Is there a plan in place?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Is there a plan in place?

    I understand we have changed GM's and still don't have a Manager, but this team seems to be spinning it's wheels, with no real idea as to where it's heading and to what their offseason goals are. Cherington's comments are all over the place(maybe on purpose), but I have no idea if this team thinks it needs to add, Starters, Bullpen, fill the wholes in the field/lineup, or all of the above? Do they think they have budget room?....Are they looking to have a payroll less than last year?....Do they think it is the time to give the young guys a shot and make this a bridge year? I knwo the GM meetings are usually just for preliminary talks, but this team needs to know where it is going by the winter meetings or any free agents that they might want may pass them by....they already have to deal with the issue that guys may be wary of coming into this situation until they see where the dust settles.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    I think you hit the nail on the head...this team needs to know where it is going by the winter meetings or any free agents that they might want may pass them by...
    I seriously doubt that the Sox feel the need to inform the public of what their plans are and what moves they plan to make.  Last time I checked this was a private business and the FO does not post on this board.  Why would they openly discuss intended signings to the public?  They have already said pitching is the priority.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    I disgree with the notion that there has to be some sort of clear plan for the external world to see and know by the winter meetings.  Free agents will come because Boston will offer good money and the opportunity to win.  It is really only crazy Red Sox fans that think this club, with a few tweaks, isn't a contender without drastic changes.  If they are not jumping on the free agent market, it is because there really is no one in the Sox positions of need that merit jumping on and overpaying.  Smart move is to lay back and see how markets for certain players develop.  But I don't see anyone that is worth throwing blind money at.  As for trades, why rush?  Trades happen when they happen.  I understand that people want some sort of assurance and a warm cup of milk after how the season ended.  But there is really no good that could come at jumping too soon on anyone in the current FA market.  

    I guarantee the same people that are frenzied in November because the Sox aren't making any "big moves", would be howling in adamant disgust in May if the sox gave lackey money to CJ Wilson, or Papelbon money to Madson, or overpaid for Michael Cuddyer.


     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    why do you assume that since you are out of the loop, that there is no plan? This management team is very bright, and I think you can rest that they have a plan in place, and it will be successful.
    I will go on record as saying that 90-98 wins is in the cards.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]I understand we have changed GM's and still don't have a Manager, but this team seems to be spinning it's wheels, with no real idea as to where it's heading and to what their offseason goals are. Cherington's comments are all over the place(maybe on purpose), but I have no idea if this team thinks it needs to add, Starters, Bullpen, fill the wholes in the field/lineup, or all of the above? Do they think they have budget room?....Are they looking to have a payroll less than last year?....Do they think it is the time to give the young guys a shot and make this a bridge year? I knwo the GM meetings are usually just for preliminary talks, but this team needs to know where it is going by the winter meetings or any free agents that they might want may pass them by....they already have to deal with the issue that guys may be wary of coming into this situation until they see where the dust settles.
    Posted by tomnev[/QUOTE]

    ...and somehow you need to know all this. All things in time but can we have silence while work is being done? The hotstove is meant to keep you wondering...wondering...wondering...

    Enjoy family and work life. Do something for someone else and for yourself with your spare time. Learn some patience. Flip the page. Before you know it? Opening Day!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    Maybe I could have been clearer....apologies for the confusion. I do not expect a team to come right out and say what their plans are...I understand that would kill negotiating positions, but usually we hear from the usual Media outlets(Gammons, Shaugnessy et al) by now rumblings as to what the Front office is thinking....not always reliable but there.....this year the silence is deafening.....and if you add that to the fact that it is taking them a seemingly long time to make the managerial decision and the inability to negotiate the Theo Comp....it makes me wonder if their is indecisiveness in the Front office due to possibly the hierarchy of responsibility.....and as I stated I would be very concerned if this isnt resolved by the winter meetings. I don't disagree that this team as a great core of talent...it should being the big market team it is....but I can;t see how any one could predict 98 wins until we see how they fill the obvious holes we have in the 25 man roster, especially since there is not 1 minor leaguer we have that is definitively ready to make the jum to the next level.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Is there a plan in place? : ...and somehow you need to know all this. All things in time but can we have silence while work is being done? The hotstove is meant to keep you wondering...wondering...wondering... Enjoy family and work life. Do something for someone else and for yourself with your spare time. Learn some patience. Flip the page. Before you know it? Opening Day!
    Posted by WesternOregon[/QUOTE]

    West....that is why I posted a question and not a statement....to open up a Hot Stove discussion....if we wanted Silence why would we be posting on boards?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    seems to me that both Lackey and Crawford came with no advance notice.
    Free agent market this year is week, except for 3-5 guys. Sox dont match up well this year in free agency. I would assume this weeks meetings will lay ground work for trades
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from summerof67. Show summerof67's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    tom, I think there is a plan in place - it's just that the FO isn't disclosing it.  When have we seen the Red Sox FO to be totally transparent and accountable?  Rarely, I tell ya.

