Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    Have WAR (wins above replacement) ratings among the 34 highest in MLB.  Not too shabby and might explain why they are the first four hitters in the lineup.  Another four--Drew, Napoli, Nava, and Salty--are in the top 90. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazyworldoftroybrown. Show crazyworldoftroybrown's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    Sox are really going to miss Ells when he walks. Salty has improved his Clutch hitting tremendously in last Month, best time of year to do it, down the stretch. Good for him.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    Salty and Middlebrooks both.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to mef429's comment:

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from garyhow. Show garyhow's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     




    Agree RS will be in running to resign. Don't see alot of competition? Yanks trying to get under cap, Angels/ Dodgers all set in OF, Cubs not close to winning yet. Know he would like to play closer to home but would M's be a good match = be careful what you wish for? The only team that scares me would be the Mets, been saying since last winter they have a ton of $ coming off the books, desperate for OF help, and not far away from winning. Staff that starts w/ Harvey, Wheeler, Niece, Gee not bad all young and coming, if Ike Davis can get back to where he was 2 yrs ago w/ Wright, Murphy, and Flores the Mets are not far off. Add Ells and a cheaper corner OF w/ some pop and you might be talking playoffs

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to garyhow's comment:

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

     

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

     

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     

     



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     

     

     




     

    Agree RS will be in running to resign. Don't see alot of competition? Yanks trying to get under cap, Angels/ Dodgers all set in OF, Cubs not close to winning yet. Know he would like to play closer to home but would M's be a good match = be careful what you wish for? The only team that scares me would be the Mets, been saying since last winter they have a ton of $ coming off the books, desperate for OF help, and not far away from winning. Staff that starts w/ Harvey, Wheeler, Niece, Gee not bad all young and coming, if Ike Davis can get back to where he was 2 yrs ago w/ Wright, Murphy, and Flores the Mets are not far off. Add Ells and a cheaper corner OF w/ some pop and you might be talking playoffs



    Mets and M's are the only 2 teams i see going after him. Maybe Baltimore??

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to mef429's comment:

    In response to garyhow's comment:

     

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

     

     

     

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

     

     

     

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     

     

     



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     

     

     

     

     




     

     

    Agree RS will be in running to resign. Don't see alot of competition? Yanks trying to get under cap, Angels/ Dodgers all set in OF, Cubs not close to winning yet. Know he would like to play closer to home but would M's be a good match = be careful what you wish for? The only team that scares me would be the Mets, been saying since last winter they have a ton of $ coming off the books, desperate for OF help, and not far away from winning. Staff that starts w/ Harvey, Wheeler, Niece, Gee not bad all young and coming, if Ike Davis can get back to where he was 2 yrs ago w/ Wright, Murphy, and Flores the Mets are not far off. Add Ells and a cheaper corner OF w/ some pop and you might be talking playoffs

     



    Mets and M's are the only 2 teams i see going after him. Maybe Baltimore??

     



    Texas, Chicago Cubs (They said they will spend this off-season with plan to compete in '15), Yankees (Granderson won't be back), the Mets will definitely be interested, Seattle, Philly, Toronto...

    Ellsbury will have many suitors, as he is the second best postion player on the market.  He WILL get a contract north of 100 million and at this point, I'd be surprised if he is back next year.  It may be determined by how the rest of the season goes, obviously, but the numbers being thrown around by analysts right now seem to say he will be gone next year.  

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from charliedarling. Show charliedarling's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    Ellsbury has been playing well this year, but any team that signs him for any where near $100 M is going to live to regret such a signing as Ellsbury's career has been too up and down for him, a speed player, to be worth a huge eyarly salary beyond a third year.

    If he signs for four years he may be worth whatever he signs for, but any longer than that and he will become a liability in many ways.  When he slows down he will become a marginal defensive outfielder and an 'average' baserunner who will still not have much power.

    I would recommend that no one offer him more than 60M for four years, but I would be surprised if some club went far above that figure and that number of years.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to mef429's comment:

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?



    Mef, if you are looking for a clueless one, I nominate myself.  I want to keep Ellsbury, but I don't want to pay an arm and a leg, especially with Bradley in the wings.  

