Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from CubanPete. Show CubanPete's posts

    Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Can't score runs? Getting shutdown by mediocre pitching? First place to look is the lineup. Specifically the top of the lineup.

    Typical Red Sox lineup

    1.) Ellsbury .296/.357/.426 --- K% 13.5 BB% 7.8 --- ISO .130

    2.) Victorino .280/.332/.403 --- K% 11.4 BB% 5.4 --- ISO .123

    3.) Pedroia .293/.374/.405 --- K% 11.0 BB% 11.2 --- ISO .112

    4.) Ortiz .324/.405/.580 --- K% 13.3 BB% 12.4 --- ISO .256

    5.) Nava .289/.374/.426 --- K% 17.6 BB% 9.5 --- ISO .137

    6.) Napoli .245/.335/.436 --- K% 34.0 BB% 10.8 --- ISO .191

    7.) Drew .248/.332/.426 --- K% 25.8 BB% 11.3 --- ISO .179

    8.) Saltalamaccia .267/.336/.453 --- K% 31.4 BB% 9.5 --- ISO .186

    9.) Middlebrooks .208/.250/.398 --- K% 27.4 BB% 4.6 --- ISO .190

    Problem#1 - Victorino is batting 2nd. He rarely walks. He has to hit his way on base. Players like him are prone to slumps. Victorino is currently in a 4/26 slump. His slash is         .154/.267/.192. When he does get on base at least twice, the Sox score more than 3 runs. When he doesn't, the team struggles. The team shouldn't have to put themselves in this position. Victorino needs to be dropped to the bottom 3rd of the lineup.

    Problem#2 - Pedroia is batting 3rd. I like Pedroia. He's good with the glove and is an elite on base guy. He's just not a middle of the lineup slugger, especially on the road. Move him back to 2nd, where he belongs.

    Additionally, Ortiz should bat 3rd. Why not give your best hitter more plate appearances.

    Nava should bat cleanup. Imagine having an opposing starter facing off against Ellsbury, Pedroia, and Ortiz. That 1-3 will accelerate pitch counts and increase the likelihood of bringing in a middle reliever. Moreover, Nava will frequently have PAs with men on base. Against the Jays last night, he had 2 doubles with no one on base.

    That Victorino continues to bat 2nd is on Farrell. If I could see this, so can he. Any manager can look good when their players are performing well (and follow Bobby Valentine). Heck, Grady Little was 6 outs from leading the Red Sox to their first WS in 17 years. Yet firing Little and hiring Terry made the biggest difference in the world. Like Farrell, Grady didn't put his best OBP guys at the top of his lineup. In 2003, rookie Hideki Matsui and his 16 HRs had more RBI than Manny Ramirez.

    When the team traded for Peavy, the Sox stopped playing with house money and went into win-now mode. The honeymoon is over for Farrell. Will he fix the top of his lineup or will he remain stubborn and unwilling to change?

    Will Cherrington call up Butler and Assad from Pawtucket, before 9/1? They're hitting well and are in their mid-20s. What's the deal there?

     

     

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Javi60. Show Javi60's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to CubanPete's comment:

    Can't score runs? Getting shutdown by mediocre pitching? First place to look is the lineup. Specifically the top of the lineup.

    Typical Red Sox lineup

    1.) Ellsbury .296/.357/.426 --- K% 13.5 BB% 7.8 --- ISO .130

    2.) Victorino .280/.332/.403 --- K% 11.4 BB% 5.4 --- ISO .123

    3.) Pedroia .293/.374/.405 --- K% 11.0 BB% 11.2 --- ISO .112

    4.) Ortiz .324/.405/.580 --- K% 13.3 BB% 12.4 --- ISO .256

    5.) Nava .289/.374/.426 --- K% 17.6 BB% 9.5 --- ISO .137

    6.) Napoli .245/.335/.436 --- K% 34.0 BB% 10.8 --- ISO .191

    7.) Drew .248/.332/.426 --- K% 25.8 BB% 11.3 --- ISO .179

    8.) Saltalamaccia .267/.336/.453 --- K% 31.4 BB% 9.5 --- ISO .186

    9.) Middlebrooks .208/.250/.398 --- K% 27.4 BB% 4.6 --- ISO .190

    Problem#1 - Victorino is batting 2nd. He rarely walks. He has to hit his way on base. Players like him are prone to slumps. Victorino is currently in a 4/26 slump. His slash is         .154/.267/.192. When he does get on base at least twice, the Sox score more than 3 runs. When he doesn't, the team struggles. The team shouldn't have to put themselves in this position. Victorino needs to be dropped to the bottom 3rd of the lineup.

