Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    by end of may they will be 4-5 games above 500 and all this bridge year non-sense will stop.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    I agree that it's not a very likable team.
     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Masserotti will ALWAYS say things negatively because 1) he thinks it makes him sound more reasonable and intelligent and 2) it generates more traffic.

    I don't agree with anything he says.  I don't even think he is using his real name...
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from NUSoxFan. Show NUSoxFan's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    This is not a bridge year, but the front office did have it's hands tied. As it stands, there is a huge chunk of change committed to CC, Lackey, and Dice-K who all started the year of on the DL (CC was expected to be back sooner than he is going to be, but my point is still there). That doesn't exactly help a team be able to make moves during an off-season to improve themselves.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012. : theo wasn't very likeable either.  he's an arrogant idiot. it amazes me that some of the posters on this board still defend the fool.
    Posted by mryazz[/QUOTE]

    Who am I defending?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]This is not a bridge year, but the front office did have it's hands tied. As it stands, there is a huge chunk of change committed to CC, Lackey, and Dice-K who all started the year of on the DL (CC was expected to be back sooner than he is going to be, but my point is still there). That doesn't exactly help a team be able to make moves during an off-season to improve themselves.
    Posted by NUSoxFan[/QUOTE]

    Of course its not a bridge year.

    Is Tony Massarotti really suggesting the Sox intentionally injured some $94mill worth of roster and stashed it on the DL so as to take a chance to evaluate the younger kids for 2013?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from aussiewill2. Show aussiewill2's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Necessity is the mother of invention, no closer , no Ellsbury, no Crawford, no Lackey LOLOLOLO, no Gonzo, at least not up to his standards of the past. They let paps walk, they sell out every night, they have very little incentive or ability to right the ship, under the Luxury tax. Look at the roster, a mix of overpaid underachieving veterans. Gonzo , Youk, Melancon Fringe players who are now thrown into primary roles with the Sox. Aviles, Ross, Punto, DMac . The point that I find irratating is, that these mediocre pros are taking the spots of young prospects.

    Bridge year,  fans accept a bridge year, bring up Lavarnway, Middlebrooks, Iggy, Matt Barnes.  I guarantee you the Tampa Bay Rays would, the Billy Beane A's would. If I was a young prospect, the last team I would sign with was the Theo Epstein Red Sox. He proved it time after time.
      
    The Crawford contarct established what Ells is worth, they can't afford him. Wasted too much money on stiffs. I hope BC looks at running the Sox differently.
    Look at Baltimore, Tampa, and toronto. young players who are blooming. Look at the Sox in the cellar(I know it's early) 1 rookie in the line up. Get real.
     
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sheriff-Rojas. Show Sheriff-Rojas's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]I heard Mazz talk about this yesterday, and my view is why can't they be doing both. The fact that they didn't make any big deals in the offseason is hardly proof. You can't spend big every offseason. They filled some holes -- RF, SS, so they don't have to rush the young guys. They committed to young guys in the rotation, which should be an improvement at the back of the order and build for the future.  Why do they have to blow it up? Get rid of who? Crawford's not tradeable. Ellsbury is a young guy who was great in September, so supposedly wasn't part of the bad culture you hear about a lot. Wouldn't he be a young guy you build around? A-Gon is one of the hitters you're building around. He's slumping now, but who doesn't slump. In fact, he accepted the blame for last night's loss. Is Pedey the problem? His biggest sin is one poorly phrases sentence when he came to the defense of a teammate. Dump Ortiz? Why? He's hitting and has a personality that supposedly is missing. Trade Youk? OK, fine. That's one. Iggy can't hit so why rush him. Aviles has been fine at SS. Dump Salty for Lavarnway? OK, fine. THat's two. As far as the rotation, Lester is always given a pass for last fall, so I doubt he's one who is supposed to be traded. Buccholz? He was hurt so he can't be blamed for last September, and how tradeable is he? Lackey's on DL and untradeable.  So when you hear blow up the core and get younger and look to the future, it comes down realistically to who? Beckett, Youk and Salty? Beckett's been the best pitcher last year and this year, so are you really going to gain by trading him? Ridiculous. OK, so he might be a bit high maintenance. Get over it. I get sick of these general statements about blowing up the core and the team being unlikeable. How about specifics?
    Posted by royf19[/QUOTE]

    By Mazz's logic, 2004 could have been called a "bridge year" because the Sox were creating a bridge with players like Mark Bellhorn, Kevin Millar, Pokey Reese, Gabe Kapler, and Bronson Arroyo.  Contrary to entitled Red Sox fan beliefs, readily available stars are not available at favorable contracts for every position, and these type of players are critical at filling the gaps.  Unfortunately, due to some weighty contracts and the amount of injuries to key players, this year's gaps seem more like chasms.  