    If Cherington seems "all over the place (maybe on purpose)," as you say, it's because they are waging a disinformation campaign.  Misdirection is the watchword. Just like a magician. They call your attention to one thing and do something while you ain't lookin' in the other direction, IMO.

    Based on that assumption, I think a few trends could emerge

    * no significant, extra FA money to be spent on position players, hinting at the prospect that it may not be available. 
    *This most likely means signing a rent-a-player in RF (think Michael Cuddyer, who can also play 1b and 3B and can be had for much less than the $14 mil that was being paid to JD Drew) and then playing photographer  - waiting to see what develops - with the farm system
    *if Cuddyer is in place, then Youk becomes expendable - maybe packaged with some other players in a trade for a #4 starter
    *with the money the team saves on Papelbon, try to sign a closer - Madson from the Phillies, maybe get in the hunt for Francisco Cordero

    Nice post. Thanks.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TitleTown11. Show TitleTown11's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    Of course there is a plan. Cherington wouldn't take a pressure packed job like Boston without one....at least I hope he wouldn't.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]tom, I think there is a plan in place - it's just that the FO isn't disclosing it.  When have we seen the Red Sox FO to be totally transparent and accountable?  Rarely, I tell ya. If Cherington seems "all over the place (maybe on purpose)," as you say, it's because they are waging a disinformation campaign.  Misdirection is the watchword. Just like a magician. They call your attention to one thing and do something while you ain't lookin' in the other direction, IMO. Based on that assumption, I think a few trends could emerge * no significant, extra FA money to be spent on position players, hinting at the prospect that it may not be available.  *This most likely means signing a rent-a-player in RF (think Michael Cuddyer, who can also play 1b and 3B and can be had for much less than the $14 mil that was being paid to JD Drew) and then playing photographer  - waiting to see what develops - with the farm system *if Cuddyer is in place, then Youk becomes expendable - maybe packaged with some other players in a trade for a #4 starter *with the money the team saves on Papelbon, try to sign a closer - Madson from the Phillies, maybe get in the hunt for Francisco Cordero Nice post. Thanks.
    Posted by summerof67[/QUOTE]

    Summer,
    Exactly the type of answer I was expecting to get from the question....you have stated one side of the discussion perfectly. I hope you are right.
     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]tomnev, there's nothing wrong with wondering what the team is doing and I agree with you. While nobody expects the Red Sox to spell out their intentions for the world to see, there isn't any denying (in my opinion) that the team seems to be treading water more than anything else right now. You would think that after the way their season ended, the Sox might want to aggressively address certain things - yet they appear to be content with the status quo, telling us not to expect any significant free agent signings or blockbuster deals. Meanwhile we have Josh Beckett and Jon Lester, followed by question marks. Ben Cherington can't even settle the compensation for Epstein while other teams are starting to make trades and offers to free agents. The Red Sox have an aging, injury-prone third baseman, an aging, injury-prone shortstop, a grossly overpaid, underperforming leftfielder, no established rightfielder, and no closer, not to mention a premier centerfielder who's going to bolt the minute he reaches free agency.
    Posted by davetheknave[/QUOTE]

    My position?
    I've read it all....
    ...even heard more...
    ...repeating the same stuff?

    Gets boring.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]Maybe I could have been clearer....apologies for the confusion. I do not expect a team to come right out and say what their plans are...I understand that would kill negotiating positions, but usually we hear from the usual Media outlets(Gammons, Shaugnessy et al) by now rumblings as to what the Front office is thinking....not always reliable but there.....this year the silence is deafening.....and if you add that to the fact that it is taking them a seemingly long time to make the managerial decision and the inability to negotiate the Theo Comp....it makes me wonder if their is indecisiveness in the Front office due to possibly the hierarchy of responsibility.....and as I stated I would be very concerned if this isnt resolved by the winter meetings. I don't disagree that this team as a great core of talent...it should being the big market team it is....but I can;t see how any one could predict 98 wins until we see how they fill the obvious holes we have in the 25 man roster, especially since there is not 1 minor leaguer we have that is definitively ready to make the jum to the next level.
    Posted by tomnev[/QUOTE]

    Tom,
    The hiring of Cherington and that Luccino agreed to stay on for the long term bodes well for the future. The Sox have already stated the goal of hiring the new skipper by Thanksgiving which is still a few weeks away...