    Problem#2 - Pedroia is batting 3rd. I like Pedroia. He's good with the glove and is an elite on base guy. He's just not a middle of the lineup slugger, especially on the road. Move him back to 2nd, where he belongs.

    Additionally, Ortiz should bat 3rd. Why not give your best hitter more plate appearances.

    Nava should bat cleanup. Imagine having an opposing starter facing off against Ellsbury, Pedroia, and Ortiz. That 1-3 will accelerate pitch counts and increase the likelihood of bringing in a middle reliever. Moreover, Nava will frequently have PAs with men on base. Against the Jays last night, he had 2 doubles with no one on base.

    That Victorino continues to bat 2nd is on Farrell. If I could see this, so can he. Any manager can look good when their players are performing well (and follow Bobby Valentine). Heck, Grady Little was 6 outs from leading the Red Sox to their first WS in 17 years. Yet firing Little and hiring Terry made the biggest difference in the world. Like Farrell, Grady didn't put his best OBP guys at the top of his lineup. In 2003, rookie Hideki Matsui and his 16 HRs had more RBI than Manny Ramirez.

    When the team traded for Peavy, the Sox stopped playing with house money and went into win-now mode. The honeymoon is over for Farrell. Will he fix the top of his lineup or will he remain stubborn and unwilling to change?

    Will Cherrington call up Butler and Assad from Pawtucket, before 9/1? They're hitting well and are in their mid-20s. What's the deal there?

     

     

     



    Great post, peddie second and papi third YES YES YES,... Not sure about Nava as clean up... But that is the problem, the hitter after Ortiz was the guy to be found on July 31... You imagine Soriano with Sox! Or someone alike...

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Boston have the forth best record in MLB, and you think Farrell should make a change right now?

    seriously, this starting line up is fine to me!!

    Did you know that Ellsbury ranked #8, Pedroia ranked #17, Napoli (believe it or not) ranked #27, Oritz ranked 31 and Victorino (who missed about 30 % games this year) ranked 37.  Had Victorino played every game, he would easily ranked in the top ten.   Tampa only have 3 guys in the top 40 runs scoring, and believe it or not, Longoria is the top ranked run scorer for the team!!  Ouch!!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Ortiz is the No. 4 hitter.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheExaminer. Show TheExaminer's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Not bad. Might be at least worth a try.

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to CubanPete's comment:

    Can't score runs? Getting shutdown by mediocre pitching? First place to look is the lineup. Specifically the top of the lineup.

    Typical Red Sox lineup

    1.) Ellsbury .296/.357/.426 --- K% 13.5 BB% 7.8 --- ISO .130

    2.) Victorino .280/.332/.403 --- K% 11.4 BB% 5.4 --- ISO .123

    3.) Pedroia .293/.374/.405 --- K% 11.0 BB% 11.2 --- ISO .112

    4.) Ortiz .324/.405/.580 --- K% 13.3 BB% 12.4 --- ISO .256

    5.) Nava .289/.374/.426 --- K% 17.6 BB% 9.5 --- ISO .137

    6.) Napoli .245/.335/.436 --- K% 34.0 BB% 10.8 --- ISO .191

    7.) Drew .248/.332/.426 --- K% 25.8 BB% 11.3 --- ISO .179

    8.) Saltalamaccia .267/.336/.453 --- K% 31.4 BB% 9.5 --- ISO .186

    9.) Middlebrooks .208/.250/.398 --- K% 27.4 BB% 4.6 --- ISO .190

    Problem#1 - Victorino is batting 2nd. He rarely walks. He has to hit his way on base. Players like him are prone to slumps. Victorino is currently in a 4/26 slump. His slash is         .154/.267/.192. When he does get on base at least twice, the Sox score more than 3 runs. When he doesn't, the team struggles. The team shouldn't have to put themselves in this position. Victorino needs to be dropped to the bottom 3rd of the lineup.

