How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from steven11. Show steven11's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:

    He's not talking extension...I was wrong.

    When this deal is over, he wants multiple years. Or, according to him, "Time to move on."

    I guess he means "move on...to retirement". No team will be giving a 39 year old multiple years. Not one of them.




    no they won't.  regardless of how next season goes, good or bad, the red sox will give Ortiz a QO. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    Ortiz talks a lot about getting respect..but he is not being respectful to the team or the front office when he chooses to conduct contract negotiations in the media..and when he makes passive aggressive remarks such as "I hope I'm not wearing a different uniform". Enough already.  I seem to remember reading over the summer that there was an agreement between the Red Sox and Ortiz that contract talks would not begin until the summer of 2014. If this is true then Ortiz is showing an incredibly amount of disrespect to the front office with his recent comments.

    Yes..he is a great DH..arguably one of the greatest. However he is also very well paid for what he does and the incentive based limited year contracts the Sox have offered him are more than fair. Ortiz has no qualms about referring to baseball as a business at the end of the day..and well..yes..it is a business. Sox fans love Ortiz..but there is no market for him beyond Fenway. None.



    2013 regular season:  .309/30/103, .959 OPS

    2013 post-season:  .688 avg., 1.188 slugging,  1.948 OPS

     

    What was that about there being no market beyond Fenway?




    I am not disputing the numbers and Ortiz' are great. No team is going to pay him what he wants for the role he wants. Most teams don't use a DH who also doesn't play more in the field. My opinion is that there is no market beyond Fenway for him. Ortiz knows it and his agent knows it..hence the media theatrics that occur frequently from our beloved Papi.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    Ortiz talks a lot about getting respect..but he is not being respectful to the team or the front office when he chooses to conduct contract negotiations in the media..and when he makes passive aggressive remarks such as "I hope I'm not wearing a different uniform". Enough already.  I seem to remember reading over the summer that there was an agreement between the Red Sox and Ortiz that contract talks would not begin until the summer of 2014. If this is true then Ortiz is showing an incredibly amount of disrespect to the front office with his recent comments.

    Yes..he is a great DH..arguably one of the greatest. However he is also very well paid for what he does and the incentive based limited year contracts the Sox have offered him are more than fair. Ortiz has no qualms about referring to baseball as a business at the end of the day..and well..yes..it is a business. Sox fans love Ortiz..but there is no market for him beyond Fenway. None.



    2013 regular season:  .309/30/103, .959 OPS

    2013 post-season:  .688 avg., 1.188 slugging,  1.948 OPS

     

    What was that about there being no market beyond Fenway?




    I am not disputing the numbers and Ortiz' are great. No team is going to pay him what he wants for the role he wants. Most teams don't use a DH who also doesn't play more in the field. My opinion is that there is no market beyond Fenway for him. Ortiz knows it and his agent knows it..hence the media theatrics that occur frequently from our beloved Papi.



    Thats what I have been saying.  And thats all it is.  Theatrics.  There is no real threat of any kind of obstruction or disruption or anything remotely akin to not honoring his contract.  Just bad theater.  

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:

     

    He's not talking extension...I was wrong.

    When this deal is over, he wants multiple years. Or, according to him, "Time to move on."

    I guess he means "move on...to retirement". No team will be giving a 39 year old multiple years. Not one of them.

     




     

    No offense, but what are you talking about? Do you have a source for this?

    It appears that's the opposite of what Ortiz is asking for...

    http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/2014/01/29/david-ortiz-says-he-wants-one-year-extension-optimistic-about-talks-with-red-sox/

    He's not asking for multiple years after 2014. He wants a one-year extension tacked on to the deal he already has. (Which should be a no-brainer, in my opinion.)

    The whole thing is worth reading, but especially this:

    'While Ortiz recently suggested that he would look for employment elsewhere in response to a question about what he’d do if the Sox didn’t offer him a “long-term deal,” Ortiz said that he was responding to a hypothetical in which the team showed no interest in retaining him.