    Not to worry I am certain that they've already mapped out the goals as an organization for the short term and given the fluidity of the aquisition of players during the offseason. I trust that when the team heads south they'll do so with the best 25 guys they can afford to have based on the budget...

    That said, I like you don't have a clue what the plan is? all we can do is wait and watch it unfold in the coming months and trust that cherington and Luccino will do thier best to build a roster that can and will continue to be a legit contender...let's not forget that the roster will be somewhat fluid even after we break camp and head north...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place? : Tom, The hiring of Cherington and that Luccino agreed to stay on for the long term bodes well for the future. The Sox have already stated the goal of hiring the new skipper by Thanksgiving which is still a few weeks away... Not to worry I am certain that they've already mapped out the goals as an organization for the short term and given the fluidity of the aquisition of players during the offseason. I trust that when the team heads south they'll do so with the best 25 guys they can afford to have based on the budget... That said, I like you don't have a clue what the plan is? all we can do is wait and watch it unfold in the coming months and trust that cherington and Luccino will do thier best to build a roster that can and will continue to be a legit contender...let's not forget that the roster will be somewhat fluid even after we break camp and head north...
    Posted by Beantowne[/QUOTE]

    Bean,

    Is it me or does the Boston media also seem to be out of touch with the team also? Is it possible that Theo was the source of many of their info previously and that Ben and Larry aren't giving them anything? Seems like rumours were always blamed on Henry and Lucchino previously.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    It is easier to keep things quiet to keep the Yankees/BlueJays/Rays/Orioles from knowing what Boston are doing.  Same goes to these clubs.

    Another thing, the free agents havent set their market price yet except Papelbon for closer.  

    Plus everyone is working on the new collective bargaining agreement.  It is possible that they may eliminate compensation draft for Type B.  Sound like the free agency rules kept changing from one day to another, and it may be effective immediately if both sides agree.

    Last is that Boston is not the only team not doing anything, there are other 31 teams that are not doing anything either!!!
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place? : Bean, Is it me or does the Boston media also seem to be out of touch with the team also? Is it possible that Theo was the source of many of their info previously and that Ben and Larry aren't giving them anything? Seems like rumours were always blamed on Henry and Lucchino previously.
    Posted by tomnev[/QUOTE]

    I think part of the lack of news is that the Sox and the Yanks are both in positions where they're not trying to lead one another into overpaying for a player. While both have a need for starters, aside from CJ Wilson, there's really no player on the market that either team would overpay the other to aquire and even he's not a guy worthy of outbidding anyone for...

    The best two guys on the market are Fielder and Puljos, both of whom are clearly not in the Sox plans so even if the Yanks had a real interest in signing either, the Sox wouldn't be able to fool anyone with feigning interest. I doubt the Yanks given that they have Texiera locked up with Arod also owed a ton of cash over the next 5 years will even fiegn interest either.

    Thankgiving signals the begining of the signing period for the top free agents and as a rule. Unless free agents accept arbitraition and or reup with their former teams. the market tends to play intself out in the week leading up to Christmas once the top guys sign the dominos then start to fall. Papelbon's 4year/ 50 sets the bar for the top closers and my guess is that most of the top guys will once they're offered arbitration, decline and over the next few weeks most of the tops guys will sign deal before Xmas.

    Thereafter there's really no one guy that will IMHO dramatically alter the natural preogression of who signs and when...Puljos and Fielder will both get paid handsomely and I would suspect that Wilson will probably land something close 5Y/75M deal with Yank's or even the Marlins who will be aggresive this offseason....


     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]I understand we have changed GM's and still don't have a Manager, but this team seems to be spinning it's wheels, with no real idea as to where it's heading and to what their offseason goals are. Cherington's comments are all over the place(maybe on purpose), but I have no idea if this team thinks it needs to add, Starters, Bullpen, fill the wholes in the field/lineup, or all of the above? Do they think they have budget room?....Are they looking to have a payroll less than last year?....Do they think it is the time to give the young guys a shot and make this a bridge year? I knwo the GM meetings are usually just for preliminary talks, but this team needs to know where it is going by the winter meetings or any free agents that they might want may pass them by....they already have to deal with the issue that guys may be wary of coming into this situation until they see where the dust settles.
    Posted by tomnev[/QUOTE]