    Problem#2 - Pedroia is batting 3rd. I like Pedroia. He's good with the glove and is an elite on base guy. He's just not a middle of the lineup slugger, especially on the road. Move him back to 2nd, where he belongs.

    Additionally, Ortiz should bat 3rd. Why not give your best hitter more plate appearances.

    Nava should bat cleanup. Imagine having an opposing starter facing off against Ellsbury, Pedroia, and Ortiz. That 1-3 will accelerate pitch counts and increase the likelihood of bringing in a middle reliever. Moreover, Nava will frequently have PAs with men on base. Against the Jays last night, he had 2 doubles with no one on base.

    That Victorino continues to bat 2nd is on Farrell. If I could see this, so can he. Any manager can look good when their players are performing well (and follow Bobby Valentine). Heck, Grady Little was 6 outs from leading the Red Sox to their first WS in 17 years. Yet firing Little and hiring Terry made the biggest difference in the world. Like Farrell, Grady didn't put his best OBP guys at the top of his lineup. In 2003, rookie Hideki Matsui and his 16 HRs had more RBI than Manny Ramirez.

    When the team traded for Peavy, the Sox stopped playing with house money and went into win-now mode. The honeymoon is over for Farrell. Will he fix the top of his lineup or will he remain stubborn and unwilling to change?

    Will Cherrington call up Butler and Assad from Pawtucket, before 9/1? They're hitting well and are in their mid-20s. What's the deal there?

     

     

     




    Ross will be back soon, and are you talking about Alex Hassan? Might wanna know their names. Butler is 27 and Hassan is not the solution.

    They have had the top offense all year and a couple guys are in a little slump. It happens, thats baseball. You dont start trying to fix whats not truly broke just because a couple players arent hitting right now.

    Nava clean up over papi? you cant be serious...

    Leave it just the way it is. these guys are all good hitters and will come around sooner than later. You can tinker with 5-9 a little, which Farrell has, but 1-4 is the way it should be IMHO.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    if offense is cold tonight and tomorrow i wouldnt be surprised to see a shake up for sundays game.

    Nothing wrong with batting ortiz 3rd as long as victorino doesnt throw a hissy fit getting dropped.  hopefully he takes a cue from napoli who hasnt complained publicly about sliding in the order. 

    i would slide napoli back up into 4th and see if that confidence boost doesnt translate to knocks......

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Once the Yankees were struggling so Billy Martin chose names out of a hat. I'm  going to try that now ...

     

    Napoli, 1b

    Saltalamacchia, c

    Ortiz, dh

    Ellsbury, cf

    Middlebrooks, 3b

    Pedroia,  2b

    Victorino, rf

    Gomes/Nava, lf

    Drew, ss

     

     

    ... OK, bad idea ...

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    Once the Yankees were struggling so Billy Martin chose names out of a hat. I'm  going to try that now ...

     

    Napoli, 1b

    Saltalamacchia, c

    Ortiz, dh

    Ellsbury, cf

    Middlebrooks, 3b

    Pedroia,  2b

    Victorino, rf

    Gomes/Nava, lf

    Drew, ss

     

     

    ... OK, bad idea ...

     




    LOL!

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    Once the Yankees were struggling so Billy Martin chose names out of a hat. I'm  going to try that now ...

     

    Napoli, 1b

    Saltalamacchia, c

    Ortiz, dh

    Ellsbury, cf

    Middlebrooks, 3b

    Pedroia,  2b

    Victorino, rf

    Gomes/Nava, lf

    Drew, ss

     

     

    ... OK, bad idea ...

     




    Sounds interesting...Ok, Ill give it a try...

    Pedey 2b

    Papi DH

    Drew SS

    Salty C

    Middlebrooks 3b

    Gomes/Nava LF

    Victorino CF

    Napoli 1b

    Ellsbury CF

     

    Ok, thats interesting...Hows that Cuban Pete? Better?

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Boston had 69 wins last year.This year they've won 72 games with 40 left to go and currently lead the AL East by 2 games.

    Maybe people should just relax and enjoy how well the Red Sox are doing instead of complaining about the team is being run.Whatever they're doing seems to be working pretty well for them.

     
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    The solution is: there is no solution.

    Too many weak bats in the lineup. While Gomes and Drew have come through with clutch hits at times, percentagewise they are horrible.

