Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    So, are you saying the...

    "Rays will not go away!"
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    Age  Pitcher      W-L  ERA   WHIP  Years of team control

    22 Matt Moore  1-0   2.89 1.286  8 years
    12:$1M, 13:$1M, 14:$1M, 15:$3M, 16:$5M, 17:$7M club option ($2.5M buyout), 18:$9M club option ($1M buyout), 19:$10M club option ($0.75M buyout)

    23 Alex Cobb    3-2   3.42  1.329  5 + years (pre-arb)

    24 Hellickson 13-10 2.95  1.153  5 years (pre-arb)

    25 D. Price      12-13 3.49  1.137  4 years (12:$1.5M -Then 3 arb years)

    25 W. Davis    11-10 4.45  1.375  6 years (12:$1.5M, 13:$2.8M, 14:$4.8M,  15:$7M club option, 16:$8M club option, 17:$10M club option ($2.5M buyout))

    28 J.Nieman    11-7   4.06  1.241  3 years (3 arb years)

    29 J.Shields    16-12  2.82  1.043  3 years  
    (12:$7M 13:$9M club option ($1.5M buyout), 14:$12M club option ($1M buyout))

    That's 7 quality young starters all under team control for 3 or more years.
    Cost:
    2012: ~$13M (Counting arb estimates )
    2013: ~$17M (Depending on arbs)
    2014: ~$24M (Depending on arbs)

     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    When moon said the Rays were not going away he did not mean just for 2011 he meant for the next three years.

    Had the Rays gone and added (they still could) a 30 homer 100 ribbie bat then I would say be concerned, very concerned.
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    Well if the Sox want to play like spoiled children again in 2012 you should expect the Rays to beat them. Now that we have 2 Wild Cards I suppose we can expect spoiled brats to make the play-offs.
     
    Neither team makes the WS if a) Tampa does not ad a bat, and b) the Sox play like ack-azzes in September.

    Point: Do NOT TAKE TAMPA AS A GOAT
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    We have to check but I believe it is absolute either in 12 or 13.
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    In Response to Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?:
    Not sure they need a 30/100 guy with that pitching staff.  The Sox having to face Price and Moore in the same series is pretty disheartening.
    Posted by andrewmitch

    They may not have added a 30-100 guy, but they will have Jennings all year and might have enough cash to make a late signing or July move.

     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    They did not make a move last summer when they should have, I question their FO's desire to win while they hold many of the cards.


     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    Last year showed they absolutely needed a 30/100 player. It is insane they refuse(d) to even make one significant move. 

    Pitching only gets you so far, as does offense. You need both. Ask the 2011 Rays, Red Sox, and Phillies about that if you don't believe me.
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    A 91 win team went away. The question is:

    What can be done to fix disaster left by half a billion and no playoff wins moves of Inesptein, to avoid repeating the biggest collapse in MLB season history!

    I've already provided 40 man roster specific details on how to do that. Silva was one of the correct moves, so far. Trading Ellsbury for a long term star RH OF bat profile, like J. Upton, would be another one.
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    In Response to Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?:
    A 91 win team went away. The question is: What can be done to fix disaster left by half a billion and no playoff wins moves of Inesptein, to avoid repeating the biggest collapse in MLB season history! I've already provided 40 man roster specific details on how to do that. Silva was one of the correct moves, so far. Trading Ellsbury for a long term star RH OF bat profile, like J. Upton, would be another one.
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr


     The Upton/Ells deal is perfect, Upton is younger, 24, has RH pop and is a good guy. I actually crossed paths with him in Norfolk Va, last month, to say he's 6-2, is generous.
     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    In Response to Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?:
    In Response to Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays? :  The Upton/Ells deal is perfect, Upton is younger, 24, has RH pop and is a good guy. I actually crossed paths with him in Norfolk Va, last month, to say he's 6-2, is generous.
    Posted by YOUKILLUS20

    Why would AZ trade a younger player with 2 more years of team control for a Bora$$ client who will walk in 2 years?

    Upton:  12:$6.75M, 13:$9.75M, 14:$14.25M, 15:$14.5M 

    Jacoby will likely get a higher contract than $6.75M, so AZ won't even save money short-term. The same is probable for 2013. If they really want to trade Upton, they would likely do it July 2013 or that following winter.  Just like the silly clown's Kemp deal scenario, it's just not realistic.

    I'd do this deal in a flash, but it ain't happening.

     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    In Response to Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?:
    They did not make a move last summer when they should have, I question their FO's desire to win while they hold many of the cards.
    Posted by BurritoT

    I was surprised as well, especially since they got out of having to pay Manny's deal, they should have had extra money to play with.

    They do have some encouraging outlooks on their offense in 2012:

    1) 25 year old Longoria missed over 20 games to injury and only hit .244. I gotta think they get more from him in 2012.

    2) 24 year old Desmond Jennings will be on the 25 man all season and could easily improve on: .259/.356/.449/.805. Project his 2011 numbers to ~660 PAs:
      .259  23 HRs and 45 SBs
    Jennings is essentially taking Fuld's slot (.240/.313/.360/.673) and gives them a nice defensive 4th OF'er.

    3) Playing Jennings all year in the OF allows Zobrist to play 2B and Sean Rodriguez to play SS. This should improve TB's offense mostly by addition by subtraction:
      Rodriguez: .223/.323/.357/.679
      instead of:
      Brignac:  .193/.227/.221/.448
      Johnson: .194/.257/.338/.595
        While .679 looks bad, it's a lot better than the ~.500 OPS of Brignac & Johnson combined.

    4) 26 year old Matt Joyce could be coming into his own:
          .277/.347/.478/.825 in 522 PAs

    5) Replacing Shoppach's 253 PAs at catcher:
           .176/.268/.339/.607
         With more from...
         LH'd hitting Jaso  .224/.298/.354/.651  (27 y/o)
           (Jaso has a career .720 OPS vs RHPs)
         Chirinos (27) & Lobaton (26)

    Possible losses:
      1) Hard to expect an improvement from Kotchman's .800 OPS.
      2) Can they do better than Damon's .743 OPS mostly at DH?
         

     
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    Re: Forget the yankees, how much more are we gonna take from The Rays?

    "I don't think we need a kid who dogs it, thanks anyways.

    Besides, on what planet do the Rays trade for Ellsbury - he's not in their price range.  And on what planet would the Sox downgrade their CF/leadoff hitter whilst giving a division rival a better player?

    OK, I've convinced myself this had to sarcasim."

    The previous poster was talking about Justin Upton (Arizona), not B.J.  You are aware B.J. has a brother, right??
     
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