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from garyhow. Show garyhow's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to jasko2248's comment:

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

    In response to garyhow's comment:

     

     

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

     

     

     

     

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     

     

     

     



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     

     

     

     

     

     

     




     

     

     

    Agree RS will be in running to resign. Don't see alot of competition? Yanks trying to get under cap, Angels/ Dodgers all set in OF, Cubs not close to winning yet. Know he would like to play closer to home but would M's be a good match = be careful what you wish for? The only team that scares me would be the Mets, been saying since last winter they have a ton of $ coming off the books, desperate for OF help, and not far away from winning. Staff that starts w/ Harvey, Wheeler, Niece, Gee not bad all young and coming, if Ike Davis can get back to where he was 2 yrs ago w/ Wright, Murphy, and Flores the Mets are not far off. Add Ells and a cheaper corner OF w/ some pop and you might be talking playoffs

     

     



    Mets and M's are the only 2 teams i see going after him. Maybe Baltimore??

     

     

     



    Texas, Chicago Cubs (They said they will spend this off-season with plan to compete in '15), Yankees (Granderson won't be back), the Mets will definitely be interested, Seattle, Philly, Toronto...

     

    Ellsbury will have many suitors, as he is the second best postion player on the market.  He WILL get a contract north of 100 million and at this point, I'd be surprised if he is back next year.  It may be determined by how the rest of the season goes, obviously, but the numbers being thrown around by analysts right now seem to say he will be gone next year.  




    Not sure I see the north of 100 mil. While Ellsbury is a good player the one thing that may make teams back off is his injury history. Tough to give that $ to someone who can't stay on field. Don't see the Philly and Toronto arguements, Philly trying to rid salary and rebuild and Toronto didn't exactly have much luck w/ all the salary they added this year? Yanks are looking to get under 189 and have Gardner to play CF and still must resign Cano, Yanks are boxed into a corner.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

     

     

    I'll make a friendly bet with anyone that it's north of 100 million.  There are a lot of new TV contracts out there and the Phillies are working on one that rivals the Dodgers.  They will spend, as they can't afford to go into full rebuild mode to get that contract approved.  They still have a decent nucleus.  If they were trying to shed salary, they would have moved Lee at the deadline.  They will be willing to spend this off season and Amaro's job is on the line.

     

      Toronto also has a ton of money and they aren't going to blow it up either.  They will spend again, Davis is likely gone & they aren't sold on the erratic Rasmus.  Also, don't assume the Yankees wouldn't love to strengthen themselves by weakening the Sox.  They will need an outfielder this off season and they may feel he could be closer to the MVP caliber player with that short porch.  They have alot of money coming off the books as well. 

     

    Lastly, there will be teams that will look at Ellsbury's two injuries as "fluke plays," more than they will say he is injury prone.  He keeps himself in phenomenal shape, so he could be around for a while.  Again, I'll gladly take any bet that someone gives him over 100 million this offseason.  The whispers are already there and it's obviously still early...

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to maxbialystock's comment:

    Have WAR (wins above replacement) ratings among the 34 highest in MLB.  Not too shabby and might explain why they are the first four hitters in the lineup.  Another four--Drew, Napoli, Nava, and Salty--are in the top 90. 




    WAR includes fielding. There is no way Victorino is even close to a top 34 MLB hitter this year... not even against lefties.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to jasko2248's comment:

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

    In response to garyhow's comment:

     

     

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

     

     

     

     

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     

     

     

     



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     

     

     

     

     

     




     

     

     

    Agree RS will be in running to resign. Don't see alot of competition? Yanks trying to get under cap, Angels/ Dodgers all set in OF, Cubs not close to winning yet. Know he would like to play closer to home but would M's be a good match = be careful what you wish for? The only team that scares me would be the Mets, been saying since last winter they have a ton of $ coming off the books, desperate for OF help, and not far away from winning. Staff that starts w/ Harvey, Wheeler, Niece, Gee not bad all young and coming, if Ike Davis can get back to where he was 2 yrs ago w/ Wright, Murphy, and Flores the Mets are not far off. Add Ells and a cheaper corner OF w/ some pop and you might be talking playoffs

     



    Mets and M's are the only 2 teams i see going after him. Maybe Baltimore??

     

     



    Texas, Chicago Cubs (They said they will spend this off-season with plan to compete in '15), Yankees (Granderson won't be back), the Mets will definitely be interested, Seattle, Philly, Toronto...

