Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.

    Round of applause for the Yawkey Way Puppet Show.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from oscars. Show oscars's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    And you know this how?
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    Round of applause for the Yawkey Way Puppet Show.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07



    mb, did you read my post about the subject of manager and gm recently (prior to this) . disputed by most. now some can see it for themselves
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc44. Show MadMc44's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    Hindsight 20/20 bred.

    Ben is not to be pitied--he knew what he was getting into. If there is a next time--in front of all parties--"is there anyone else you would like to invite to the party?"

    Ben will be fine and management will be fine. Valentine will be inaugurated maybe as early as Tuesday. V has probably already begun making a list of coaches and lineups-possible trade options to discuss with Ben and LL in addition to FA he would find helpful.

    He will be a good choice for a veteran team in a big market--let's just take a deep breath and relax.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    Cherington quits, ends up in Chitown with old buddies, Lucchino takes the reins as GM...it could happen, just about anything seems possible at this point.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from drpjn. Show drpjn's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    If what we read/hear is accurate, ownership has sent a powerful message to Ben.  Looks to me that now that Theo is gone, and he was a stone in Larry's shoe, Larry is now empowered and Ben is more of a "window dressing" GM.

    But hey, who wouldn't take his job, even with the side show post September?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from WalkTheLine. Show WalkTheLine's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    I think some may be overreacting to this. Did the GM and baseball ops have autonomy when Tito was hired. I don't believe so. I expected ownership would have a role in selecting the next manager and I think that's how it should be in this situation. If the GM was somebody with waaay more experience and had earned the right to have it be his sole decision then maybe there is something to complain about. Cherington has a shorter leash than Theo did but probably not any shorter than when Theo was brand new to the job. I'm fine with that. If this "meddling" trickles in to player decisions with Larry et al effectively calling the shots then the "puppet" moninker will be appropriate. But not right now.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    this may put light on the thought process.....
    Examining the process by which the Red Sox are choosing a manager
    Posted by Scott Lauber at 1:47 am
    MILWAUKEE — All along, Ben Cherington said it would be this way.

    From Oct. 31, when Phillies bench coach Pete Mackanin came to Fenway Park to begin the Red Sox’ interview process, through last weekend when Tigers third base coach Gene Lamont closed the first round, Cherington has described the selection of the next manager as “collaborative.” Indeed, he suggested that several levels of the organization — from baseball operations through ownership — would have input in the decision.

    It began in early October when the baseball ops staff, headed by Cherington but at one point still including Theo Epstein, compiled a list of candidates, examined those candidates further by talking with sources throughout the industry, and brought them to Fenway for day-long interviews. Team president Larry Lucchino participated in various stages of those initial interviews, meeting each of the five first-round candidates (Mackanin, Brewers hitting coach Dale Sveum, Indians bench coach Sandy Alomar Jr., Blue Jays first base coach Torey Lovullo and Lamont).

    At the conclusion of that process, Cherington said Sveum would be called back for a second interview, during which he would meet with ownership. That happened on Wednesday in Milwaukee, when Sveum had lunch with Cherington, Lucchino, principal owner John Henry and chairman Tom Werner. By all accounts, Sveum had the approval of Cherington and the baseball operations staff. But the Red Sox never offered him the job, and he subsequently agreed to a three-year contract to manage the Cubs, who are now being run by Epstein.

    For the past week, even with Sveum looking like the favorite, Cherington has indicated the Red Sox would bring in at least one other candidate for a follow-up meeting, but he hasn’t identified who that would be. As colleague Michael Silverman reported yesterday, Bobby Valentine has been a candidate from nearly the start of the process and already has met with both Cherington and Lucchino, although unlike the others, that interview wasn’t made public. A few weeks ago, Valentine and Lucchino were together at a fundraising event, at which time they both downplayed, though never denied, the idea of Valentine becoming the Red Sox’ manager.

    “I wouldn’t insult my employers (at ESPN) by saying I’m interested in another job,” Valentine said at the time, likely explaining why his candidacy wasn’t made public until now, when he has emerged as a legitimate possibility.

    Moreover, according to a source, there is another yet-to-be-identified candidate who is being considered for the job. Cherington and soon-to-be-named assistant GM Mike Hazen are spending the weekend scouting in the Dominican Republic, and an industry source said yesterday that the managerial search likely won’t move forward until they return Monday. The timetable of hiring a candidate before Thanksgiving almost certainly will be extended, with Lucchino referring to Terry Francona’s date of hire (Dec. 3, 2003) as a more realistic date.

    And so, the process by which the Red Sox have been searching for a manager has come into question over the past two days. At worst, there appears to be a disconnect between ownership and baseball operations. At best, the Red Sox have seemed disorganized. After all, the Cardinals (Mike Matheny) and Cubs (Sveum) swiftly hired their new managers and moved on to other offseason business, while the Red Sox are still searching almost two months after Francona’s Sept. 30 departure.

    It’s easy to look at the Red Sox and see chaos.

    But yesterday, Lucchino insisted Cherington isn’t being undermined by ownership — earlier this week, in fact, Henry discussed the process by saying, “Ben’s in charge” — and as recently as last Friday, Cherington expressed an awareness that his views on the right candidate may well differ from ownership’s.

    “I feel my job in this to identify a very small, short list of people that I think could be a fit for us — and I may have a personal preference on who the next manager is — then give as much information as I can to ownership,” Cherington said last week, as the initial round of interviews was concluding. “They clearly have an important voice in this decision, and they need to be comfortable with the decision as much as I am. In the end, when we start to narrow the list down, I think it’ll be more collaborative at that point. To this point, it’s been more my effort on getting to know the candidates. As we get to the next level, (ownership) will get more involved.”

