Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from YankeesLover. Show YankeesLover's posts

    Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Red Sox Nation…..no team in baseball doesn’t have issues from time to time…..yours right now is in the spotlight but the spotlight “always” changes.

    The Red Sox have a tradition for fighting until their last breath to win….this year’s team just didn’t have the right players and certainly not the right lung power.

    Sure, it’s hard for anyone to observe their favorite players either diminish in skills to where they can’t perform up to expectations or even worse, get traded to another team, let alone another division rival ….let alone the dreaded Yankees.

    Today baseball is purely business and the days of owners like George Steinbrenner are over……regardless of whether you disliked him or not….he was purely about winning and winning it for the fans…didn’t give a tinkers dam about profits of the team because he knew that in winning everything gets taken care of….I’m not here to sing George’s praises….just to point out that owners like him that do everything for the fans died with his passing. His two sons, Hank & Hal, are bean counters when it comes to payroll and would cut a players throat if they thought it would pay off…..not the same Yankees organization with George being gone and will never be again either.

    John Henry is worse…he doesn’t reinvest in the team the way he should have been doing for the past several years…another owner looking for bottom-line contributions. Francona is one of baseball’s best managers…so he hit a couple of speed bumps….so what….his personal life is his own business anyway.

    Epstein…well….I won’t say anything about him because I think he was John Henry’s pawn…..maybe it’s like that on every team but this year Brian Cashman did openly expressed disagreement with Yankees management on player signings….good for him for reaching out to the press to make his position known.

    Anyway, back to the Sox…..now is the opportunity to concentrate on what the team can achieve with getting the right acquisitions…..don’t fool yourself…the Sox team needs to be whacked up and reassembled and a lot of new faces are needed……and the Yankees are only a year away from being where the Sox are right now…new faces needed there but just not as many….another bat and some starting pitching is all the Yankees have to change….and the Yankees had as many players lost this year to injury as any team in baseball….shi_ happens.

    Take comfort in the fact that in 2004 the Sox did the unthinkable…never been done before….so how hard is it after that feat to imagine the team coming back next year as a juggernaut and winning it all….just make the right moves in the off season and the Yankees & Sox will battle for the ALCS for years to come. By: Yankees Lover
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Good post. It'll probably sink like a stone on this forum though. It's not nearly negative enough.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    all this stuff needs to be aired out...once it is over we can start to rebuild and move forward....do you really expect anyone to be positive at this point so soon after the collapse?  my guess is once we get a manager and gm, we will start to get excited about the spring...I cant wait myself - even though i was proven right about our manager, it still is too ugly to dwell on....im just waitin' for that new regime!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Here is a team that even if the stories are true and I openly don't believe half of what is being said this team missed the playoffs by one game. Have been DAMN good for the past 10 years. Still have the nucleus of a very good team. I have said the past ten years may never happen again and I still believe it. However they are not as bad as some have made them out to be.

    NEVER trust a story that depends on unnamed sources over a story where a player stands up and speaks his mind.
    I find it funny that some here say Pedroia is saying what he has to say and not believing him.
    However believe every word from a column with unnamed sources.
    So I trust what Pedroia has said over the past three days of stories based upon unnamed sources by the likes of Dan Shaugnesy and others..
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from GhostofTito. Show GhostofTito's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Great. Let's all be "See No Evil", "Speak No Evil", and pretend none of this ever happened.
    Great philosophy for sheep, not baseball fans.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    One question: Why was the forum 90% negative from May through when the team had the best record in MLB? It seemed like the slogan was "To Speak evil because it is more fun that way". You see many here are never happy unless they are miserable.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Utica,

       You hit that one on the head. 

       They were miserable enough to claim that those of us who give Tito some credit for the WS Crown I & II are not able to see what really has happened, that we are blinded by the crowns ...

        Eh?

        I forgot, we had so many just laying around, I didn't notice the two new ones ....
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    With Ryan and Shaughnessy and the Boston press leading the way in painting gloom and doom, the forum has become unnecessary and redundant. Time to become immersed in football, basketball, and hockey. No need to buy a Globe newspaper to get a daily dose of negativism, who needs that?
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from sindarin-erebor. Show sindarin-erebor's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Nope, no positves coming from me until we hang an ALE flag. I am back to be the cynical, waiting for doom, long suffering Red Sox fan. The past two seasons, coming in third, with the high payroll, then making all of us walk around with the "Worst meltdown in the history of baseball" moniker for what another 50 years is unforgiveable.