    “I heard a comment the other day that came through the news about me saying that I’m going to go somewhere else. People sometimes take the wrong message. I was asked if the Red Sox don’t want to offer me an extension, then what am I going to do? I’m not going to retire. I’ll go somewhere else,” said Ortiz. “Whoever offers me a contract, that’s where I’m going to be. It’s not a secret from no one that I want to be part of this organization. This is where I want to play. But it’s a business. You’re not supposed to be mad at no one. You just do what you got to do, you take what they give you and in the worst case, they don’t offer you a contract and you go somewhere else." '

    Wow. So after three different threads and a near witch-hunt on BDC, it seems Ortiz was not even trying to say what most of us thought he was.

    I don't know if he misunderstood the question he was asked, or if something got lost in translation (some other poster mentioned the inherent difficulty in discussing all of this in a second language)...but what I read here is that Ortiz was merely saying if, for some reason, the Red Sox did not offer him a contract beyond this season, then he would (obviously) go play somewhere else rather than retire.

    That's what people have been so worked up about.

    Hopefully we can put this nonsense to rest now. As I said, spring training can't get here soon enough.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    Ortiz is now changing the question, and his answer.

    He specifically mentioned MULTIPLE YEAR CONTRACT, then was specifically asked, and if the Sox don't offer one, he responded "Time to move on". Those last 4 words are an exact quote. The earlier references are how it went. I again heard the questioning, in it's entirety, on the radio.

    The question was if the Sox don't want to offer him a multiple year contract:

    "“As long as they keep offering me a job and I keep doing what I’m supposed to do and the relationship keeps on building up, I’m going to be there. Hopefully, I won’t have to go and wear another uniform,” he said, hoping for another multi-year extension from Boston.

    Toucher & Rich: Ortiz Asking For Contract Extension… Again

    But if the Red Sox do not offer him a multi-year deal, or it’s not up to Ortiz’s standards, the slugger said it would be “time to move on.”

    “If I have to, I’ve got no choice,” he said. “I’m not going to quit. As long as I keep hitting the ball the way I have, I’ve got to keep on giving it a try."

    More than one reference to it being multiple years BEYOND what he's currently signed for. He can try to backtrack all he wants, but the history doesn't lie.

    Source:

    http://boston.cbslocal.com/2014/01/27/red-sox-ortiz-on-sports-final-hopefully-i-wont-have-to-wear-another-uniform/

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    The best line on this, a tweet that was quoted on the Globe website:

    'The Twins cut him to avoid these types of problems.'

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    The best line on this, a tweet that was quoted on the Globe website:

    'The Twins cut him to avoid these types of problems.'




    Haa haa.... how many World Series titles have the Twins won without him....haahaaa.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    It's funny how reporters write articles complaining about Ortiz complaining, but they continually write the articles. They're the ones the can't let it go.... if they never put the question out there, then Ortiz would have no reason to answer it. If you think, Ortiz should just give a "no comment" when pressed....I'd rather him be honest.

    I hope he does retire a Red Sox player...too many of my past Sports heroes didn't. I hated the Sox for a long time after they traded Carlton Fisk...or when the Bruins traded Bobby Orr.

     

    This was lifted from the Globe:

    4. David Ortiz, DH, Red Sox — Ortiz has a great fan in agent Scott Boras, even though Boras doesn’t represent him. Boras feels Ortiz has been underpaid considering his production. Boras represents Kendrys Morales, who hasn’t been able to find a job. Morales is being promoted as a first baseman, but most teams see him as a DH. Boras notes that Ortiz continues to be Boston’s featured power hitter as a DH. His message is Morales can also be a valuable hitter as a DH in a top lineup.

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to JIMMYPROFFER's comment:

     


    Right.  That is why his desparation-fueled soundbite is a non-starter.  It affects nothing.  The Sox FO will not do anything.  He is not forcing anyones hand.  The only way to extend his career is to put up another amazing year and be the team leader.  His words are just out of petulant frustration that he is arguagbly hitting better than he ever has and he is too old to get anykind of security beyond a really rich year to year see-how-it-goes deal.

     




    One would hope that the $112M he has already made has helped him feel "secure".




    Works out to a little over 10mil/yr.

    Seems like the Sox got more than their money's worth.

    If he ends up not producing in the last year of a contract, the Sox still come out ahead.

 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to 2013soxchamps' comment:

    It's funny how reporters write articles complaining about Ortiz complaining, but they continually write the articles. They're the ones the can't let it go.... if they never put the question out there, then Ortiz would have no reason to answer it. If you think, Ortiz should just give a "no comment" when pressed....I'd rather him be honest.