    To Cherington, that’s all part of the process.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    I love how some of you think you know the inner workings of the Red Sox front office.  Truly entertaining.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    lol space, right!  maybe the organization is in a mess and it needs to be sorted out carefully????? nah, that couldnt be it....
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    lol space, right!  maybe the organization is in a mess and it needs to be sorted out carefully????? nah, that couldnt be it....
    Posted by georom4


    naaaaah.

    We all know that the only possible answer is Larry L. is the Puppetmaster.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    C'mon...do you think that Theo hired Francona on his own 8 years ago with no upper management involvement?
    For that matter, have you heard any other name in the Sveum/Cubs signing other than Theo's? Where's Hoyer?
     
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    Ownership input/approval is a given, however they appear to be working in reverse. One would think that ownership (we know its really Larry calling the shots) would define the search criteria/requirements; Ben and the baseball ops team would then search based on that criteria and present who they think is the best candidate. That appears to have happened when they interviewed 5, narrowed to 1 only to be shot down... they're now looking outside the original candidate pool. I have no idea if Sveum was the right guy or not, but it appears Larry and crew hung Ben and crew out to dry with the first round of interview charades.

    As for the Tito hire, I don't remember this sort of circus taking place back in 2004, they identified a pool of candidates (which was a stronger pool, IMO), interviewed the candidates and made a hire.  Theo didn't have autonomy on decisions, but his opinion was held in high regard, IMO.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from 68fbrd. Show 68fbrd's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    Ben can hire whomever he wants as long as Larry authorizes it.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    Round of applause for the Yawkey Way Puppet Show.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    Do you think that the Red Sox revolve around what you think? If So please let us  give you a standing ovation. Now can you get your stupid remarks out of here.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from schwank. Show schwank's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    The reason everyone is overreacting to this is because they involved the public with every move they made when they started interviewing.  never in my life have I seen "candidates" paraded around.  We were literally informed of their entire intinary with a concludng presser before they left town.  Customarily, during high profile sports related interview and search, all we usually get is sports writer speculation, etc. 

    Because they made this dog and pony show it made it look like they castrated Cherington. But really folks, if we didn't know what was going on and they weren't so intuned of keeping the entire RS Nation in the loop, we would think it's a normal hiring process.   
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    Wow.  I'm amazed to learn that John Henry thinks he should have input into who the next field manager should be because that kind of decision is so routine.  Ben Cherington has been thru this process of picking a manager dozens of times and is well qualified to do so all by himself.   Also no need for Lucchino or Werner to put their two cents in. 

    If the rumors are true and it turns out that John Henry, Larry Lucchino, and Tom Werner have all meddled with the GM doing his job, I think Cherington should simply quit--or at least throw a snit fit.  


     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    In Response to Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era. : Do you think that the Red Sox revolve around what you think? If So please let us  give you a standing ovation. Now can you get your stupid remarks out of here.
    Posted by donrd4


    Easy there, cyber muscles.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    Wow.  I'm amazed to learn that John Henry thinks he should have input into who the next field manager should be because that kind of decision is so routine.  Ben Cherington has been thru this process of picking a manager dozens of times and is well qualified to do so all by himself.   Also no need for Lucchino or Werner to put their two cents in.  If the rumors are true and it turns out that John Henry, Larry Lucchino, and Tom Werner have all meddled with the GM doing his job, I think Cherington should simply quit--or at least throw a snit fit.  
    Posted by maxbialystock


    The guy is only 37, 29 when Francona was hired. so as far as I can tell, he's never been involved in "picking a manager", since he has only been associated to the GM office since 2005 under Hoyer.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    The CC deal has left a bad taste in the mouth of Lucchino et,al. There is no way BC will be able to do anything unless told to do so....especially since he is still wet behind the ears himself.
    There doesn't seem to be much trust in this organization, and it appears to be clearer that the collapse of the 2011 season, was much more than just "bad play"
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from fourrings. Show fourrings's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    srsly!! why doesnt Lucchino be the GM since he makes all the decisions anyway
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Teakus. Show Teakus's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    The true power on this team is the duo of Henry+Werner. Lucchino is the guy with actual baseball knowledge and experience, and so he naturally rises to the forefront when a leadership vacuum is apparant. It should also be understood that ultimately ALL GM's are puppets to their ownership bosses. Theo was no different, though he was given alot of wiggle room due to the deep relationship he had with Henry. I do think the Red Sox are floundering at the moment, but it's because of differences between the owners. Once they get it together Cherington will be free to make moves. Let's hope they hurry over their grief and get back to being professionals soon!
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era. : Easy there, cyber muscles.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    LOL "cyber muscles". Hope you don't mind if I use that.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    Hindsight 20/20 bred. Ben is not to be pitied--he knew what he was getting into. If there is a next time--in front of all parties--"is there anyone else you would like to invite to the party?" Ben will be fine and management will be fine. Valentine will be inaugurated maybe as early as Tuesday. V has probably already begun making a list of coaches and lineups-possible trade options to discuss with Ben and LL in addition to FA he would find helpful. He will be a good choice for a veteran team in a big market--let's just take a deep breath and relax.
    Posted by MadMc44


    mad, you missed my point. its not hindisght. i wrote it here on the board before these events.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington e...

    In Response to Re: Good to see that the newly minted GM has zero influence in the hiring of a new manager... great start to the Cherington era.:
    Cherington quits, ends up in Chitown with old buddies, Lucchino takes the reins as GM...it could happen, just about anything seems possible at this point.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut



    i posted that is what they should do. as lucky is both (pres and gm), but having ben is serving some purposes for them.
     
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