    Napoli would be an okay #6 hitter, the Sox do not have a good choice for #3 or #5. I agree Pedroia is better as a #2, but with no options Farrell is left with no better choice than Pedroia batting #3.

    Blame Cherrybomb, for not getting a legit #5 hitter. Napoli, Gomes and Drew all belong near the bottom of any order, no higher than #6. When faced with those three, Victornio must bat #2, because the other options are worse.

    "Here we are trapped in the amber of the moment. There is no why.- Kurt Vonnegut

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to ZILLAGOD's comment:

     

    The solution is: there is no solution.

    Too many weak bats in the lineup. While Gomes and Drew have come through with clutch hits at times, percentagewise they are horrible.

    Napoli would be an okay #6 hitter, the Sox do not have a good choice for #3 or #5. I agree Pedroia is better as a #2, but with no options Farrell is left with no better choice than Pedroia batting #3.

    Blame Cherrybomb, for not getting a legit #5 hitter. Napoli, Gomes and Drew all belong near the bottom of any order, no higher than #6. When faced with those three, Victornio must bat #2, because the other options are worse.

    "Here we are trapped in the amber of the moment. There is no why.- Kurt Vonnegut

     



    Maybe he was counting on Middy to be that #5 guy like so many here were. Or napoli. Things happen. Thats baseball.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to ZILLAGOD's comment:

    The solution is: there is no solution.

    Too many weak bats in the lineup. While Gomes and Drew have come through with clutch hits at times, percentagewise they are horrible.

    Napoli would be an okay #6 hitter, the Sox do not have a good choice for #3 or #5. I agree Pedroia is better as a #2, but with no options Farrell is left with no better choice than Pedroia batting #3.

    Blame Cherrybomb, for not getting a legit #5 hitter. Napoli, Gomes and Drew all belong near the bottom of any order, no higher than #6. When faced with those three, Victornio must bat #2, because the other options are worse.

    "Here we are trapped in the amber of the moment. There is no why.- Kurt Vonnegut



    You re right, but really Napoli is a DH, not a every day 1b.  During month of April while Papi is out, Napoli was smashing balls all over the place as a DH hitter.  Since Papi came off of DL, Napoli cant hit but playing great as a 1b defender for the whole season.

    Guess Napoli cant be an every day positional player where I assume his hip is acting up more and more once he continue to play more and more games.  That is why he need to alternate with Carp for the rest of the season to stay fresh for post season.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to ZILLAGOD's comment:

     

    The solution is: there is no solution.

    Too many weak bats in the lineup. While Gomes and Drew have come through with clutch hits at times, percentagewise they are horrible.

    Napoli would be an okay #6 hitter, the Sox do not have a good choice for #3 or #5. I agree Pedroia is better as a #2, but with no options Farrell is left with no better choice than Pedroia batting #3.

    Blame Cherrybomb, for not getting a legit #5 hitter. Napoli, Gomes and Drew all belong near the bottom of any order, no higher than #6. When faced with those three, Victornio must bat #2, because the other options are worse.

    "Here we are trapped in the amber of the moment. There is no why.- Kurt Vonnegut

     



    Maybe he was counting on Middy to be that #5 guy like so many here were. Or napoli. Things happen. Thats baseball.

     




    I believe you may have nailed it. Middlebrooks as a #5 would have been sweet, if he didn't go into a tailspin.

    My apologies to Mr. Cherrybomb ( who despite the colorful nickname , is not someone I dislike. I think he'll be a good GM. It's just that , after the mercurial success of Theo, everyone expected Cherry to be another boy genius). I really do like the guy, I just can't resist using the obvious and colorful nickname.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to GoUconn13's comment:

    In response to ZILLAGOD's comment:

     

    The solution is: there is no solution.

    Too many weak bats in the lineup. While Gomes and Drew have come through with clutch hits at times, percentagewise they are horrible.

    Napoli would be an okay #6 hitter, the Sox do not have a good choice for #3 or #5. I agree Pedroia is better as a #2, but with no options Farrell is left with no better choice than Pedroia batting #3.

    Blame Cherrybomb, for not getting a legit #5 hitter. Napoli, Gomes and Drew all belong near the bottom of any order, no higher than #6. When faced with those three, Victornio must bat #2, because the other options are worse.

