Re: Have people forgotten what helped the Sox win?
posted at 12/16/2011 8:47 PM EST
In Response to Re: Have people forgotten what helped the Sox win?
[QUOTE]Nice post, but I would like to mention a few things: 1) We had previously signed Manny to the 2nd biggest contract of alltime. I'm not sure we win any rings without him (even at $20M/yr). 2) Do we win without Damon, another high priced FA signing by Dan D.? 3) We previously had traded two great young arms for Pedro (Pavano and Tony Armas Jr.) 4) Theo traded some top prospects for Schilling (Fossum, Lyon, and de la Rosa. 5) Theo signed Keith Foulke to close to a record contract for a closer at that time. 6) We also traded some other prospects for some pieces to the 2004 puzzle: Phil Dumatrait & Tyler Pelland for Scott Williamson David Pauley, Jay Payton, & Ramon vazquez for Dave Roberts 7) We also added these pieces to the 2007 puzzle as FA signings or trading away good prospects for key players: Signed Julio Lugo for way too much money Signed JD Drew to $14M/yr x 5 Traded HanRam, Anibal Sanchez and 2 other kids for Beckett & Lowell Traded Andy Marte, G. Moto, and Shoppach for Coco Crisp & David Riske Outlandishly outbid the world for Dice-K The history of our rings is dependent on our costly FA signings (they just happened to work out better back then) and several prospects traded for key components of each winning season.
Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]
Fair points, however:
Trading for Pedro was a good move. He was an elite pitcher coming into his prime, you pay to get those guys. Pedro = Felix on today's market, what they got for Pedro is about half of what it would take to get Felix now. All told, excellent trade. I'm not against ever making trtades, but you must pick and choose, and going after an undeniably elite player is a risk, and cost worth taking/paying.
Manny got a record deal at the time, agreed. But, again, we're talking about an established, elite player coming into his prime. Not Crawford at 30, or Ortiz at 36, or an oft-injured Drew that everyone thought was overpaid. All told, that contract, however ridiculous for us "real" people was actually fairly good value. They paid what the market set, they didn't SET the market (ala Drew) or meet an EXTREMELY inflated one (ala Crawford).
Schilling - Again, a proven commodity. Older when they got him, but they got him for 2 reason: to beat the Yankees, and to win in the playoffs. He excelled in both categories. I think they identified a true need, and went and filled it with the best piece they could fill it with.
I'm not against trading OR free agent signing, I just feel like the Sox have been spinning out of control for a few years, and really need to reign it back in and make intelligent choices, not "I have the most money" choices. Not "I better react to all this negative fan attention" choices. And DEFINITELY NOT "I've loved this player for YEARS!" choices.
I agree about the history of the last 2 rings...but it's left me asking he question "was it worth it". I am not of the Al Davis "just WIN BABY!" mindset. It should mean something more than you paid the most money, or went out and aqcuired the most valuable players.
To steal from "Moneyball", After getting a record offer to come to the Sox, he (Beane) turned it down and talked about how winning is one thing...but doing it in Oakland, with a small payroll, and beating the 9 figure beasts in the East would mean something FAR more, and would change the game of baseball. That's taking it to an extreme, but I was fine in the early 2000s when the Yanks were getting up towards 200mil, and the Sox were around 120, and around the 6th highest payroll in baseball. It made winning more meaningful and exciting. Now? Winning is an expectation, some fans take it as their "right" that this team WILL win. That's not fun. At least for me it's not. The rabid fandom of this team was built on tradition, now it's being built on money. If winning means needing the second, or highest payroll in baseball, then I don't care about winning.
"It's not whether you win or lose, it's how you play the game."