    I hope he does retire a Red Sox player...too many of my past Sports heroes didn't. I hated the Sox for a long time after they traded Carlton Fisk...or when the Bruins traded Bobby Orr.

     


    Let's keep our history accurate. Neither Fisk nor Orr were traded.

    Fisk became a free agent when Haywood Sullivan mailed him a contract too late. And Orr was a free agent and Eagleson lied to him about the Bruins offer.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    til' Bill apologizes? Tongue Out

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    Who would be willing to offer Ortiz a Q.O. next year if he puts up a simliar stat line to what he's produced over the last several years? I would.

    that should be about 15 million.  I'm not sure who would waste a 1st round draft pick on a 39 year old DH, but if he puts up another season like last who knows.

    I would want something in return to offer another year.  So if he would be willing to restructure the remaining contract and convert it into a 2 year/27 million contract I'd bite.  

    In the end we are paying another 12 million for him for an additional year.  If he doesn't want to go there....then I'd let him play out 2014 and offer the Q.O.  If he is dumb enough to decline the Q.O. then I think there is still a good chance we could even get him back for a rate under 15/M per year.   I think ultimately he would accept a Q.O. He says he just wants one more year, and that would equate to one more year at a rate he is making now.

    Really all he is getting by doing this is a guaranteed year in 2015, The only way the Sox wouldn't want him around in 2015 is if he fell off a cliff in 2014.  So he wants some security, and we would like some salary relief....maybe there is some middle ground here. 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:

     

    Ortiz is now changing the question, and his answer.

    He specifically mentioned MULTIPLE YEAR CONTRACT, then was specifically asked, and if the Sox don't offer one, he responded "Time to move on". Those last 4 words are an exact quote. The earlier references are how it went. I again heard the questioning, in it's entirety, on the radio.

    The question was if the Sox don't want to offer him a multiple year contract:

    "“As long as they keep offering me a job and I keep doing what I’m supposed to do and the relationship keeps on building up, I’m going to be there. Hopefully, I won’t have to go and wear another uniform,” he said, hoping for another multi-year extension from Boston.

    Toucher & Rich: Ortiz Asking For Contract Extension… Again

    But if the Red Sox do not offer him a multi-year deal, or it’s not up to Ortiz’s standards, the slugger said it would be “time to move on.”

    “If I have to, I’ve got no choice,” he said. “I’m not going to quit. As long as I keep hitting the ball the way I have, I’ve got to keep on giving it a try."

    More than one reference to it being multiple years BEYOND what he's currently signed for. He can try to backtrack all he wants, but the history doesn't lie.

    Source:

    http://boston.cbslocal.com/2014/01/27/red-sox-ortiz-on-sports-final-hopefully-i-wont-have-to-wear-another-uniform/

     




     

     

    So you think he is now lying about his intentions and about what he is asking the Red Sox for? You are awfully quick to assume and believe the worst about him.

    Nowhere, to my knowledge, has he said he wants a new contract of multiple years after 2014. I am aware that the question that he was asked made reference to "multi-year extension," or something along those lines, but I find it more plausible that he misunderstood or misspoke (or that those reporting on his response misinterpreted it) than that he is spinning some web of deceit regarding his contract wishes.

    All he has said in the past indicates that he would simply like to avoid playing this year with free agency looming over him; he would like the security of knowing his next year is guaranteed. When he received the two-year deal as a free agent after 2012 he seemed happy with that. I don't see why, a year later, he would suddenly be looking for a guarantee through 2016 (three seasons in the future) or beyond. Surely he understands at his age that is not going to happen, not from the Red Sox and not from anyone else. (His comment that he does not know how long he will play - it could be two more years or three or ten - supports this as well.)

    I think you can bank on a one-year extension happening in the next couple of months. That is the best thing for the franchise and for Papi.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from 2013soxchamps. Show 2013soxchamps's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to 2013soxchamps' comment:

    It's funny how reporters write articles complaining about Ortiz complaining, but they continually write the articles. They're the ones the can't let it go.... if they never put the question out there, then Ortiz would have no reason to answer it. If you think, Ortiz should just give a "no comment" when pressed....I'd rather him be honest.

