I say no!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from wonderdrums. Show wonderdrums's posts

    I say no!

    The WBC is upon us once again and although I'm happy to see some exciting baseball, I'm not thrilled at seeing any Sox or prospects get dinged up before the season starts. It's in this light that I think the Sox brass needs to say no to the allowing players to participate. Bogaerts, Aceves, and Victorino are going to play so far. I don't think I'm alone in not wanting to see any of these guys get hurt. All three figure to have important roles this season or in the very near future, not to mention the free agent money spent on Victoriano. Should the Redsox let them play? I say no.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: I say no!

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.




    That's a sweeping overstatement. Just because some of us don't like it for baseball, it doesn't mean we don't like for other sports.

    Baseball -- using the pros -- really doesn't lend itself to internation competition like other sports because of the pitching.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.


    That's a sweeping overstatement. Just because some of us don't like it for baseball, it doesn't mean we don't like for other sports.

    Baseball -- using the pros -- really doesn't lend itself to internation competition like other sports because of the pitching.



    Perhaps a bit of an overstatement, but it seems to me that the various World Cups and equivalents are far less important - on average - to Americans than they are to virtually the rest of the world. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bald-predictions. Show bald-predictions's posts

    Re: I say no!

    For the hitters, it can actually help, barring injury. It allows them to get their timing back early and avoid the early season slumps.

    For pitchers, it just puts more strain on their arms, which increases the likelihood of injury. That is why it is great for someone like Dickey...that guy could throw 4,000 innings a year and still be fine (gotta love the knuckle ball!)
     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    In response to royf19's comment:

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.


    That's a sweeping overstatement. Just because some of us don't like it for baseball, it doesn't mean we don't like for other sports.

    Baseball -- using the pros -- really doesn't lend itself to internation competition like other sports because of the pitching.

     



    Perhaps a bit of an overstatement, but it seems to me that the various World Cups and equivalents are far less important - on average - to Americans than they are to virtually the rest of the world. 

     




    Perhaps, but Americans shouldn't be knocked because of it. We have so many major sports that already grab our attention. And it's not like we ignore international events. The Olympics still grab our attention for example.

    Just because one country has different interests than others, it doesn't make one better or worse than the others.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rickerd2. Show rickerd2's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

     

    In response to royf19's comment:

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.


    That's a sweeping overstatement. Just because some of us don't like it for baseball, it doesn't mean we don't like for other sports.

    Baseball -- using the pros -- really doesn't lend itself to internation competition like other sports because of the pitching.

     



    Perhaps a bit of an overstatement, but it seems to me that the various World Cups and equivalents are far less important - on average - to Americans than they are to virtually the rest of the world. 

     

     




    Perhaps, but Americans shouldn't be knocked because of it. We have so many major sports that already grab our attention. And it's not like we ignore international events. The Olympics still grab our attention for example.

     

    Just because one country has different interests than others, it doesn't make one better or worse than the others.




     

    You nailed it.  America already has a devoted following to baseball, football, basketball, NASCAR, etc.  I could care less about WBC, as I focus on MLB.  I use football as I wait for baseball season to come around again.

    WBC is interesting, as you see other countries put teams together.  But it all seems like a novelty, and is just another tournament that happens every few years.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from wonderdrums. Show wonderdrums's posts

    Re: I say no!

    The question was, do you think the Sox should allow their players to participate in the WBC? I wasn't implying that I didn't enjoy the WBC. I wasnt trying to rant or whine. I was simply stating that I don't think the Sox should risk their investment and future players on a tournament that means nothing. Do you?

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In the end this tournament is here to stay and for very good reason...the game of baseball was elimanated from Olympic competition and thus there's no international event to showcase the game to future athletes world wide. Nor is there a platform to market the game world wide, sans this tournament. In the business of sport "branding is the key to growth". If we want the game to continue to grow and in particular attract the best athletes. It starts at the youth level and what this tournament does is get kids in Canada to put down thier hockey stick and gather in front of the TV and wave the Maple Leaf and root, root, root for their homeland team...the same dynamic exist in most of the countries that participate in the WBC. In Europe, Latin American and Asia, the game of choice is soccor...Pele inspired a generation of kids in America to kick a ball...Roberto Clemente inspired a generation of kids in Latin America to hit a ball...Sadahara OH inspired a generation of Asian kids to trade spikes and play baseball.

