Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    The stat that stood out to me this year, was that the Sox roster, batting, pitching, starting pitching, bench support, manager, coaches, players, general manager, owners, ballboys, clubhouse attendants, team medical staff, team trainers, and ticket salesmen all sucked. That stood out to me in 2012

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from seabeachfred. Show seabeachfred's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to dannycater's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The stat that stood out to me this year, was that the Sox roster, batting, pitching, starting pitching, bench support, manager, coaches, players, general manager, owners, ballboys, clubhouse attendants, team medical staff, team trainers, and ticket salesmen all sucked. That stood out to me in 2012

    [/QUOTE]


    Well that about covers it Danny.  I now wish we could all agree that there was no bright light to this  season and we should all look ahead because there is nothing worth looking back on this season.  Having said that, we only have to watch the playoffs to see just what it takes to win in this game----solid starting pitching, consistent relief pitching (which has been shaky) and hitters who know when to hit in the clutch.  Our key starting pitchers this year, Lester and Buchholz stunk pure and simple and did not pitch the way a contending team needed them to pitch.  That is partly why we didn't contend this season.  Our bullpen was hot and cold and the injuries killed us as well.  An improved medical staff, a GM who does his job well this off season, keeping the miserable and rotten Lucchino away from the baseball doings on the field, a couple of quality starting pitchers, an improved bullpen, a first baseman not named baLoney or Gomez and a decent manager might get back in civilization next season.  However, please, no more of this "there was some positives to this season".   There were none.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:
    [QUOTE]Well that about covers it Danny.  I now wish we could all agree that there was no bright light to this  season and we should all look ahead because there is nothing worth looking back on this season.  Having said that, we only have to watch the playoffs to see just what it takes to win in this game----solid starting pitching, consistent relief pitching (which has been shaky) and hitters who know when to hit in the clutch.  Our key starting pitchers this year, Lester and Buchholz stunk pure and simple and did not pitch the way a contending team needed them to pitch.  That is partly why we didn't contend this season.  Our bullpen was hot and cold and the injuries killed us as well.  An improved medical staff, a GM who does his job well this off season, keeping the miserable and rotten Lucchino away from the baseball doings on the field, a couple of quality starting pitchers, an improved bullpen, a first baseman not named baLoney or Gomez and a decent manager might get back in civilization next season.  However, please, no more of this "there was some positives to this season".   There were none.[/QUOTE]
    Will Middlebrooks exceeded my expectations this year.

    I don't have great confidence in Middlebrooks maintaining his productivity going forward, but the rookie thirdbaseman was a bright spot in 2012.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from seabeachfred. Show seabeachfred's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to hill55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:
    [QUOTE]Well that about covers it Danny.  I now wish we could all agree that there was no bright light to this  season and we should all look ahead because there is nothing worth looking back on this season.  Having said that, we only have to watch the playoffs to see just what it takes to win in this game----solid starting pitching, consistent relief pitching (which has been shaky) and hitters who know when to hit in the clutch.  Our key starting pitchers this year, Lester and Buchholz stunk pure and simple and did not pitch the way a contending team needed them to pitch.  That is partly why we didn't contend this season.  Our bullpen was hot and cold and the injuries killed us as well.  An improved medical staff, a GM who does his job well this off season, keeping the miserable and rotten Lucchino away from the baseball doings on the field, a couple of quality starting pitchers, an improved bullpen, a first baseman not named baLoney or Gomez and a decent manager might get back in civilization next season.  However, please, no more of this "there was some positives to this season".   There were none.[/QUOTE]
    Will Middlebrooks exceeded my expectations this year.

    I don't have great confidence in Middlebrooks maintaining his productivity going forward, but the rookie thirdbaseman was a bright spot in 2012.

    [/QUOTE]


    Good point Hill.  Will was out so long that I forgot how well he performed for us.  I hope you're wrong on Middlebrooks though.  He is a big part of our future and I really believe he has what it takes to be a stalwart for us going forward.  At least I certainly hope I'm right.