     

    Ellsbury will have many suitors, as he is the second best postion player on the market.  He WILL get a contract north of 100 million and at this point, I'd be surprised if he is back next year.  It may be determined by how the rest of the season goes, obviously, but the numbers being thrown around by analysts right now seem to say he will be gone next year.  



    I think SF might be in the race for Ellsbury as well.

    I'm pretty certain Ellsbury will get over $90M/5. He'll probably end up with over $108M/6. It wouldn't surprise me if some GM bids up to $120/6.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from NLU75. Show NLU75's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to ThefourBs's comment:

    In response to mef429's comment:

     

    #1 priority in the offseason: resign Ellsbury no matter the cost.

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     



    I agree that they should make a competitive offer for him, but, "at all costs"?

     

    not gonna happen, they gave PD 13.5 a year. Scott Borazz will laugh at that amount will need at least 17 mill a year to sign him


     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    no other teams bidding up his services?    Satan Bora$ scoffs at that.  he got the yankees to pay a-rod $275MM plus another $25MM+ in incentinves with not one other team even considering spending money like that.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to maxbialystock's comment:

     

    Have WAR (wins above replacement) ratings among the 34 highest in MLB.  Not too shabby and might explain why they are the first four hitters in the lineup.  Another four--Drew, Napoli, Nava, and Salty--are in the top 90. 

     




    WAR includes fielding. There is no way Victorino is even close to a top 34 MLB hitter this year... not even against lefties.

     



    I'm sure you're right even though I pulled these from batting stats on espn.com.  All four WAR ratings are comfortably above AGon's, FWIW.  And CC's WAR is in the bottom half of MLB.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    In response to slasher9's comment:

    no other teams bidding up his services?    Satan Bora$ scoffs at that.  he got the yankees to pay a-rod $275MM plus another $25MM+ in incentinves with not one other team even considering spending money like that.



    actually, A-Roid FIRED Boras before signing that deal. Which he negotiated HIMSELF.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    Have WAR (wins above replacement) ratings among the 34 highest in MLB.  Not too shabby and might explain why they are the first four hitters in the lineup.  Another four--Drew, Napoli, Nava, and Salty--are in the top 90. 

     

     




    WAR includes fielding. There is no way Victorino is even close to a top 34 MLB hitter this year... not even against lefties.

     

     

     



    I'm sure you're right even though I pulled these from batting stats on espn.com.  All four WAR ratings are comfortably above AGon's, FWIW.  And CC's WAR is in the bottom half of MLB.

    It's listed under "batters", because it is only non-pitchers.

    WAR includes batting, fielding and base running.

    Go to fangraphs, clcik value and you'll see Victorino's high WAR is almost totally made up of defense.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=6&season=2013&month=0&season1=2013&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0

    Batting +3.1

    Baserunning +3.3

    Fielding +22.2

    If you click the batting category, it will sort MLB players by just their hitting. This is how our players rate out of 154 qualifying players:

    7) Ortiz  30.8

    36) AGon  14.2

    49) Nava  11.0

    66) Pedey  7.9

    67) Ellsb   7.8

    82) Napoli 4.2

    87) Vict    3.1

    I lowered the PA qualifier to 190 PAs; here is the breakdown of 316 MLB players:

    7) Ortiz

    43) AGon

    59) Nava

    70) Carp  9.8

    83) Pedey

    84) Ellsb

    95) Salty  6.1

    103) Crawford 5.2

    114) Napoli

    117) Iggy  3.8

    123) Vict

    133) Gomes 2.1

    135) VMart  1.7

    151) Drew 0.7

    182) M Young -1.4

    214) Middlebrooks -4.0

    309) BJ Upton -18.7

     

    Sox4ever

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    LMAO@BJ UPTON

    Some say a storm is coming, Some say the end is near.

    Some think it's all so hazy, I think it's all so clear.

    Some say they have the answers, some say they know the truth.

    Some people live in question, some people have no clue.

    If there was no tomorrow, if there was just today.

    would you make different choices? or would you stay the same?

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Ellsbury, Pedroia, Victorino, and Ortiz

    Pretty awesome that Nava is a top 20% batter in MLB.

    We have 10 batters in the top 50%.

    Sox4ever

     
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