    Fact today there are more kids in the USA playing youth soccor than youth baseball.

    Baseball Fever Catch it! That's the goal...

    I am certain that behind the scenes many of those that have invested millions, have pause. All of the players, owners and managers understand the why's and if your fortunate enough ever to wear a jersey with the letters USA on the front of the jerseys. Risk of injury is the furthest thing from ones mind, but certainly for the owners and managers an uneasy time.

    While many of us see the WBC as an incovienance to our normal routine, in the spring, every two years. This tournanment success serves the best interest of the sport on a global scale. There are many players that get to participate in this tournanment that likely will never play in the big leagues...but for each of them they go back to thier respective homelands and help water the seeds of growth...Telling stories about thier experiences and the pride of representing thier country and how cool it was facing Pedro Martinez or pitching to Miguel Cabrera and Albert Puljos.

    Right now Ichiro Susuki is begining to ready himself to represent Japan...and there's a million kids in Japan and as many here in the USA that mimick his batting stance...that's what the WBC is about...

    Baseball Fever...Catch it!

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to royf19's comment:

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.


    That's a sweeping overstatement. Just because some of us don't like it for baseball, it doesn't mean we don't like for other sports.

    Baseball -- using the pros -- really doesn't lend itself to internation competition like other sports because of the pitching.

     



    Perhaps a bit of an overstatement, but it seems to me that the various World Cups and equivalents are far less important - on average - to Americans than they are to virtually the rest of the world. 

     


    Perhaps, but Americans shouldn't be knocked because of it. We have so many major sports that already grab our attention. And it's not like we ignore international events. The Olympics still grab our attention for example.

    Just because one country has different interests than others, it doesn't make one better or worse than the others.



    I didn't "knock" the US;  I wrote that collectively they don't get international sports.  I do think insularity is part of the reason, but also that traditionally the sports enjoyed by American people were not played much by others, and vice versa.  Things are improving;  how much better is basketball now that it's played to such a high standard elsewhere, for example?

    Other countries seem to love the WBC;  it's not a matter of better or worse, but it's a bit sad to me if 227 countries like something, and 1 doesn't.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to Beantowne's comment:

    In the end this tournament is here to stay and for very good reason...the game of baseball was elimanated from Olympic competition and thus there's no international event to showcase the game to future athletes world wide. Nor is there a platform to market the game world wide, sans this tournament. In the business of sport "branding is the key to growth". If we want the game to continue to grow and in particular attract the best athletes. It starts at the youth level and what this tournament does is get kids in Canada to put down thier hockey stick and gather in front of the TV and wave the Maple Leaf and root, root, root for their homeland team...the same dynamic exist in most of the countries that participate in the WBC. In Europe, Latin American and Asia, the game of choice is soccor...Pele inspired a generation of kids in America to kick a ball...Roberto Clemente inspired a generation of kids in Latin America to hit a ball...Sadahara OH inspired a generation of Asian kids to trade spikes and play baseball.

    Fact today there are more kids in the USA playing youth soccor than youth baseball.

    Baseball Fever Catch it! That's the goal...

    I am certain that behind the scenes many of those that have invested millions, have pause. All of the players, owners and managers understand the why's and if your fortunate enough ever to wear a jersey with the letters USA on the front of the jerseys. Risk of injury is the furthest thing from ones mind, but certainly for the owners and managers an uneasy time.

    While many of us see the WBC as an incovienance to our normal routine, in the spring, every two years. This tournanment success serves the best interest of the sport on a global scale. There are many players that get to participate in this tournanment that likely will never play in the big leagues...but for each of them they go back to thier respective homelands and help water the seeds of growth...Telling stories about thier experiences and the pride of representing thier country and how cool it was facing Pedro Martinez or pitching to Miguel Cabrera and Albert Puljos.

    Right now Ichiro Susuki is begining to ready himself to represent Japan...and there's a million kids in Japan and as many here in the USA that mimick his batting stance...that's what the WBC is about...

    Baseball Fever...Catch it!

