In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Since I don't live in the N.E. area, I do not know if this forum is a true representation of RSN. I have read all season, without commenting, some of the hatred that is aimed at Wake by some here and I honestly do not understand. How many teams in this league can lose a starter for a game or two and have the ability to go to their pen and have a player who has almost 200 career wins come in and give the team the confidence that Wake can? What more can a team want or ask for from the 11th or 12 arm on the team? He started a game and gave the Sox 5 + innings of outstanding pitching against a team who won the first two games of the series and had perhaps the best pitcher in the AL going for them. He righted a ship that was drifting and gave you the chance to win and end the weekend with a good, positive feeling as you enter into May.

    Now I know there are fans like this all over, especially in NY. But as a Yankee fan, if the Yanks did not allow Posada to end his career with all the respct due him, I would be upset. Even if JP only bats .200 for the year, he deserves whatever chances he is given considering his legacy. And I think Wakefield deserves the same exact respect from ownership and the fans.

    For those of you in RSN who were screaming for the release of Wake - wear your Pink Hat proudly, because you sure as sh*t no nothing about baseball and what it means to be a proud, professional athlete like Wake. If Wake doesn't give the Sox one more win this season, his performance today alone has justified his still being part of the Sox. Let him end the year and retire with dignity and grace. If the Sox do not make the post season in 2011, it is  not going to be because of Wakefield.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    I don't know if it's truly representative, either, Jess, but I can only hope not.

    Wake has given the Red Sox a lot ... and many of us are certainly his fans. 

    Yet, it's a little like the annual call one hears about the Yanquis aging ... should he quit?  Reasonable minds think so.

    But we're called fans in large part because we aren't reasonable.

    Wake's been a great humanitarian as well as Red Sox. 

    The angry call for his removal I don't get. But then I don't get being angry at your team, anyway.

    Nice piece, sir.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Some people want and expect 5 aces.

    This is my favorite... "Wake looks OK for a while, then boom!"

    Well, that's the same story for about 95% of pitchers in the league.

    Wakehas bee a class act. I don't mind criicism, but he deserves respect.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Those who take aim at Wakefield do so because they consider him a waste of a roster spot which can be better filled in a number of ways.  Your comparison to Posada will be valid if he is still on the Yankees team in 5 years.  
     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    Those who take aim at Wakefield do so because they consider him a waste of a roster spot which can be better filled in a number of ways.  Your comparison to Posada will be valid if he is still on the Yankees team in 5 years.  
    Posted by slomag


    Except you are comparing a Catcher vs a knuckle ball pitcher.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    Since I don't live in the N.E. area, I do not know if this forum is a true representation RSN. I have read all season, without commenting, some of the hatred that is aimed at Wake by some here and I honestly do not understand. How many teams in this league can lose a starter for a game or two and have the ability to go to their pen and have a player who has almost 200 career wins come in and give the team the confidence that Wake can? What more can a team want or ask for from the 11th or 12 arm on the team? He started a game and gave the Sox 5 + innings of outstanding pitching against a team who won the first two games of the series and had perhaps the best pitcher in the AL going for them. He righted a ship that was drifting and gave you the chance to win and end the weekend with a good, positive feeling as you enter into May. Now I know there are fans like this all over, especially in NY. But as a Yankee fan, if the Yanks did not allow Posada to end his career with all the respct due him, I would be upset. Even if JP only bats .200 for the year, he deserves whatever chances he is given considering his legacy. And I think Wakefield deserves the same exact respect from ownership and the fans. For those of you in RSN who were screaming for the release of Wake - wear your Pink H at proudly, because you sure as sh*t no nothing about baseball and what it means to be a proud, professional athlete like Wake. If Wake doesn't give the Sox one more win this season, his performance today alone has justified his still being part of the Sox. Let him end the year and retire with dignity and grace. If the Sox do not make the post season in 2011, it is  not going to be because of Wakefield.

    Posted by jesseyeric

    Excellent.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View) : Except you are comparing a Catcher vs a knuckle ball pitcher.
    Posted by nhsteven


    It's the performance that matters.  What if Posada could give you a .250, .700 OPS every year for the next 5 years.  Would you let him stay on the roster as long as he wanted, or would you cut him loose at some point?
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View) : It's the performance that matters.  What if Posada could give you a .250, .700 OPS every year for the next 5 years.  Would you let him stay on the roster as long as he wanted, or would you cut him loose at some point?
    Posted by slomag


    It doesn't sound like he would start; and from that point of view, Wake has been at the back end of the pitching staff for awhile; but in a useful way.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    As stated as you denounce what others say.Answer the simple question:
    Wha would you put in place of Wake?
    What other pitcher can do what Wake does pitch in relief and then start and give you a quality start and have a good shot at winning?

    Would you bring up a kid from Paw and have him sit?
    Where would you get a pitcher who would be better than Wake?
    For 1.5 mill tell us who would you have take his place???
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    As stated as you denounce what others say.Answer the simple question: Wha would you put in place of Wake? What other pitcher can do what Wake does pitch in relief and then start and give you a quality start and have a good shot at winning? Would you bring up a kid from Paw and have him sit? Where would you get a pitcher who would be better than Wake? For 1.5 mill tell us who would you have take his place???
    Posted by JimfromFlorida

    Here's what we have at Pawtucket right now ...
    Kyle Weiland ... 3.42 ERA
    Brandon Duckworth ... 3.22 ERA
    Andrew Miller ... 2.42 ERA
    Scott Atchison ... 1.08 ERA
    Michael Bowden ... 1.65 ERA
    Rich Hill ... 1.17 ERA
    Clevelan Santeliz ... 2.51 ERA

    For the record, I love Wakefield and I would give him the roster spot as long as he wants it, but I recognize that it's probably not the best move for the team.  


