If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to Schumpeters-Ghost's comment:

    They need to dump Xander Boagerts too.  He is another Boras client.  No sense in dragging it out. 

     

    Trade Bradley, Boagerts, and throw in Ellsbury - try to get back 4 aging mediocrities that hit .233



    Your Kool-Aid has gone rancid.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    I am just challenging the standard position:  Boras can't be dealt with.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Schumpeters-Ghost's comment:

    They need to dump Xander Boagerts too.  He is another Boras client.  No sense in dragging it out. 

     

    Trade Bradley, Boagerts, and throw in Ellsbury - try to get back 4 aging mediocrities that hit .233



    Your Kool-Aid has gone rancid.



      Amen to that.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to carnie's comment:

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    In response to craig2174's comment:

    My point is that if they are as good as the sox brass believes bring them up at 23 or so and get them under control while in 20's.  Everyone wants to keep trading for guys like uptown or Stanton, these are guys who got chance to come up at 21 or so and these are guys we would have to give the farm for. Why not see what Xander or Jackie can do out of spring training?  Is pro far that much better than Xander that he will start next year at such a young age?  maybe he is.  I have only see highlights of both

     



    We called Bradley up to AA to see what he can do.  He struggled.  You want to promote him all the way to the majors?

    Xander is 19.

    They dont have to be in the majors to be monitored.  We will see what Bradley can do in AA next year.  



    Tony C was playing for the Sox at 19. And he came up from A ball.




    not everyone is a Tony C or mike trout..

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to craig2174's comment:

    Why not let them grow on the job?  For 1 time I would love the Sox to give one of their can't miss prospects a chance to play before the age of 24.  For me I would rather sit through a losing season watching Bradley and  Xander growing but learning and playing hard, than watching a last place team with a 170 mil payroll.

     

    Tampa does it Oakland does it, now orioles doing it.  Why not try?



    PLUS FREAKING ONE! 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    60% of the rest of baseball does let their prospects play through the "growing pains".... don't let any of the "real fans" get you down when they brag about Napoli or Ross or Ortiz........ I am a REAL fan and I agree with the OP entirely!

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to EnchiladaT's comment:

    60% of the rest of baseball does let their prospects play through the "growing pains".... don't let any of the "real fans" get you down when they brag about Napoli or Ross or Ortiz........ I am a REAL fan and I agree with the OP entirely!



    60%? Who?

    Also, notice those players who got there shot early are all becomming FAs at age 28-29. The teams losing them also lose the prime years.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to mef429's comment:

    In response to carnie's comment:

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    In response to craig2174's comment:

    My point is that if they are as good as the sox brass believes bring them up at 23 or so and get them under control while in 20's.  Everyone wants to keep trading for guys like uptown or Stanton, these are guys who got chance to come up at 21 or so and these are guys we would have to give the farm for. Why not see what Xander or Jackie can do out of spring training?  Is pro far that much better than Xander that he will start next year at such a young age?  maybe he is.  I have only see highlights of both

     



    We called Bradley up to AA to see what he can do.  He struggled.  You want to promote him all the way to the majors?

    Xander is 19.

    They dont have to be in the majors to be monitored.  We will see what Bradley can do in AA next year.  



    Tony C was playing for the Sox at 19. And he came up from A ball.




    not everyone is a Tony C or mike trout..




    Yeah, but the way we treat our kids we'll never know if we have one of those guys.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:

    The point is not valid. Bradley, Jr did not "struggle" in AA. As a CF'er, his primary purpsoe is defensive. There is no doubt that he could offer more than Shane can offer, right now. But for his confidence, they should have him do one more season of AA/AAA, then call him up after roster expansion 2013.



    Victorino has three gold gloves playing centerfield.  (Which is why I can live w/ the overpay.)  

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from 111SoxFan111. Show 111SoxFan111's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    Let's just ignore the fact that the majority of our recent top tier home grown players were drafted out of college.  The age at which they were drafted clearly has no effect on how old they are when they break into the majors.

    Then there's Lester (no college) who started a bunch of ML games in his age 22 season.  But other than that ...

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to EnchiladaT's comment:

    60% of the rest of baseball does let their prospects play through the "growing pains".... don't let any of the "real fans" get you down when they brag about Napoli or Ross or Ortiz........ I am a REAL fan and I agree with the OP entirely!



    Anybody posting on a RS fan board is a REAL fan.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    Having Carl Crawford around for 5 more years and zillions of dollars blocks the kids from coming up.  Having A-Gon around for 5 more years and zillions of dollars blocks kids.  Signing guys who can play multiple positions to 3 year deals, not so much.  Between this shift and the fact that the sox are not budging on potential deals like Marlins All Stars for Farm All Stars signals to me, very clearly, that the Sox are employing a strategy that allows for the kids to shine when they are ready to shine.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    Having Carl Crawford around for 5 more years and zillions of dollars blocks the kids from coming up.  Having A-Gon around for 5 more years and zillions of dollars blocks kids.  Signing guys who can play multiple positions to 3 year deals, not so much.  Between this shift and the fact that the sox are not budging on potential deals like Marlins All Stars for Farm All Stars signals to me, very clearly, that the Sox are employing a strategy that allows for the kids to shine when they are ready to shine.




    not only that but establishing a proactive environment and a hard working culture to enstill in the next generation when they come up. Look at the culture of the team last year, didn't notice any negative attitudes from WMB but doubront surely took up the umpire pouting that the rest of the staff had..

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    The theory is that if you keep good prospects down in the minors until they are ready to be very good MLB players, you will then have those players under team control for more of their prime years, instead of pre-prime years. 