     




    Great post.  I like the WBC because I highly value international competitions, but it's important for all the reasons you mentioned.  I'd rather the Sox win the MLB Championship than the US win the WBC and always will, and if you asked football (soccer) fans around the world most would say the same.  But it's still very important to them...and it's a very different game.  Most domestic teams in most sports are multicultural so there isn't much of difference in the way they play.  But international teams generally have an obvious national style that is wonderful to watch play vs other styles.

     
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    Re: I say no!

    Yeah we're so close to a championship level Red Sox team we certainly couldn't handle it if one of our players got hurt...would ruin our chances of going .500.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

    In response to royf19's comment:

     

     

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars's comment:

    International sports are fantastic.  Only the insular USA (collectively) doesn't get it.


    That's a sweeping overstatement. Just because some of us don't like it for baseball, it doesn't mean we don't like for other sports.

    Baseball -- using the pros -- really doesn't lend itself to internation competition like other sports because of the pitching.

     



    Perhaps a bit of an overstatement, but it seems to me that the various World Cups and equivalents are far less important - on average - to Americans than they are to virtually the rest of the world. 

     


    Perhaps, but Americans shouldn't be knocked because of it. We have so many major sports that already grab our attention. And it's not like we ignore international events. The Olympics still grab our attention for example.

    Just because one country has different interests than others, it doesn't make one better or worse than the others.

     



    I didn't "knock" the US;  I wrote that collectively they don't get international sports.  I do think insularity is part of the reason, but also that traditionally the sports enjoyed by American people were not played much by others, and vice versa.  Things are improving;  how much better is basketball now that it's played to such a high standard elsewhere, for example?

     

    Other countries seem to love the WBC;  it's not a matter of better or worse, but it's a bit sad to me if 227 countries like something, and 1 doesn't.



    Sonics, as a lover of international sports competition myself (I was in Paris during the '98 World Cup, hands down best sports fan experience of my life), I can only offer this:  I think the WBC is a really great event for all the reasons you and others suggest.  But, as a lover of MLB, I just can't deal with the timing of the tournament.  Guys burning out during the real season because of the WBC makes me unhappy.  What can I say.  I think more Americans could get into the WBC if not for the timing.  I understand that it is scheduled in about the only slot that makes any sense, but it just doesn't work.  The baseball season is so long.  Guys need a slow build-up starting in February, not a launch into heated competition at that point.

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to bald-predictions's comment:

    For the hitters, it can actually help, barring injury. It allows them to get their timing back early and avoid the early season slumps.

    For pitchers, it just puts more strain on their arms, which increases the likelihood of injury. That is why it is great for someone like Dickey...that guy could throw 4,000 innings a year and still be fine (gotta love the knuckle ball!)




    Actually, Wilhelm retired (admittedly, at 48) due to a sore arm. And it is perhaps the most difficult pitch to throw consistently; which is why so few throw it. Otherwise, you'd have millions of all ages (including women; speaking of, why didn't those arm whip based female softballers ever try?) who lack the arm strength try to make the big leagues with it.

    Perhaps they should select the best college/sandlot pitchers who are willing to make a name for themselves; doesn't the USA have enough talent in this global tournament? Even if they haven't won?

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: I say no!

    It's irrelavent.

    The front office is only interested in T.V. ratings....Tito says so...I've been saying it for years. If Victornino breaks his ankle, are you going to switch off the set or change the channel? If Aceves falls off the mound and twists his back, are you done with watching Red Sox games for the season?

    There is nobody among these players that is going to make or break the season....which is going to be another trip down disaster lane with our rotten pitching staff.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:


    Perhaps, but Americans shouldn't be knocked because of it. We have so many major sports that already grab our attention. And it's not like we ignore international events. The Olympics still grab our attention for example.

    Just because one country has different interests than others, it doesn't make one better or worse than the others.


    I didn't "knock" the US;  I wrote that collectively they don't get international sports.  I do think insularity is part of the reason, but also that traditionally the sports enjoyed by American people were not played much by others, and vice versa.  Things are improving;  how much better is basketball now that it's played to such a high standard elsewhere, for example?

     

    Other countries seem to love the WBC;  it's not a matter of better or worse, but it's a bit sad to me if 227 countries like something, and 1 doesn't.


