Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    In 2009 and 2010 Lee was traded 3 times, from Cleveland to Philly, from Philly to Seattle, and from Seattle to Texas.  The total return in those trades was 11 prospects.  Quite a haul, huh?  Here is a list of the prospects:


    Jason Knapp


    Carlos Carrasco


    Jason Donald


    Lou Marson


    Tyson Gillies


    Phillippe Aumont


    J. C. Ramirez


    Matt Lawson


    Blake Beavan


    Josh Lueke


    Justin Smoak


    Quite a haul, huh?  Of the 11, only Smoak has ever been a major league regular, and not a great one at that, with a career line of 225/310/383.


    The only point I take out of this is, you shouldn't necessarily get too excited about the potential return you might get for trading off veteran talent, even when its an established performer like Lee.  You might score something good, of course, but you also might end up with nothing to show for it but filler for your minor league teams.


     


      

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    In response to RigatoniT's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    u should reply to your own OP 3 or 4 times to draw attention..... like William-806 does with all his threads

    [/QUOTE]

    LOL...no, if no one's interested I just let 'em die...maybe these 2 replies will help though. 

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In 2009 and 2010 Lee was traded 3 times, from Cleveland to Philly, from Philly to Seattle, and from Seattle to Texas.  The total return in those trades was 11 prospects.  Quite a haul, huh?  Here is a list of the prospects:

     

    Jason Knapp

     

    Carlos Carrasco

     

    Jason Donald

     

    Lou Marson

     

    Tyson Gillies

     

    Phillippe Aumont

     

    J. C. Ramirez

     

    Matt Lawson

     

    Blake Beavan

     

    Josh Lueke

     

    Justin Smoak

     

    Quite a haul, huh?  Of the 11, only Smoak has ever been a major league regular, and not a great one at that, with a career line of 225/310/383.

     

    The only point I take out of this is, you shouldn't necessarily get too excited about the potential return you might get for trading off veteran talent, even when its an established performer like Lee.  You might score something good, of course, but you also might end up with nothing to show for it but filler for your minor league teams.

     

     

     

      

    [/QUOTE]

    good post HFX.  but one thing to remember with your example is that....ruben ammaro (sp?) had his hand in 2 of the 3 trades.  to me he is hands down the worst GM in baseball.

     

    other names i have posted under:  none

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    Remember trades are supposed to be hypothetically equal.  If you are trading player A for player B and Player A is a well established major player and player B is a prospect who is said to be as good as player A one day, then player A is more valuable because there is always bust factor involved with prospects.  This is why you might have to trade 3-4 good prospects to get a really really good player, because the other team involved knows all the risks as well.

    The reality is there is a very good chance in most trades there is a clear winner and a clear loser.  It's like flipping a quarter 3 times.  You might get 2 heads and 1 tails or 1 head and 2 tails, but there will also be countless times when you flip heads every time or when you flip tails every time.  Translation, some trades are going to happen, that involve every prospect being traded being a bust.  Other trades are going to happen where every prospect pans out and the other team looks to have been taken advantage of.  

    This is why it is absolutely insane and dumb to nit pick a G.M. based off of one trade, because the reality is you have to look at the totality of their decisions.

    We could trade haul for Stanton and most of those guys could go bust and it would have been the right trade.  There is also a good chance (especially in our system) that we end up trading away 3-4 future MLB regulars for a guy in a trade and we grow to regret it one day. 

    Not disagreeing with the OP here, if anything I'm reiterating the statement he made that "you win some, and you lose some" this example clearly defines that sometimes....you lose. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    The Colon trade for him, was a doozy too.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from billge. Show billge's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    Even Justin went up in Smoak

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    In response to crazy-world-of-troybrown's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The Colon trade for him, was a doozy too.

    [/QUOTE]

    Poor Expos...what an ill-fated franchise.

    I just noticed that Tim Drew, the other Drew brother, was part of that trade...too funny.

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    Miami has the same information when the Marlins field offers of prospects for Giancarlo Stanton.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    Left out of this cautionary tale is that Knapp, Beavan, Aumont, Ramirez and Gillies are all either 24 or 25 years old and therefore not necessarily busts yet…

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    same with Detriot and Marlins trade with Migual Caberera.  What newest Marlins player have been playing well for the Marlins since they came over Detriot?  probably none!!

     

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'


    Miller and Badehop are doing well, just doing well in Boston...

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    Go back farther to big trades of prospects for superstars, so you can judge how well the prospects have done.

    Mark Teixeira was traded at the deadline twice in back to back seasons.

    Big difference between the two...

    July 31, 2007: Traded by the Texas Rangers with Ron Mahay to the Atlanta Braves for Beau Jones (minors), Elvis Andrus, Neftali Feliz, Matt Harrison and Jarrod Saltalamacchia.


    July 29, 2008: Traded by the Atlanta Braves to the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim for Stephen Marek (minors) and Casey Kotchman.

     

    Sox4ever

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Interesting fact on Cliff Lee trades and 'prospect hauls'

    These are really interesting read and I thank you for the effort in putting them together.  But we are all sure our prospects are sure thing stars.  Right?

     

    :o)

     

    That is why we are so excited about them.

     

     

    4 4 11    ....   figure it out.  

    Hint, 3 4 10.

     

    Go SOX!

     

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