    "Here we are trapped in the amber of the moment. There is no why.- Kurt Vonnegut

     



    You re right, but really Napoli is a DH, not a every day 1b.  During month of April while Papi is out, Napoli was smashing balls all over the place as a DH hitter.  Since Papi came off of DL, Napoli cant hit but playing great as a 1b defender for the whole season.

     

    Guess Napoli cant be an every day positional player where I assume his hip is acting up more and more once he continue to play more and more games.  That is why he need to alternate with Carp for the rest of the season to stay fresh for post season.




    Another good point.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxpride34. Show redsoxpride34's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    what about this line up:

    victorino

    pedroia

    ellsbury

    ortiz

    napoli

    nava/gomes

    middlebrooks

    salty

    drew

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    I think that our offense depends a lot on Ellsbury and Pedroia getting on base and being the catalyst. When that does not happen, the offense often looks flat.  I agree with batting Pedroia second. Our problem continues to be that we do not have a legitimate slugger to bat behind Ortiz. Maybe Nava could do the job for now. Ben seems determined to keep Bogaerts at Pawtucket a while longer. Middlebrooks has yet to produce on a consistent basis. We really don't have many options at this time.

    Stabbed by Foulke.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    Once the Yankees were struggling so Billy Martin chose names out of a hat. I'm  going to try that now ...

     

    Napoli, 1b

    Saltalamacchia, c

    Ortiz, dh

    Ellsbury, cf

    Middlebrooks, 3b

    Pedroia,  2b

    Victorino, rf

    Gomes/Nava, lf

    Drew, ss

      

    ... OK, bad idea ...


    Looks like a bad idea because conventional wisdom has us all believing that certain types of hitters have to be slotted inti certain spots in the lineup.  Research has shown that conventional wisdom is wrong on many points when it comes to setting lineups.

    Billy Martin was actually on to something here.  He could draw his lineup out of a hat everyday, and aside from the effect this would have on the batters due to them being creatures of habit, he would win about the same number of games that he would using a "traditional" line up every day.

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc44. Show MadMc44's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Go back to the initial post--it's an absolute mirical they are in first place with the high % age of K's  from four players, Nap, Salty, Drew and WMB---all these guys are now regulars. This does not bode well for the LOB statistic. So after Ortiz and Nava or Gomes you have a strong chance of seeing K's until you turn the corner for Ells.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from splendidsplinterteddyballgame. Show splendidsplinterteddyballgame's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to dannycater's comment:

    Ortiz is the No. 4 hitter.



    Your best hitter should hit third.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    In response to slasher9's comment:

    if offense is cold tonight and tomorrow i wouldnt be surprised to see a shake up for sundays game.

    Nothing wrong with batting ortiz 3rd as long as victorino doesnt throw a hissy fit getting dropped.  hopefully he takes a cue from napoli who hasnt complained publicly about sliding in the order. 

    i would slide napoli back up into 4th and see if that confidence boost doesnt translate to knocks......



    The only place I would slide KNap is further down the pine on the bench. He has stunk for a very long time. He had his chance and he could not come through. No way I play him in any more than half the games until he improves.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from beezer. Show beezer's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    the stupidity has to stop. trade for a 5 hitter rh power, 1st or lf. napoli would bat 10th on the yankmes. times runnin out, call up bogey, gotta be able to hit lefties better than drewstain.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    Red Sox score runs. We're 2nd in MLB in scoring runs. 

    We score less runs vs. good pitching.  It's a weird anomaly witness all over baseball were teams tend to score less runs vs. good pitching.....must be why it's GOOD PITCHING.

    If the Sox can't score runs vs. good pitching how is it a problem, unless they are doing worst against good pitching than other teams.

    So if the Sox don't hit good pitching and other teams hit against it better where are these teams scoring less runs than the Sox?

    Maybe all these teams that score less runs than us hit the good pitchers and they are completely shut down by bad pitchers.

    So the recipee is simple people.....when we get to the playoffs we have to pitch our worst pitchers in games 1 and 2.   Because I guess lesser teams can't hit bad pitching, they can only hit good pitching.

    It all makes sense now. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Farrell's horrid lineup and other observations...

    It should be pointed  out that "Farrell's horrid lineup" is second in the MLB in runs, 10th in home runs, first in walks drawn, third in stolen bases, third in average, first in on base percentage and second in OPS.

    Again, that  is in all of MLB.

     

     
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