Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]Geo - while ur fiery tone isn't misplaced, I think the term " damage " is. Tito's ways can be maddening to fans. And I agree his approach may have played a part to this horrendous start. But you have to admit, Tito's been proven right in the long run. You said it yourself: No other manager could have stayed so loose engineering an historic comeback. And while we are seeing the downside to this approach, you have to remember, this season is only half a month long. We have 2004-2010 to measure the overall effects of his managing. And until it's proven over time that his approach is in fact damaging , he will be in that dugout. Count on it.
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    ive been pretty patient this year and even i know tito cant hit in the clutch or pitch for his team - but everyone on the planet knows this team has huge talent - the fact that it was soooo slow out of the gate points to  him...having said that there is a ridiculous amount of games left and I see no team in the ALeast that can beat the sox...this is why i drank the kool aid and predicted a 99 win game season...i think Theo did everything he could (apologies to AndrewM and others) to make it a sure thing...the team simply has to play to potential

    two games in a row is a good start -  i will take it
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    I think the criicism of the manager is unfounded.

    the players are the ones who have been terrible.  Francona has won world championships - which should be at least some proof that he is not terrible.

    Maybe they would be 0 - 14 if not for Francona.  Ever considered that?
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club



    Francona has helped Boston win two championships and after a slow start, some of you are bashing him?  Wow.......

    You guys might as well bash Tom Brady too or even Ben Affleck ("The Town" was an awesome movie). 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    You have the right to think as you please I think the sox would be above .500 if they had a major league manager. With a real manager they would have been prepared coming out of spring training. They also could have won several other games, but with the weak manager we have he would not remove an imploding pitcher. Other small things could have been done also. Perhaps the team could be 14-0 with a decent manager leading this allstar team.


    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]I think the criicism of the manager is unfounded. the players are the ones who have been terrible.  Francona has won world championships - which should be at least some proof that he is not terrible. Maybe they would be 0 - 14 if not for Francona.  Ever considered that?
    Posted by Schumpeters-Ghost[/QUOTE]
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Geo - Theo never addressed the pitching staff as we have the same questionable rotation as last year and we still do not have a single bona fide left handed reliever in the pen........
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    andrew - jenks is a nice pickup imho for a set up guy - wake is great for mop up and the occasional start, and paps isnt a sure thing but w/Bard in there as well we cant complain too much - no team has all the pieces it wants but barring injuries again, this Sox team should WALK to the division title...I really believe that...NYY are just not as talented or youthful, TB has lost everyone good, and Balt & Tor are rising but years away....if we cant do it with Pedey, Agon, Youk, Lester, Clay, Crawford, in their abso prime, then something is messed up.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Back in 04 they had a group of guys who called themselves the "idiots". Those players are gone and the personnel has changed. What the sox needed for leadership then and now is different. From my observations the team is lacking total leadership and by his own admission terry is weak. So what is messed up is the manger and his coaching staff. One is gone we need two more gone and this team can turn it around.


    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]andrew - jenks is a nice pickup imho for a set up guy - wake is great for mop up and the occasional start, and paps isnt a sure thing but w/Bard in there as well we cant complain too much - no team has all the pieces it wants but barring injuries again, this Sox team should WALK to the division title...I really believe that...NYY are just not as talented or youthful, TB has lost everyone good, and Balt & Tor are rising but years away....if we cant do it with Pedey, Agon, Youk, Lester, Clay, Crawford, in their abso prime, then something is messed up.
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from sunslav. Show sunslav's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Concern Troll #1 = RedSox-11. Put him onto Ignore.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    In your case please do!

    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]Concern Troll #1 = RedSox-11. Put him onto Ignore.
    Posted by sunslav[/QUOTE]
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from sunslav. Show sunslav's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    OK
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club


    Good because we do not need name calling here it is against the rules.