    Sonics, as a lover of international sports competition myself (I was in Paris during the '98 World Cup, hands down best sports fan experience of my life), I can only offer this:  I think the WBC is a really great event for all the reasons you and others suggest.  But, as a lover of MLB, I just can't deal with the timing of the tournament.  Guys burning out during the real season because of the WBC makes me unhappy.  What can I say.  I think more Americans could get into the WBC if not for the timing.  I understand that it is scheduled in about the only slot that makes any sense, but it just doesn't work.  The baseball season is so long.  Guys need a slow build-up starting in February, not a launch into heated competition at that point.




    Space, I agree with you.  I desperately want the WBC to catch on but it does need an administrative overhaul....mid-season? Growing up in the US the international sporting events I remember most vividly are the '72 Canada Cup (and it wasn't even Americans playing!), the '80 Olympic Ice Hockey, the crushing blow of losing to the USSR in '72  Olympic basketball, etc.  All of them FAR exceeded my interest in domestic titles OTHER than those the Boston teams won.  Cleveland vs. Atlanta?  The game/games interest me but the result?  Meh.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to ZILLAGOD's comment:

    It's irrelavent.

    The front office is only interested in T.V. ratings....Tito says so...I've been saying it for years. If Victornino breaks his ankle, are you going to switch off the set or change the channel? If Aceves falls off the mound and twists his back, are you done with watching Red Sox games for the season?

    There is nobody among these players that is going to make or break the season....which is going to be another trip down disaster lane with our rotten pitching staff.



    I am not sure we can get enough Zoloft to have an affect on a monster your size, but I can at least rig up some kind of gravity bong for you with an olympic size pool and an industrial vat.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to SonicsMonksLyresVicars' comment:

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

     


    Perhaps, but Americans shouldn't be knocked because of it. We have so many major sports that already grab our attention. And it's not like we ignore international events. The Olympics still grab our attention for example.

    Just because one country has different interests than others, it doesn't make one better or worse than the others.


    I didn't "knock" the US;  I wrote that collectively they don't get international sports.  I do think insularity is part of the reason, but also that traditionally the sports enjoyed by American people were not played much by others, and vice versa.  Things are improving;  how much better is basketball now that it's played to such a high standard elsewhere, for example?

     

    Other countries seem to love the WBC;  it's not a matter of better or worse, but it's a bit sad to me if 227 countries like something, and 1 doesn't.


    Sonics, as a lover of international sports competition myself (I was in Paris during the '98 World Cup, hands down best sports fan experience of my life), I can only offer this:  I think the WBC is a really great event for all the reasons you and others suggest.  But, as a lover of MLB, I just can't deal with the timing of the tournament.  Guys burning out during the real season because of the WBC makes me unhappy.  What can I say.  I think more Americans could get into the WBC if not for the timing.  I understand that it is scheduled in about the only slot that makes any sense, but it just doesn't work.  The baseball season is so long.  Guys need a slow build-up starting in February, not a launch into heated competition at that point.

     




    Space, I agree with you.  I desperately want the WBC to catch on but it does need an administrative overhaul....mid-season? Growing up in the US the international sporting events I remember most vividly are the '72 Canada Cup (and it wasn't even Americans playing!), the '80 Olympic Ice Hockey, the crushing blow of losing to the USSR in '72  Olympic basketball, etc.  All of them FAR exceeded my interest in domestic titles OTHER than those the Boston teams won.  Cleveland vs. Atlanta?  The game/games interest me but the result?  Meh.

     



    hahaha.  No doubt.  I was in Berlin in '84 and went to a track meet at the Olympic stadium.  What blew my mind, aside from a stadium full of people cheering like Cameron Crazies at a TRACK MEET, was the day before when I went to the KDV (which is a German Macy's-ish department store) and there were lines literally around the block to get in and get Edwin Moses' autograph.  So cool.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: I say no!

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:

    Spring training is for timing. Shane should not be allowed to play. The farm hands who will not be called up and will play a short minor league season, it would be good experience as a substitute for the fall league.

    No one under a MLB contract should be allowed to play without agreeing to a new medical physical testing review, after the WBC, that allows the Red Sox to void the contract if managment decides the player is damaged goods.



    Another anti-"labour" rant, Softy?  Injuries while playing for one's country is a major issue, but you can't hold the players responsible when they are representing their country.  The best solution is insurance paid for by the WBC/other that compenstates the club teams for their assets being damaged while the damaged players continue to receive the salary due them form their club team. 

     
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