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Plluto29. Show Plluto29's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Next year and quite possibly the year after will also be bridge years while the Red Sox wait out all these horrendously bad contracts that were handed out. The problem is that as soon as that happens, most of the good players on the roster will have seen a good deal of their prime wasted.
     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from marstan. Show marstan's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    As much as Ross has helped this team in April, I would not
    be displeased to see him traded or released. He is a horrible
    fielder who is a butcher in left field. He cannot make the leaping
    catches or come in well on liners. I reluctantly would rather see
    McDonald on a daily basis. He is a better athlete, and with
    regular play, he will be allright. If Ross was so good, how come
    the Marlins and Giants let him walk. We have too much dead
    wood on the squad. I know I included McDonald as one of the
    culprits in my past posts, but truth be told, in my opinion, I
    think McDonald has more temporary upside. Why we needed
    Shoppach and Punto is questionable. Yes...they are nice on
    defense, but are true rally killers and are AAA material at best.
    Both these guys are killing our offense.


    r
     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimedfred. Show jimedfred's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]Necessity is the mother of invention, no closer , no Ellsbury, no Crawford, no Lackey LOLOLOLO, no Gonzo, at least not up to his standards of the past. They let paps walk, they sell out every night, they have very little incentive or ability to right the ship, under the Luxury tax. Look at the roster, a mix of overpaid underachieving veterans. Gonzo , Youk, Melancon Fringe players who are now thrown into primary roles with the Sox. Aviles, Ross, Punto, DMac . The point that I find irratating is, that these mediocre pros are taking the spots of young prospects. Bridge year,  fans accept a bridge year, bring up Lavarnway, Middlebrooks, Iggy, Matt Barnes.  I guarantee you the Tampa Bay Rays would, the Billy Beane A's would. If I was a young prospect, the last team I would sign with was the Theo Epstein Red Sox. He proved it time after time.    The Crawford contarct established what Ells is worth, they can't afford him. Wasted too much money on stiffs. I hope BC looks at running the Sox differently. Look at Baltimore, Tampa, and toronto. young players who are blooming. Look at the Sox in the cellar(I know it's early) 1 rookie in the line up. Get real.  
    Posted by aussiewill2[/QUOTE]

    You GUARANTEE us that Oakland or Tampa would bring up Matt Barnes right NOW ??
    The kid's just moved up from low-A to high-A , max. innings a season in college was 121 I.P. , he looks like a potential ace starter IF DEVELOPED PROPERLY, and you want him in Majors now ??? What genius-level baseball acumen you possess.
    You're either an idiot or have no experience following baseball.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Iceman4. Show Iceman4's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Red Sox pickups just seem old, past their prime, or misrepresented lately. We need better scouting.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    I can't agree with Tony Massarotti's suggestion that Ryan Kalish would represent an upgrade over Ryan Sweeney ... Kalish has never been as highly regarded as Sweeney was at Kalish's age.

    For what it's worth, Sweeney posted a 4.2 WAR* season at Kalish's current age.

    * Wins Above Replacement as reported at FanGraphs: http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=6352&position=OF
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from AL34. Show AL34's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Good article and I think he was correct in the writing. Its ashame that they are charging full ticket price for the watered down product that they are now showing on the field.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]Sure feels like a bridge year
    Posted by 2004Idiots[/QUOTE]

    Do you agree with every negative spout that pours from these professional complainers?
     
    CHB was the champ.  Now Mazz is trying to dethrone him.  He seemed reasonable until the last year or two.  I stopped reading CHBs stuff because I could expect nothing but poor mouthing idiocy. 

    Mazz is now on that list.