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from tom-uk. Show tom-uk's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Maybe Wakefield is not a well respected veteran by a significant minority of fans because of his inconsistency, poor second halves/playoffs, and what have you done for me lately thinking.  My memory of him is that he has had great and awful stretches balancing out to  mid 4. ERA. 

    He had two poor years when first in the pen '99 - '00 and then stellar again in '01 - '02.  It was a bit frustrating.   Playoff ERA with Sox 7ish.  ('03 2.9, '04 9.8)

    It may not be fair but if he had been less up and down I think he would get more respect.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Wake isn't blocking top farm hand. Oki is. Wake showed his value today.
    Oki can't be trusted with the game in the balance. His roster spot should go to a lefty who can get key lefty hitters out in critical situations...the way Oki used to.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View) : Here's what we have at Pawtucket right now ... Kyle Weiland ... 3.42 ERA Brandon Duckworth ... 3.22 ERA Andrew Miller ... 2.42 ERA Scott Atchison ... 1.08 ERA Michael Bowden ... 1.65 ERA Rich Hill ... 1.17 ERA Clevelan Santeliz ... 2.51 ERA For the record, I love Wakefield and I would give him the roster spot as long as he wants it, but I recognize that it's probably not the best move for the team.  
    Posted by slomag


    Most of those guys have bad records in the pros.  Atchison has one career start at age 34.  Duckworth's been generally bad for his career and has not been in MLB since 2008.  Miller's career ERA is about 6.00 and has a 12/12 K/W ratio in AAA.  Bowden's gotten rocked in the pros.  Hill had a 7.80 when he last played regularly.

    You have to think about what you can reasonably get from Wake and others.  My guess is that Wake will have about a 5.00.  I don't think you can say that about the others.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Slomag - Posada is in the last year of his contract and will turn 40 this year. It is unlikely he will be signed to a new contract or at least one that pays him as a major league starter. And in truth, I would doubt that they will want to hold up a roster spot for Romine or Montero next year, so I think this is the end for Posada. And with that being said, he gets all my support this year everytime he takes the field.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    djc - the position  is "let the man finish and retire with dignity. It will not hold back whatever it is the Sox are going to do this year. And let his experience do you more good than harm, just like today.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View) : Most of those guys have bad records in the pros.  Atchison has one career start at age 34.  Duckworth's been generally bad for his career and has not been in MLB since 2008.  Miller's career ERA is about 6.00 and has a 12/12 K/W ratio in AAA.  Bowden's gotten rocked in the pros.  Hill had a 7.80 when he last played regularly. You have to think about what you can reasonably get from Wake and others.  My guess is that Wake will have about a 5.00.  I don't think you can say that about the others.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    Rich Hill has an MLB ERA under 5, and Duckworth is only a little over.  Bowden is only 24, with a small MLB sample size.  Miller probably would have been the best choice - he has a ton of talent but has been hurt by wildness.  He has been good in that department in his last couple of starts.  Atchison has made plenty of starts in Japan and the minors.  The expectations with these guys were about even with Wake IMO, without taking up a roster spot.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    djc - the position  is "let the man finish and retire with dignity. It will not hold back whatever it is the Sox are going to do this year. And let his experience do you more good than harm, just like today.
    Posted by jesseyeric


    I agree with the sentiment, but I'm sympathetic to the other side of the coin.  What if he decides to come back next year?  Or the year after that?  Or the year after that?

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    Jorge's had an OPS over .800 in 4 of the last 5 seasons (over .867 in 3 of 5). He has not followed the normal age S or Bell curve.

    If he goes over .800 again this year, he'll be signed as a DH/3rd catcher for at least another year... if he wants that.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    I think Wake retires and same thing for Posada. Maybe Posada can get a one year deal to ride the bench if that actually fills a need. But i don't see it.

    I think Wake is retiring.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    In Response to Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View):
    I think Wake retires and same thing for Posada. Maybe Posada can get a one year deal to ride the bench if that actually fills a need. But i don't see it. I think Wake is retiring.
    Posted by jesseyeric

    Maybe not.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    well, it's nice to see one fan understand Wakefield's importance to the Sox, even if the manager/GM don't think so...and the fans? well, let's be real. These are the same post-2004 morons who wanted Papelbon burned at the stake after the Angel meltdown and actually thought Cameron/Scutaro/and that Florida LF who I already forgot was going to dramatically impact the Sox as key players. Well the only way to solve that problem is spend 300 million on a lefty LF who sort of resembles the lefty CF and the best 1B not named Pujols...Spend more money, yup...But the bargain guy who seems to always come up with big pitching performances when the team is down...he gets what? He gets butkus from the organization and from his GM and Manager, who both have agreed privately that they decided he is done...well, screw them!

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    You musta loved that Bruins/Canadians finale!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from BaseballGM. Show BaseballGM's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    If Wakefield retires, Slav is going to kill himself because he's been claming Wakefield can keep going for years. How about Varitek and two or three more years. These guys will have to be kicked out.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: In Defense of Wakefield (An Objective Point of View)

    More lies.

    I have never said I wanted Wake to pitch more years.
    I don't really even like Wake. He's not even close to my favorite player.
    He never was.
    I am only defending our team's players aainst senseless abusive bashing, led mainly by you and some Yankee trolls.

    Never.

    Ever.

    Your lies never cease.

    As for VTek: I was against his signing after he rejected arb.

    I have never said he should be the FT catcher since 2008.

    Never.

    Ever.

    Get your facts straight just once softy...just once.
     
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