    I hope he does retire a Red Sox player...too many of my past Sports heroes didn't. I hated the Sox for a long time after they traded Carlton Fisk...or when the Bruins traded Bobby Orr.

     


    Let's keep our history accurate. Neither Fisk nor Orr were traded.

    Fisk became a free agent when Haywood Sullivan mailed him a contract too late. And Orr was a free agent and Eagleson lied to him about the Bruins offer.



    My bad....

    Either way, both Fisk and Orr got away.

     
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  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    Looking at it another way .....  Good MILK SHAKES can make the length of contract, MUTE  !!!!



    More proof that Bill likes being abused - very kinky, man.  

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bosoxmal. Show bosoxmal's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:

    How many years in a row now? 4? 5? 6? Year after year after year it's the same thing:

    "I want more years"

    "I want more money"

    "I deserve more respect"

    Time and time again I've listed the COUNTLESS public, SELFISH outbursts this guy has had.

    Yes, he has been  incredible for this team, on the field. He should have left it at that. Had he NEVER opened his mouth, he would have gotten pretty much the same money right along. He went to FA once...nobody wanted him! What was it? 2011? Yet he has to continually open his big, selfish mouth.

    For me, this will forever keep him from being the greatest Red Sox player of all time. Had he been a mute, I'd have liked him far more. Yes, take awayALL the positive things he's said as well. I don't think they add up to all the nonsense.

    "This is bs...I want to talk about my rbi" - after breaking into Francona's conference

    "Aceves should be starting, I don't know what the problem is" - 2011 I think

    "Maybe I'll go to NYY if this is how it's going to be" - also 2011 I believe

    I'm working off of memory, but all things he's said, in addition to the contract stuff for half a decade, IN ADDITION to more.

    Unreal. Coming off a World Series Championship. With everything that has happened in Bostin within the Past year, and a VERY important Patriots Day coming up...and he's talking contract.

    The most disappointing thing is it shouldn't even be a surprise. It's what he's always done.

    I take that back...the MOST disappointing thing is how much the fans enable, encourage, and seemingly SUPPORT this behavior. 

    The Red Sox were around for 100 years before Ortiz. They will be around for more than 100 after.

    It's not all about him.




    Cool it! Haven't you guys figured it out yet? Papi's playing with the us; you, me, and especially the MEDIA. He knows where he's going to be the day he keels over tryoing to steal 3rd!

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to JIMMYPROFFER's comment:

    Works out to a little over 10mil/yr.

    Seems like the Sox got more than their money's worth.

    If he ends up not producing in the last year of a contract, the Sox still come out ahead.



    Not debating whether he was underpaid or not.

    Just saying, after this season he will have made over $125M not counting endorsements.

    That should make anyone feel "secure"




    To me, his insecurity (if you want to call it that) seems more tied to contract years than to dollars. He would like to know he'll still have a job in Boston a year from now. I can understand that...not sure why some people seem to want to crucify him for it.

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  • You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    Who would be willing to offer Ortiz a Q.O. next year if he puts up a simliar stat line to what he's produced over the last several years? I would.

    that should be about 15 million.  I'm not sure who would waste a 1st round draft pick on a 39 year old DH, but if he puts up another season like last who knows.

    I would want something in return to offer another year.  So if he would be willing to restructure the remaining contract and convert it into a 2 year/27 million contract I'd bite.  

    In the end we are paying another 12 million for him for an additional year.  If he doesn't want to go there....then I'd let him play out 2014 and offer the Q.O.  If he is dumb enough to decline the Q.O. then I think there is still a good chance we could even get him back for a rate under 15/M per year.   I think ultimately he would accept a Q.O. He says he just wants one more year, and that would equate to one more year at a rate he is making now.

    Really all he is getting by doing this is a guaranteed year in 2015, The only way the Sox wouldn't want him around in 2015 is if he fell off a cliff in 2014.  So he wants some security, and we would like some salary relief....maybe there is some middle ground here. 


    Plus its only 5 days after World Series, not like he'll be in limbo all off season.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: How many times does Ortiz have to do this...

    A few teams would pay Papi $16M to play for them, but they do not want to lose a draft pick for a 1-2 year investment.

    The QO system is what has kept Papi from going elsewhere, and Sox management know this. I have no beefs with recent Sox management.

    I do with some posters here.

     
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