    I do agree that sometimes we should perhaps throw caution to the wind, when we have an awesome prospect, but last time I checked, we don't have any Bryce Harpers lingering in AAA.




    Exactly. Why waste some of your control years on a player by watching him struggle in the majors while they learn.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    The theory is that if you keep good prospects down in the minors until they are ready to be very good MLB players, you will then have those players under team control for more of their prime years, instead of pre-prime years. 

    I do agree that sometimes we should perhaps throw caution to the wind, when we have an awesome prospect, but last time I checked, we don't have any Bryce Harpers lingering in AAA.




    Exactly. Why waste some of your control years on a player by watching him struggle in the majors while they learn.

     



    When we get the next Bryce Harper, we can break the mold.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to carnie's comment:

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    In response to craig2174's comment:

    My point is that if they are as good as the sox brass believes bring them up at 23 or so and get them under control while in 20's.  Everyone wants to keep trading for guys like uptown or Stanton, these are guys who got chance to come up at 21 or so and these are guys we would have to give the farm for. Why not see what Xander or Jackie can do out of spring training?  Is pro far that much better than Xander that he will start next year at such a young age?  maybe he is.  I have only see highlights of both

     



    We called Bradley up to AA to see what he can do.  He struggled.  You want to promote him all the way to the majors?

    Xander is 19.

    They dont have to be in the majors to be monitored.  We will see what Bradley can do in AA next year.  



    Tony C was playing for the Sox at 19. And he came up from A ball.



    He was an exception. How many 19-year-olds play in the majors?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    How many 19-year-olds play in the majors?

    1

    Bryce Harper

    (Before that, I think it was BJ Upton in 2004. Now he was a FA as he enters his prime as TB probably misses his best years.)

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from craig2174. Show craig2174's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:

    The point is not valid. Bradley, Jr did not "struggle" in AA. As a CF'er, his primary purpsoe is defensive. There is no doubt that he could offer more than Shane can offer, right now. But for his confidence, they should have him do one more season of AA/AAA, then call him up after roster expansion 2013.



    Try to keep up.

    The discussion is about last year, not Bradley vs Shane this year or next.



    actuallt this discussion is about next season.  If they are contemplating using iglesias everyday, why not bradley?  I am sure he is a better hitter and i hear his defense is top notch

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from craig2174. Show craig2174's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to EnchiladaT's comment:

    60% of the rest of baseball does let their prospects play through the "growing pains".... don't let any of the "real fans" get you down when they brag about Napoli or Ross or Ortiz........ I am a REAL fan and I agree with the OP entirely!



    60%? Who?

    Also, notice those players who got there shot early are all becomming FAs at age 28-29. The teams losing them also lose the prime years.



    but we are not small market and should not lose them if we choose

     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    Xander is 19.


    To be precise, Xander Bogaerts was 19 years old until he turned 20 two months ago:

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=bogaer001xan

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to craig2174's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to EnchiladaT's comment:

    60% of the rest of baseball does let their prospects play through the "growing pains".... don't let any of the "real fans" get you down when they brag about Napoli or Ross or Ortiz........ I am a REAL fan and I agree with the OP entirely!



    60%? Who?

    Also, notice those players who got there shot early are all becomming FAs at age 28-29. The teams losing them also lose the prime years.



    but we are not small market and should not lose them if we choose



    It's still a big savings and team advantage to have young players under team control (via arb) through their prime years or at least early prime, than pre-prime.

    Is there any prospect player we have had in the recent past that looking back, it appears we should have brought them up earlier?

    Guys, we don't have any Bryce Harpers, and haven't in a long long time.

    Bradley is no Harper. Bogaerts? Seriously?

    Look, to me, 2013 is still a bridge year unless or until we seriously revamp our rotation, so it makes no sense to lose a year of team control just to help us miss the playoffs by less... maybe.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from 111SoxFan111. Show 111SoxFan111's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:

     the thead is about delaying young talent from MLB service time for purposes of fielding a better team. Crawford was the opposite of bean counting.



    Fixed your post. YW

     

    Craig - I'm all for having Bradley in CF as soon as reasonably possible but I have no idea how you can be sure he would be better than SV at anything right now.  There's a big difference between AA and MLB, just ask Lars. I'm not saying he won't be ready, but that's the point -- no one knows. Either way, SV won't be blocking JBJ if he's ready. Hell, even if we go out and get Hamilton, there's still going to be room for Bradley next year. 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    In response to Schumpeters-Ghost's comment:

    I am just challenging the standard position:  Boras can't be dealt with.




    If the player want to do a deal Boras has NO SAY. Ask Angels pitcher Jarrod Weaver. Boras might not be very happy, but its the players choice, not Boras.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: If Boston is so concerned with controlling young players

    Brentz is probably the closest OF'er/prospect to make the MLB right now. Bradley should start in AA with a promotion to AAA after having more success in AA. Bogaerts starts in AA. Needs more defensive work and better pitch recognition against advanced pitching in AA.

    Brentz starts the year at AAA and if needed, he should be ready.

    RDLR needs toi get  back into the groove after TJS. Barnes and Webster probably start in AA. Maybe Webster in AAA or a promotion there mid season.

    Thats our top 6 prospects. Nobody is ready. They all still need work. None are over 22-23. Thats still vey young.

    Lavarnway and Iggy are it. And Lav might start the year in AAA.

    This team needs to build a better clubhouse atmosphere when these kids arrive. The players theyve acquired will help do this. 2014-2015 are the years we should expect a lot of new names from the farm making themselves known. We will have control of JBJ and Brentz until they are both 30, like Ellsbury. Same with RDLR, Barnes and Webster...

     
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