    Even if it is a bridge year, which I don't accept, doesn't that preclude the idea they are still planning to get better? 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012. : Stop blaming Theo.  There's no way players with huge contracts get signed without JH signoff and lucchino's stamp of approval.  In fact, there's no proof that Crawford was someone that Theo even wanted. And in any case, this team isn't anywhere close to losing money.
    Posted by DirtyWaterLover[/QUOTE]Whether or not one likes to frame it as Epstein killing the budget, the RS as an organization rolled some hefty contracts at locking in the rotation of Lester-Beckett-Lackey-DiceK and Buchholz. They committed a big % of their toal payroll budget to A-Gon and Crawford. Theo will always enjoy the recognition as a GM who was instrumental in bring two WS championships to Boston and he was instrumental in signings that haunt the RS in 2012. Of course he does not have sole ownership of either the former or later, but Epstein is without a doubt a key figure.  

    Coming into 2012, there just wasn't going to be another flurry of signings. Not with a payroll of $170M (after Papelbon walked.) The NYY and the RS are both reducing payroll, not only because exanding payroll is not a sure fired road to championships but because the new CBA makes the penalty of CBT in future years extremely punative and there is a huge reward to be at or below the CBT threshold in 2014. Whie 2014 is two years off, as we see now, FA signings are mutliple year and impact the budget for years to come.  

    So if that meant the RS aren't focused on 2012, that is what it is. If it means the RS aren't throwing good money after bad, paying the best available FA as though they were the best players, so be it.

    In my view, the failings of Melancon and the injury to Bailey were big body blows, and the sub par start for Buccholz combined with a typical sluggish April for Lester expose the RS pitching.  Less concerned about the offense, even without Ellsbury and the $140M man. Runs come in bunches and at times will be hard to come by. The ability to create a high team OBP over time wil put a team in a position to win more games than it losses, it is the pitching half of the run differential formula that is basically malfunctioning, just as it did last September IMHO.   


     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from iamme17. Show iamme17's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    the sox and yanks traded a past decade's run of playoffs for a future  that's gonna be less than glamorous.Too much dead money on long term contracts that they won't get out of and farm systems that are poor compared to their division rivals.Add the revolt by the small market teams vis a vis the punitive luxury tax and the question is "was the past 10 years worth the next 3 bleek years"?
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Fivekatz is right that Epstein's deals have limited the Sox financial flexibility in 2012, but I disagree that the bullpen is a disaster without Melancon and Bailey. 

    In the last ten games the Sox bullpen have pitched 29 innings and given up 2 runs, neither of which hurt. 

    The problem right now is the starting pitching. 

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    Stop blaming Theo.  There's no way players with huge contracts get signed without JH signoff and lucchino's stamp of approval.  In fact, there's no proof that Crawford was someone that Theo even wanted.

    Then Theo gets zero credit for anything, in your clumsy dual edged sword. 

    The window for trading Ellsbuy in a package with blocked prospects for a true young superstar (Ellsbury is not and never will be) is about closed. Theo jumbo mortgaged the farm for Crawford, in his plan to deal Ellsbury. Needless to say, dumping money at Ellsbury would be more idiotic than committing the act of incompetence in making a market offer for Carl Crawbust.  
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.

    In Response to Re: Do you agee with Tony Massarotti-It seems like the Red Sox are more focused on building for 2013 than contending in 2012.:
    [QUOTE]Fivekatz is right that Epstein's deals have limited the Sox financial flexibility in 2012, but I disagree that the bullpen is a disaster without Melancon and Bailey.  In the last ten games the Sox bullpen have pitched 29 innings and given up 2 runs, neither of which hurt.  The problem right now is the starting pitching. 
    Posted by maxbialystock[/QUOTE]Max, the stats are the stats so you are right, but my in opinion there are caveats. First, Valentine has left starters in longer than he would have if his bullpen was deeper (or BV is just a slow hook) and while I haven't drilled on the numbers, when we say 2 runs, are we talking about inherited runners or just earned runs? And the last 10 games are an interesting frame. The RS are after all 7-3 over the last 10 games. If the team was really was or is a .700 club, the conversation would or will be diferent.

    Perhaps I engaged in a bit drama when I said disaster regarding the bullpen. Better to say it is thin. It certainly isn't what Cherington hoped to do when he took on the task of replacing the 2011 tandem of Bard to Papelbon.
     
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