    No, there is no plan in place. Here were plans in place of recent Boston sports teams:
    1. Peter Chiarelli being named GM of the Bs, Julien hired as coach, team secures draft picks (Seguin); team signs superstar Chara, team builds on Bergeron, Savard, and nutures Marchand, Thomas, makes shrewd trades for Horton, Peverly, Kelley.
    2. Robert Kraft. Goes out of his way to steal Bellichick from Jets. Let's Bill do his thing. The rest is history.
    3. Danny Ainge. Hires Doc Rivers. Manipulates old teammate McHale to get Garnett. Acquires The wizard of 3s--Ray Allen. Joins them with old reliable--Paul Pierce. 
    Those are plans in place.
    Here are the Sox:
    1. Throw Tito under a Bus. See their jilted GM (gee, I remember him ducking out in a gorilla suit because he didn't have enough power under Larry L., then coming back when he got Henry's blessing) leave to another organization that promotes him because Henry no longer got his blessing after CC/Lackey.
    2. Allow their closer to leave with no replacement. Why not add one more thing to replace--It's not like the Sox have depth in SP (down to Lester, Beckfat, and BadBackHolz), or a RF (who?), or a SS (Scutaro one year older of less range), or a C (Salty? really the guy who couldn't cut it with Texas)--hopefully Lavarnway will be given a shot--, or a LF (well they do in theory), or a 3B (the guy is that much closer to being a DH full-time, which I think despite the Dirt Dog oversentimental view of him should get into reality--doesn't have the range to play the position and is now very injury-prone, 2 straight seasons of his body literally falling apart).
    3. They hired the GM from the existing staff. They have no manager in place yet, but will hire someone whose decision making could be tracked as he constantly made one bad move of sending a Sox runner to his death after another--yes Dale Sweum--or maybe another puppet with strings.
    4. So no, they have no plan. The soccer team has a plan, not the baseball team.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    The Phillies were aggressive in their pursuit of Pap. Chances are, this was a done deal long before the end of the season. If not, I commend the GM for knowing what he wanted and taking action to make it happen.
    IMO, the best thing to do is determine what the needs are, and take the appropriate steps to meet those needs, irregardless of what other teams are doing. Sitting back to see what the market bears cost us dearly in over-paying for CC last year. By Signing Pap, the Phillies has set the bar for closers. If the Sox want Buehele or Wilson, they could do the same (I actually feel they would do just as well with a healthy Bedard).
    I must agree with most of my fellow posters that vacancies will more than likely be filled via trade than FA. All the more reason to aggressively pursue a deal early, if the right player becomes available via trade.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtDawgSox. Show DirtDawgSox's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place? : Bean, Is it me or does the Boston media also seem to be out of touch with the team also? Is it possible that Theo was the source of many of their info previously and that Ben and Larry aren't giving them anything? Seems like rumours were always blamed on Henry and Lucchino previously.
    Posted by tomnev[/QUOTE]
    Theo was close to Gammons who would leak things. Maybe Ben and Larry are keeping it close and private. I have yet to see anything that impresses me. Big mistake losing Paps. IMO, he was the one guy they needed to bring back.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtDawgSox. Show DirtDawgSox's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is there a plan in place? : Theo was close to Gammons who would leak things. Maybe Ben and Larry are keeping it close and private. I have yet to see anything that impresses me. Big mistake losing Paps. IMO, he was the one guy they needed to bring back.
    Posted by DirtDawgSox[/QUOTE]
    I also think that their choice for giving a second interview is not what is needed. He impresses me as a "yes" guy.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    Most plans are flexible, meaning each move or non-move dictates the next.

    First non-move, not signing Papelbon. That will change what the Rs do with their bullpen. I expect them to build Bard down, rather than acquire a closer.

    Next move/non-move is Ortiz. The urgency in for a bat in OF is diminshed if Ortiz returns. The first five in the order would be pretty set if Ortiz returns. Assuming any kind of a bounce from Crawford, this line-up is pretty set.

    The club has made no secret that they don't think the top of the FA list starting pitchers are going to be worth the draft pick surrendered plus the total contract commitment. Expect the RS to look to more bargain based pitching solutions and for Doubront to get a shot in ST at a starting role.

    The status of Tek and Wakefield is anybody's guess.

    As for the manager the RS took their time with Francona and that worked out fairly well. As for judging a manager based on his work as a third base coach, that is fine if you wish but judging time, distance and risk on bang-bang plays and managing a baseball team are apples and oranges.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from KingOSmakk. Show KingOSmakk's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    I just got a text from Bill james and here is the plan:

    1. Lose
    2. Lose
    3. Lose
    4. Repeat
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    Francona was an experienced manager, for the record.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Is there a plan in place?

    Butch Hobson not an experience big league manager, nor was Joe Kerrigan. Jimy Williams and Grady Little were long-time bench coaches and managers in the minor leagues for a long time...Some inexperienced guys become great ones, many don't.
     
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