    I hope the inquisition continues with Lackey, Beckett, Youk, Papi, Ortiz, Wakefield, Drew all simply being cut, traded, non-tendered, whatever. I look forward to and will heartily support a losing Red Sox team full of young players starving to win, willing to do anything for thier teammates, play hard and improve.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    Nope, no positves coming from me until we hang an ALE flag. I am back to be the cynical, waiting for doom, long suffering Red Sox fan. The past two seasons, coming in third, with the high payroll, then making all of us walk around with the "Worst meltdown in the history of baseball" moniker for what another 50 years is unforgiveable. I hope the inquisition continues with Lackey, Beckett, Youk, Papi, Ortiz, Wakefield, Drew all simply being cut, traded, non-tendered, whatever. I look forward to and will heartily support a losing Red Sox team full of young players starving to win, willing to do anything for thier teammates, play hard and improve.
    Posted by sindarin-erebor
    Morning SE, man, cut the boys some slack, i'm sure it'll be sooner than 50 years...Wink..seriously, i get your frustration, i doubt it'll take long... 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jaytf25. Show jaytf25's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    Utica,    You hit that one on the head.     They were miserable enough to claim that those of us who give Tito some credit for the WS Crown I & II are not able to see what really has happened, that we are blinded by the crowns ...     Eh?     I forgot, we had so many just laying around, I didn't notice the two new ones ....
    Posted by SinceYaz


    Yaz I was going to start a post on that. You're so right. I'm 54 so in my lifetime following the Red Sox it's Pesky-3 years? Herman-2, Dick Williams-3, Eddie Kasko-4, Darrell Johnson 2 1/2, Zimmer-almost 5,Houk-4, Macnamara-3 1/2, Joe Morgan-3 1/2, Hobson-2, Kevn Kennedy-2, Jimy Williams-almost -5, Grady-2 and.....................FANCONA-8. What does that tell you? Yes 2 WS victories help but I believe even if we didn't win those WS he still would have stayed. They had faith in this man and I'm sickened to see them throw mud at him. Aren't we innocent till proven guilty in the USA?     Ralph Houk resigned so thay would have kept him but still I don't think he would have lasted 8 years with management.                                 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Heck yeah georom4. I am positive and excited to see what the winter brings. Can't wait to see who is in and who is out.
     
    Look, am I excited the Sox did not make the playoffs, no. But I am excited about change. And if they had made the post season, then much of this would have remained quiet and kept on brewing. I think this is a huge wake-up call for the Sox and its owners.

    The Sox were headed down Yankee way, not Yawkey Way when it came to building these recents teams. Spending money like the Yankees does not guarantee victory. Although it works(ed) well for the Yanks, it doesn't suit the Sox.

    So, I am excited to see who gets the manager's job. Who becomes the new GM. And what selfish players get shipped out. And what ones change their tunes.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    Red Sox Nation…..no team in baseball doesn’t have issues from time to time…..yours right now is in the spotlight but the spotlight “always” changes. The Red Sox have a tradition for fighting until their last breath to win….this year’s team just didn’t have the right players and certainly not the right lung power. Sure, it’s hard for anyone to observe their favorite players either diminish in skills to where they can’t perform up to expectations or even worse, get traded to another team, let alone another division rival ….let alone the dreaded Yankees. Today baseball is purely business and the days of owners like George Steinbrenner are over…… regardless of whether you disliked him or not….he was purely about winning and winning it for the fans…didn’t give a tinkers dam about profits of the team because he knew that in winning everything gets taken care of….I’m not here to sing George’s praises….just to point out that owners like him that do everything for the fans died with his passing. His two sons, Hank & Hal, are bean counters when it comes to payroll and would cut a players throat if they thought it would pay off….. not the same Yankees organization with George being gone and will never be again either. John Henry is worse…he doesn’t reinvest in the team the way he should have been doing for the past several years…another owner looking for bottom-line contributions. Francona is one of baseball’s best managers …so he hit a couple of speed bumps….so what….his personal life is his own business anyway. Epstein…well….I won’t say anything about him because I think he was John Henry’s pawn…..maybe it’s like that on every team but this year Brian Cashman did openly expressed disagreement with Yankees management on player signings….good for him for reaching out to the press to make his position known. Anyway, back to the Sox….. now is the opportunity to concentrate on what the team can achieve with getting the right acquisitions …..don’t fool yourself…the Sox team needs to be whacked up and reassembled and a lot of new faces are needed……and the Yankees are only a year away from being where the Sox are right now…new faces needed there but just not as many….another bat and some starting pitching is all the Yankees have to change….and the Yankees had as many players lost this year to injury as any team in baseball….shi_ happens. Take comfort in the fact that in 2004 the Sox did the unthinkable…never been done before….so how hard is it after that feat to imagine the team coming back next year as a juggernaut and winning it all…. just make the right moves in the off season and the Yankees & Sox will battle for the ALCS for years to come. By: Yankees Lover
    Posted by YankeesLover