    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]OK
    Posted by sunslav[/QUOTE]
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    The criticism of Tito has merit, but if his approach proves to be effective in the long run, how many of these Tito critics will admit to it?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Two more straight wins and the team's dreadful start could be a memory.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from marstan. Show marstan's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    AIN'T IT FUNNY THAT THE YANKS ARE IN FIRST AND WE ARE IN LAST.
    WOW, WHAT A COINKYDINK !! THE YANKS GO OUT AND TAILOR A
    PERFECT TEAM FOR THEIR BALLPARK, LEFTY POWER LIKE CANO, TEX,
    GRANDERSON, POSADA, SWISHER, AND EVEN A ROD WHO CAN HIT
    EM OUT ANYWHERE. WE GO OUT AND BUY AN OVER RATED LEFTY
    LIKE CRAWFORD WHO CANNOT HIT LEFTY PITCHING AND IS A PUNCH
    AND JUDY AVERAGE HITTER AT BEST. $160 MILLION DOWN THE
    TOILET. A GON IS A GAP HITTER, WHO WILL NOT HELP BOSTON
    WHEN THEY ARE DOWN THREE WITH A COUPLE OF RUNNERS ON IN
    THE 7TH.. WE NEEDED TEXEIRA OR EVEN GRANDERSON. BUT INSTEAD
    WE WASTED 300 MILLION ON GAP HITTERS. SO WE HAVE ONE
    HR THREAT ON OUR TEAM,...FAT, OLD PAPI AND THAT'S IT.
    LOTSA LUCK TRYING TO CATCH THE YANKS WITH THIS TEAM THAT
    THEO HAS CONSTRUCTED. WE HAVE NO REAL POWER HITTING...
    JUST STATION TO STATION BALL, AND IT WILL NOT WORK !!
    THAT'S WHY WE ARE IN LAST PLACE. THE LEAGUE IS WISE TO US,
    AND THEY WILL JUST OVERSHIFT PAPI, CARL, AND AGON ALL SEASON.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Notice how a lot of the recommendations on these boards have to do with moving players around on the batting line up? Fact is, the line up really has little to do with why the team is losing. It's poor pitching.

    Like it or not, Francona is handling the slump correctly. The pitchers will not get out of their rut by pulling the hook early everytime. Pitchers also need practice getting through jams. This early in the season, you just have to let them keep throwing and figure out how to work through their own issues.

    It's not time to micromanage every pitch.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    They juggled the line-up as of game 2, hardly a reactionary move to one loss - the Red Sox could be 10-0 and Tito still would have (mangled) juggled the line-up just as much.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    since our 2007 championship we have been trending downhill as our payroll has skyrocketed...the past 3 years our april has been maddening with the team and key players being unprepared for the entire first month...it is hurting us aND IT obvious that that apologists for our manager believe nothing is ever his fault

    Did you know you were wrong when you posted that?  Or did you post randomly and hope you were right?

    April, 2008 .593
    April, 2009 .636
    April, 2010 .478
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from marstan. Show marstan's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Frown ANTIQUEMAN...U ARE RIGHT ON TARGET. WE DIDN'T NEED CRAWFORD
    OR GONZO.  BELTRE WAS FINE, AND SO WAS YOUK AT FIRST.
    HOW COME THE YANKS CAN STEAL GRANDERSON FROM THE
    TIGERS FOR A ROOKIE, AND WE ARE STUCK WITH STRIKEOUT
    KING, ELLSBURY.  WE'RE STUCK WITH CAMERON, DREW, SALTY,
    AND SCUTARO....HARDLY WHAT YOU CALL THE STUFF OF 
    CHAMPIONSHIP PLAYERS, EVEN THOUGH DREW WAS ACCIDENTALLY
    ON A CHAMPIONSHIP SQUAD. WHATTA STIFF !!!  WE JUST DON'T
    MAKE SMART GETS.  WE COULD HAVE USED RUSSELL MARTIN TO
    CATCH...BUT NOOOO !!  THE YANKS GET HIM FIRST AND WE ARE
    STUCK WITH "NO HIT" SALTY, A TRIPLE A PLAYER, AT BEST.
    WE COULD HAVE USED CHAVEZ TO SPELL BOTH A GON AND
    YOUK, BUT NOOO !!!  THE YANKS GET HIM TOO.  WOW, THEO
    IS ASLEEP AT THE SWITCH.  SO WE HAVE SALTY AND OVER THE
    HILL TEK. WHATTA DEAL !!!  THE YANKS GET ANDRUW JONES
    AT AGE 31, AND WE GET 37 YEAR OLD CAMERON.  WHATTA DEAL !!
    AT THIS POINT THE SOX ARE NOT MUCH BETTER THAN THE METS.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from fizsh. Show fizsh's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    The problem I have with many of those who criticize Francona at every turn is that when the Sox win, they claim the players won it, or that the Sox won IN SPITE OF Francona.  He is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't with these people.  Many of us that support Francona admit he is not perfect, no person is.  I have questioned some of his moves in the past, though I always admit he has more information about the situation, being at the game in the dugout talking with the players and other coaches, than I have sitting in my living room.  But I have said this before and will say it again, he knows how to manage THE SEASON.  He shows faith in his players and his players generally respond to that.   

