Francona's book

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    Francona's book

    I found it interesting that in Francona's book there was a comment about Beckett not doing well in the 6th inning, and he was finally taken out of the game in the 8th after giving up 6 runs. Finally taking out in the 8th?

    I just wonder what that was about, and was I really paying close attention to details like that during the season. Was he being set up as a fall guy?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Francona's book


    And being honest, did anyone think we would lose by one game? Were we really paying attention to details like that?

    I know there have been alot of posts on this board about September's ERA that year for the pitching staff, but I think 6 runs should be removed from Beckett's. Who knows how many games deserve a revisit. I don't remember anyone pointing that game out.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    In response to kimsaysthis' comment:

    I found it interesting that in Francona's book there was a comment about Beckett not doing well in the 6th inning, and he was finally taken out of the game in the 8th after giving up 6 runs. Finally taking out in the 8th?

    I just wonder what that was about, and was I really paying close attention to details like that during the season. Was he being set up as a fall guy?



    I think Francona was pushing Beckett a bit in that game because the bullpen was totally spent at that point. Beckett allowed two runs in six innings so no problem bringing him back for the seventh. However, he gave up two runs in the seventh, so his line should have been 7 IP, 4 ER -- not great but you're still giving the team a chance to win.

    But Tito brought Beckett back for the eighth and he gave up two more runs. I think if the pen had not been worn out, I don't think he would have. If I remember the state correctly, Boston starters averaged 4.2 innings per start in September and that's with Beckett and Lester going more than that seven of 10 combined starts. The Sox starters after those two were getting lit up all the time and the bullpen was fried by the end of September.

     
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    Re: Francona's book

    people talk about Ben doing in Bard in 2012 w/starter move but I think Bard started to reach his end that horrible September when his arm almost fell off pitching so many game because of the brew crew...he was never the same after that month/season of hell

    As always - 100% correct!

     

     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    In response to georom4's comment:

    people talk about Ben doing in Bard in 2012 w/starter move but I think Bard started to reach his end that horrible September when his arm almost fell off pitching so many game because of the brew crew...he was never the same after that month/season of hell

    As always - 100% correct!

     



    Bard was only 21st in IPs for RPs that year, and his 2011 total was lower than 2010.  And his collapse started at the very beginning of September when he still only had 61 IPs.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

    In response to georom4's comment:

     

    people talk about Ben doing in Bard in 2012 w/starter move but I think Bard started to reach his end that horrible September when his arm almost fell off pitching so many game because of the brew crew...he was never the same after that month/season of hell

    As always - 100% correct!

     

     



    Bard was only 21st in IPs for RPs that year, and his 2011 total was lower than 2010.  And his collapse started at the very beginning of September when he still only had 61 IPs.

     



    Exactly. It's amazing the twists and turns people do to blame every Red Sox problem on Beckett and Lester. As you stated, he started to go bad before September. If it was because of overuse, you can blame on the fact that every other Sox starter other than Beckett and Lester stunk and weren't going deep.

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to kimsaysthis' comment:

     

    I found it interesting that in Francona's book there was a comment about Beckett not doing well in the 6th inning, and he was finally taken out of the game in the 8th after giving up 6 runs. Finally taking out in the 8th?

    I just wonder what that was about, and was I really paying close attention to details like that during the season. Was he being set up as a fall guy?

     



    I think Francona was pushing Beckett a bit in that game because the bullpen was totally spent at that point. Beckett allowed two runs in six innings so no problem bringing him back for the seventh. However, he gave up two runs in the seventh, so his line should have been 7 IP, 4 ER -- not great but you're still giving the team a chance to win.

     

    But Tito brought Beckett back for the eighth and he gave up two more runs. I think if the pen had not been worn out, I don't think he would have. If I remember the state correctly, Boston starters averaged 4.2 innings per start in September and that's with Beckett and Lester going more than that seven of 10 combined starts. The Sox starters after those two were getting lit up all the time and the bullpen was fried by the end of September.



    Thanks, Roy. Makes sense when you have the details. So many different circumstances involved in pitching stats.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    The entire pitching staff was blown out by September.  They were great until Buch went down.  They were able to hold it together for a month, but doing so blew out the BP.

    had they gone out and gotten a pitcher of Peavy's caliber when Buch went down in 2011, I think the season would have ended much differently.  Had they not gotten Peavy this year, chances are the team would be out of it.  Getting Peavy not only shored up the rotation, it sent a message to the team that the front office was going to do everything they could to help them win.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from S5. Show S5's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    In response to DirtyWaterLover's comment:

    The entire pitching staff was blown out by September.  They were great until Buch went down.  They were able to hold it together for a month, but doing so blew out the BP.

    had they gone out and gotten a pitcher of Peavy's caliber when Buch went down in 2011, I think the season would have ended much differently.  Had they not gotten Peavy this year, chances are the team would be out of it.  Getting Peavy not only shored up the rotation, it sent a message to the team that the front office was going to do everything they could to help them win.


    Whoa.  Let's maintain a shred of reality here, ok?  This team has a 6 1/2 game lead.  Peavy is 3-1 in seven appearances with 4 ND's and a 3.55 ERA.

    Don't get me wrong. I very much like what he's doing but at the same time the guy(s) he replaced were doing ok too.  IMO they may be as many as two games better off now with him than they would have been without him. 

    To say that this team would be "out of it" without him is more than a bit of a stretch.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Francona's book


    Some of my favorite posters have wound up on my thread. I'm happy.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Francona's book

    In response to S5's comment:

    In response to DirtyWaterLover's comment:

    The entire pitching staff was blown out by September.  They were great until Buch went down.  They were able to hold it together for a month, but doing so blew out the BP.

    had they gone out and gotten a pitcher of Peavy's caliber when Buch went down in 2011, I think the season would have ended much differently.  Had they not gotten Peavy this year, chances are the team would be out of it.  Getting Peavy not only shored up the rotation, it sent a message to the team that the front office was going to do everything they could to help them win.

     


    Whoa.  Let's maintain a shred of reality here, ok?  This team has a 6 1/2 game lead.  Peavy is 3-1 in seven appearances with 4 ND's and a 3.55 ERA.

    Don't get me wrong. I very much like what he's doing but at the same time the guy(s) he replaced were doing ok too.  IMO they may be as many as two games better off now with him than they would have been without him. 

    To say that this team would be "out of it" without him is more than a bit of a stretch.




    Yeah, that might have been a bit of an overstatement, but don't overlook the dominoe effect. He's gone deep into game, which has helped keep the bullpen fresh.

    Workman was pitching well in that spot, but would have he kept it up? If so, great. If not, the pen might have been strained in his start, which could have led to carry over in other games.

    The Sox likely would still be in 1st place w/o Peavy, but he certainly helped give the pitching staff quality depth, which the Sox didn't have in 2011.

     
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