    Good points at the beginning and at the end, but the middle left a lot to be desired.


    Today baseball is purely business and the days of owners like George Steinbrenner are over……regardless of whether you disliked him or not….he was purely about winning and winning it for the fans…didn’t give a tinkers dam about profits of the team because he knew that in winning everything gets taken care of….I’m not here to sing George’s praises….just to point out that owners like him that do everything for the fans died with his passing. His two sons, Hank & Hal, are bean counters when it comes to payroll and would cut a players throat if they thought it would pay off…..not the same Yankees organization with George being gone and will never be again either.

    Are you serious? Baseball has been purely a business since at least the start of free agency. Don't kid yourself. Yes, Steinbrenner was about winning, but if you think he didn't give damn about profits, then I want what you're smoking. Why did he knock down Yankees Stadium for a new stadium? Why did he create the YES Network. It was all to generate more revenue and more profits. Steinbrenner was no dumb businessman. Yes, he had a high payroll , but it was because he could afford it. I'll never doubt his commitment to winning, but Steinbrenner wasn't going to lose money. Because of all the revenue the Yankees generated -- because of the market and because Steinbrenner was smart enough to maximize those advantages -- he never had to make the choice between profits and winning. He could and did have them both.

    John Henry is worse…he doesn’t reinvest in the team the way he should have been doing for the past several years…another owner looking for bottom-line contributions. 

    I don't suppose you mind backing up this ridiculous statement. It's because you can't. Henry has spent the last 10 years sprucing up Fenway and building up revenue streams just like Steinbrenner did. Henry certainly has put money back into the organization in terms of scouting and many other behind-the-scenes areas that are important to a baseball team. And he has consistently had one of the top three payrolls in baseball. So I don't know you can say he's just looking at the bottom line. Crawford might have been a dumb deal, but you don't write that kind of a contract if you're not trying to win. Of course he wants profit -- just like Steinbrenner.

    In fact, Henry has followed Steinbrenner's examples, both good and bad. He took over a franchise whose previous owners let many areas languish, especially from a business standpoint but also in some baseball areas.

    They came in with a professional attitude, merging strong business sense with taking advantage of their brand and markets to increase revenue. They built teams that won W.S. They put money back into baseball operations in terms scouting and training. Henry was blasted by making Fenway too comfortable for the players with the upgrades. Are you kidding me? Have  you seen the Yankees' locker room in the new Yankee Stadium. It makes Fenway's locker rooms look like a third-world slum. As for the bad, they both spent stupidly on free agents.

    Henry deserves criticism for the way he has handled the past two weeks, but convicted-felon Steinbrenner was hardly an angel. If it was Henry who was the source of the Francona news, how is that different from Steinbrenner and what he tried to do with Winfield's reputation, let alone how he treated his managers and GMs over the years.

    Except for not like the spotlight like Steinbrenner did, Henry is might be more like Steinbrenner than I originally thought.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    all this stuff needs to be aired out...once it is over we can start to rebuild and move forward....do you really expect anyone to be positive at this point so soon after the collapse?  my guess is once we get a manager and gm, we will start to get excited about the spring...I cant wait myself - even though i was proven right about our manager, it still is too ugly to dwell on....im just waitin' for that new regime!
    Posted by georom4


    I'll only start to get excited if the following players are no longer on the roster:

    John Lackey
    Tim Wakefield
    Jason Varitek
    David Ortiz
    JD Drew (a given)
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from hambonawilliams. Show hambonawilliams's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Call this thread "RISE OF THE PINK HATTERS"
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans : I'll only start to get excited if the following players are no longer on the roster: John Lackey Tim Wakefield Jason Varitek David Ortiz JD Drew (a given)
    Posted by ADG