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]The problem I have with many of those who criticize Francona at every turn is that when the Sox win, they claim the players won it, or that the Sox won IN SPITE OF Francona.  He is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't with these people.    
    Posted by fizsh[/QUOTE]

    This is why they are to be ignored.

    When basedoc/redsox11 or 1941 and their ilk post, I just scroll right past them.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Considering the same people say this every season, it sort of diminishes it every time it's said. 

    The recent history of the Red Sox is full of 95-win seasons with wire-to-wire whining about how much the team sucks and how much the manager and GM need to be fired...a lot of us have learned to tune it out, because such sentiments will be there no matter what the team does. 

    The same people who always spew negativity, even in the good times, are doing so now too. I don't think it really has nothing to do with the slow start, although that provides an excuse. 
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]The problem I have with many of those who criticize Francona at every turn is that when the Sox win, they claim the players won it, or that the Sox won IN SPITE OF Francona.  He is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't with these people.  Many of us that support Francona admit he is not perfect, no person is.  I have questioned some of his moves in the past, though I always admit he has more information about the situation, being at the game in the dugout talking with the players and other coaches, than I have sitting in my living room.  But I have said this before and will say it again, he knows how to manage THE SEASON.  He shows faith in his players and his players generally respond to that.   
    Posted by fizsh[/QUOTE]


    These same people will not credit Francona for getting the Sox to 89 wins despite all the injuries. They say the players are able to win despite Francona. In last year's case, a lot of starters were not even playing.

    To me that is not very different from BB leading last year's Pats team to a very good season despite playing a lot of rookies. The difference is that BB had pre-season to prepare the rookies. Francona had to make on-the-fly in-season adjustments everytime someone goes out.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    In Response to Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club:
    [QUOTE]Two more straight wins and the team's dreadful start could be a memory.
    Posted by BurritoT[/QUOTE]

    Unless these guys start hitting up and down the line-up, relying on the SP to keep us in the games won't work, at least it hasn't thus far.
    The last two games however, are a good sign, and should give the club some confidence going forward.
    Crawford has been a huge disappointment, and Gonzo really hasn't hit like he can (1 HR vs. Ells 3).
    Youk will hit better but he needs to bat in front in front of Gonzo to see some better pitches to get him started again.
    Saltalamacchia is just plain awful. Even if he does manage to start driving the ball, istead of seeing-eye singles, his defense is atrocious. Teams will run all year long because they know what we have behind the plate.
    Lowrie needs to be in the line-up everyday, somewhere. If not SS, then DH.
    Drew just needs to go home.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Posts: 8664
    First: 5/30/2008
    Last: 4/17/2011
    since our 2007 championship we have been trending downhill as our payroll has skyrocketed...the past 3 years our april has been maddening with the team and key players being unprepared for the entire first month...it is hurting us aND IT obvious that that apologists for our manager believe nothing is ever his fault

    April, 2009 .636
    April, 2010 .478
    April 2011  .286

    2010 .549
    2009 .586 Lost LDS 3-0
    2008 .586  lost Pennant 4-3
    2007 - World Series Champs

    Joey, do you just post hoping people swallow your bs or do you actually believe the lies you post?

    here are the facts - sukk on it
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from M1A2. Show M1A2's posts

    Re: Francona's easy going ways has damaged this club

    Hard to respect a poster whose thread title displays very poor grammar--lack of subject-verb agreement. 

    Francona managed the Sox to two WS after the 86 year drought. 

    Last year the pitching was the 9th best in the AL and the lineup sustained major hits when Pedroia and Youk were DL'd for the season, but the Sox still won 89 games. 

    Right now the Sox are hurting because the pitching is the absolute worst in the AL with an ERA of 6, a full run worse than the 13th best ERA.  Oh, and the hitting is 8th best in runs scored.

    And this.  What in the world is "easy going" and exactly how do you prove it?  My impression is that, since the opening series blowout by the Rangers, the Sox have been the opposite of easy going.  They are all feeling the heat because they know they are playing below expectations.   
     

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