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to hill55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:
    [QUOTE]Well that about covers it Danny.  I now wish we could all agree that there was no bright light to this  season and we should all look ahead because there is nothing worth looking back on this season.  Having said that, we only have to watch the playoffs to see just what it takes to win in this game----solid starting pitching, consistent relief pitching (which has been shaky) and hitters who know when to hit in the clutch.  Our key starting pitchers this year, Lester and Buchholz stunk pure and simple and did not pitch the way a contending team needed them to pitch.  That is partly why we didn't contend this season.  Our bullpen was hot and cold and the injuries killed us as well.  An improved medical staff, a GM who does his job well this off season, keeping the miserable and rotten Lucchino away from the baseball doings on the field, a couple of quality starting pitchers, an improved bullpen, a first baseman not named baLoney or Gomez and a decent manager might get back in civilization next season.  However, please, no more of this "there was some positives to this season".   There were none.[/QUOTE]
    Will Middlebrooks exceeded my expectations this year.

    I don't have great confidence in Middlebrooks maintaining his productivity going forward, but the rookie thirdbaseman was a bright spot in 2012.

    [/QUOTE]


    Good point Hill.  Will was out so long that I forgot how well he performed for us.  I hope you're wrong on Middlebrooks though.  He is a big part of our future and I really believe he has what it takes to be a stalwart for us going forward.  At least I certainly hope I'm right.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Didn't Doubront, Morales, Atchison, Mortensen, Ross, Pods, Ciriaco Miller and maybe a few others do pretty well?

    Buch coming on strong was encouraging as well, but the poor start really helped put us in a hole we never could seem to get out of.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    When Felix Doubront is the team's highlight reel player, that in itself tells you the season was a complete disaster. He wasn't even supposed to be the Sox fourth best SP.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to dannycater's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    When Felix Doubront is the team's highlight reel player, that in itself tells you the season was a complete disaster. He wasn't even supposed to be the Sox fourth best SP.

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree, it was a disater, but not totally and completely. I do feel better about a few players after this year than before.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    I don't. Here's why. The team and the players know what it's like to finish 24 games under .500. The players are used to losing, not winning. The entire confidence level of the players who were producers--Ross, Middlebrooks, Salty--all they know is failure with the Sox. That's their experience. Yes, Ross won a WS with another franchise. But with the Sox, he's a player who produced on a terrible, terrible team. That just makes him one of many thousands who have that on their resume.  Does that mean the Sox go out and get AROD, CC, and Beckett, no. But it means they are going to need 3 guys right away just to give the team a fighting chance for .500. And if pitching or SP is as important as we feel it is---how do you complement Doubront? Buchholz was horrific over his last several starts and after that? Lester on the downside of his career. Not much to hope for there. No closer. Bailey was not that good in that role despite all the glamour. Lot of issues, mostly player personnel. Very little of it.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to parhunter55's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You won't get an argument from me that it was the pitching that led this team down the road to nowhere.

    However, looking at the whole season is not as productive as looking at the team prior to July 31st and post July 31st.  At the July trade deadline this team was in the hunt and trending up.  But August hit and the train went off the tracks.  Look at that month.  And then, the trade happened and the train went off a cliff.  Should look at September and compare to the rest of the league.  You might find it was actually the offense that held this team back.  Moon, you love those month-by-month comparisons...I suspect such an analysis would be quite interesting and informative.

    What I noticed all year long, but especially in the last two months, was that this team was horrible offensively when behind.  And they were behind more often than not.

    [/QUOTE]


    The Sox are no longer a come-from-behind team. If we don't score early and often, and start off behind, we rarely recover.

    I'm curious, how many come-from-behind wins did this team have this year, or last year for that matter?

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    In response to dannycater's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I don't. Here's why. The team and the players know what it's like to finish 24 games under .500. The players are used to losing, not winning. The entire confidence level of the players who were producers--Ross, Middlebrooks, Salty--all they know is failure with the Sox. That's their experience. Yes, Ross won a WS with another franchise. But with the Sox, he's a player who produced on a terrible, terrible team. That just makes him one of many thousands who have that on their resume.  Does that mean the Sox go out and get AROD, CC, and Beckett, no. But it means they are going to need 3 guys right away just to give the team a fighting chance for .500. And if pitching or SP is as important as we feel it is---how do you complement Doubront? Buchholz was horrific over his last several starts and after that? Lester on the downside of his career. Not much to hope for there. No closer. Bailey was not that good in that role despite all the glamour. Lot of issues, mostly player personnel. Very little of it.

    [/QUOTE]

    Totally disagree on nearly every point here.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Facts Are Facts: It Was More About the Pitching than the Hitting...

    Ask yourself, is Ellpuff worth 10 million for 2013. That's not a question.

    You asked us to ask ourselves, then said it wasn't a question.

    We can't trade him unless we sign him, unless we trade him before the arb.

     
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