    I think you will get you wish on all but one...Mr. Lackey will be back.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans : I'll only start to get excited if the following players are no longer on the roster: John Lackey Tim Wakefield Jason Varitek David Ortiz JD Drew (a given)
    Posted by ADG


    those can should be shown the door but i would just settle for all but drew coming back in shape and ready to play like men
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    George, as you are grading the homework assignments for Driver Ed., why not listen to John Henry vs. Felger.
    No contest - Henry in a landslide.

    http://www.boston.com/sports/blogs/thebuzz/2011/10/audio_john_henr.html
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    We will always be thankful for 2004 and 2007 , and the roles in that success that Tito and Theo had. That does not change the fact that things got out of control this year , and the September collapse cannot be excused or just taken lightly. As fans , we have the right to complain when things go sour. And , we have the right to know exactly what happened with this club. Sorry , but just saying that they did not play well in September , and that is why they lost is not good enough. Was the collapse due to poor conditioning , bad attitudes or just not caring?  The truth needs to come out , and I think that what we have heard so far is just the start of it. There may be more revelations to come.  Being a loyal fan should not mean accepting the disaster that we witnessed this September without wanting to know why it happened and what will be done to correct the situation.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    We will always be thankful for 2004 and 2007 , and the roles in that success that Tito and Theo had. That does not change the fact that things got out of control this year , and the September collapse cannot be excused or just taken lightly. As fans , we have the right to complain when things go sour. And , we have the right to know exactly what happened with this club. Sorry , but just saying that they did not play well in September , and that is why they lost is not good enough. Was the collapse due to poor conditioning , bad attitudes or just not caring?  The truth needs to come out , and I think that what we have heard so far is just the start of it. There may be more revelations to come.  Being a loyal fan should not mean accepting the disaster that we witnessed this September without wanting to know why it happened and what will be done to correct the situation.
    Posted by dgalehouse



    This might help you instead of listening to WEEI and unfounded BS opinions. This is a 90 minute that WEEI blowhard Felger had with John Henry today. John Henry clobbered Felger. ENJOY it.

    http://www.boston.com/sports/blogs/thebuzz/2011/10/audio_john_henr.html
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from OZGOD. Show OZGOD's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    To the OP: 

    Unfortunately we prefer to be wrist-slitters. It's in our DNA. The world is always ending. The sun will not come up tomorrow.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans:
    In Response to Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans : Yaz I was going to start a post on that. You're so right. I'm 54 so in my lifetime following the Red Sox it's Pesky-3 years? Herman-2, Dick Williams-3, Eddie Kasko-4, Darrell Johnson 2 1/2, Zimmer-almost 5,Houk-4, Macnamara-3 1/2, Joe Morgan-3 1/2, Hobson-2, Kevn Kennedy-2, Jimy Williams-almost -5, Grady-2 and.....................FANCONA-8. What does that tell you? Yes 2 WS victories help but I believe even if we didn't win those WS he still would have stayed. They had faith in this man and I'm sickened to see them throw mud at him. Aren't we innocent till proven guilty in the USA?     Ralph Houk resigned so thay would have kept him but still I don't think he would have lasted 8 years with management.                                 
    Posted by jaytf25


    Thanks for the response, Jay.

       I know this is a tough time, most especially because it it VERY clear the team could have done better at the end and enough guys didn't care enough to make a difference.  That really is bad, but throw in the way they treated Tito and it becomes embarrassing. 

       It leaves no solid footing for the future, as far as I'm concerned.  If this is the way they treat someone who brought the goods, how will they react in the future?

       All of a sudden, the rank old days of insecurity -starting from the top - are knocking at the door.


      
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheExaminer. Show TheExaminer's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    Everything is getting blown out of proportion right now. Problems? Yes, but it will all get ironed out. Some changes need to be made, they will get made and we will go on. I thought this OP was actually pretty level headed, esp coming from a NYN fan. Should that worry me? On second thought, this was a HORRIBLE OP, nevermind.....LOL
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: Hey…Knock It Off….Remain Loyal, Hopeful Fans

    When the new GM acquires Hanley ramirez everyone will be happy again.

     
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