Then he comes back and tries to change the price because of said injury.  Once he calls off the trade because of the injury, how does he now trade for the guy without losing a lot of credibility? FWIW, it's not too late.  He should tell Beane circumstances have changed and he is now willing to make the trade.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    What up Brady? Can't stand the heat back at home?
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Myles-Standish. Show Myles-Standish's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    I once saw Pumpsie Green play for the Albany Senators before he was called up to Boston.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG? : All I know is what the numbers tell me. The numbers tell me that Bedard has pitched much better than Harden since the trade deadline.  If you disagree, please feel free to post, using some sort of support, as to why you disagree.   I don't disagree that Harden has a live arm, but Bedard has never had a bad year.  In the past three years, Harden's ERA has been 4.09, 5.58, and 4.74.  The best of those three ERAs is 4.09 from 2009.  Bedard's worst ERA since 2005 is 3.76.  I don't see how you could argue that Harden is a better pitcher. Neither one can pitch a full season, so that's not an advantage. Sorry if I'm wrong, but it seems like you just felt like bashing Theo, but didn't feel like thinking of a reason why.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    You really don't know why INEPSTINK should be bashed? GIVE ME A BREAK! Let me refresh your memory: Cameron, Wakefield, Miller, Jenks, LACKEY, Morales, Lugo, Renteria, Smoltz, Penny, Schoenweiss.....and thats just a start. This franchise is going NOWHERE until our current incompetent GM is FIRED and takes our ignoramus manager with him. Face facts Brady....for a change.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Myles-Standish. Show Myles-Standish's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    Smoltz and Penny or Colon and Garcia. You win some and you lose some.

    Should have predicted that Cameron would need a hernia operation.

    Should have known that Renteria couldn't handle the Boston fishbowl.

    Miller came cheap and is still a work in progress.
     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?

    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG?:
    In Response to Re: DID THEO GET SOFT ON DICK HARDEN VS ERIC BEDARD DEAL, ANOTHER HE GOT WRONG? : You really don't know why INEPSTINK should be bashed? GIVE ME A BREAK! Let me refresh your memory: Cameron, Wakefield, Miller, Jenks, LACKEY, Morales, Lugo, Renteria, Smoltz, Penny, Schoenweiss.....and thats just a start. This franchise is going NOWHERE until our current incompetent GM is FIRED and takes our ignoramus manager with him. Face facts Brady....for a change.
    Posted by pumpsie-green


    Hey don't I know you from somewhere?

    Here's a question.  One of the guys you listed was Penny.  Since he left the Red Sox Penny has gone to San Fran, St. Louis, and now Detroit, where he is not putting up great numbers but is in the rotation of a team headed for the playoffs.

    So why does Penny count as this big mistake by Epstein when he keeps being picked up by other teams? 
     
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