It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]what exactly did Tito do during this stretch besides fill out the lineup card that was responsible for getting the team a win? anyone...anyone...
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]Kept Pedroia in the two spot when he was struggling. Not moving Crawford up in the line-up too quick or Youk down.  While there has been a rush to use Reddick every day, Tito's approach is working.

    He countless times has used Bard with runners on late rather than waiting for the 8th inning. In fact I would say he has found a really decent rotation in thet bullpen, increasing the leverage situations he used Albers in. He has mitigated damage while trying to get Jenks and Wheeler back on track (Wheeler looks to be there, Jenks...jury out). 

    Most of all, while everybody down plays it, he keeps his team on an even keel no matter what the situation is and a 2-10 start with the expectations for this club could have easily spiraled out of control in this market. But that is nothing new for Francona led teams. Came back from 0-3 in the ALCS in 2004, 1-3 in 2007, went deep in the ALCS in 2008 in the face of many injuries and 2010 where the RS had so many injuries they should have been under .500 for the year.

    Tito bashing is a popular sport here. My favorite is when folks critique his moves when they work and say BUT "this or that" could have happened. IMO running down the field manager is the easier out for any eventual short comings of the team and a sure vehicle to deny any opponent actual beat us.

    Just my takes
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ALaGatorAL. Show ALaGatorAL's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    Actually, it was after the triple to start the 5th inning I was talking about. I gave his last run (6) to Scutaro for not throwing the ball to first to get Vlad instead of that upchuck to second. To his, Scutaro, credit he did get that run back and spark the comeback !! And really, it all worked out for the best because him hitting Vlad got him and Tito out of the game !! The kid may be the next Cy Young in years to come, who knows, but he clearly wasn't Cy yesterday !! As Far as the Hit on his Confidence... Leaving a kid in a game to get shelled by the Hapless O's, in my opinion, isn't doing him a world of good either and 5 runs in an inning isn't exactly what I call a quick hook !! I don't think there is a Poster on this board that can accuse Tito of having a "Quick" Hook in regards to starting pitching !!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ALaGatorAL. Show ALaGatorAL's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : Major league managers are leaving their starters in for 7 runs or more all the time.  If you go through the daily box scores you will find examples of this almost every day, usually several examples of it each day.  I think it's hilarious that the Tito bashers don't notice this.  It's like they only watch the Red Sox play and ignore the rest of baseball.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]


     You're right I don't notice it !! I don't really give a flying crap what other managers are doing with their teams because most of them don't manage a team with 15 All Stars on it and don't have other options. So laugh away and watch Tito leave in a guy giving up 7 runs, I choose to complain about it !!
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]what exactly did Tito do during this stretch besides fill out the lineup card that was responsible for getting the team a win? anyone...anyone...
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]
    Geo, many times you come across as very knowledgeable and reasonable. And then there's now.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ALaGatorAL. Show ALaGatorAL's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : LOL, Zilla, yes, that I would accept as an example.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]


     Actually, a Manager calling for a play, like a Suicide squeeze immediately comes to mind, to win a game is more likely and I have seen that several times !!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again :  Actually, a Manager calling for a play, like a Suicide squeeze immediately comes to mind, to win a game is more likely and I have seen that several times !!
    Posted by ALaGatorAL[/QUOTE]

    And we all remember one time it didn't work for Scioscia in a pretty big game.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again :  Actually, a Manager calling for a play, like a Suicide squeeze immediately comes to mind, to win a game is more likely and I have seen that several times !!
    Posted by ALaGatorAL[/QUOTE]

    Just curious:  when is the last time you saw a manager call for a suicide squeeze with a game in the balance?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again :  You're right I don't notice it !! I don't really give a flying crap what other managers are doing with their teams because most of them don't manage a team with 15 All Stars on it and don't have other options. So laugh away and watch Tito leave in a guy giving up 7 runs, I choose to complain about it !!
    Posted by ALaGatorAL[/QUOTE]

    Oh yeah right, Tito has others options the other managers don't have...I forgot that Major League Baseball lets the Red Sox have a bigger roster and more pitchers in the bullpen than the other teams do.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    Why can't Francoma be like some of the previous Red Sox managers?They didn't win anything,but they were great strategists.
       Hopefully,Francoma can stumble,bumble and mis-manage the Red Sox to their third World Series Championship in 7 years.Maybe they'll win in spite of Tito. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from the_yazzer. Show the_yazzer's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]He's still a buffoon when it comes to on field strategy. If it were not for the sorry pitching we have been facing, his station-to-station offensive managing style is too safe. Francona is not a risk taker, and not agressive whatsoever on offense. He routinely will not test opposing OF arms and seldom plays hit and run. Lately, Ellsbury has been getting on base but has failed to attempt a SB. I don't know if that's on Francona or Ells but it's rediculous for him not to be running on the first or second pitch. He ties Pedey's hands when he doesn't run Esllbury.
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]


    when the SOX are winning consistently, like now, the tito praisers come out;
    when the SOX are losing the tito bashers come out.
    sounds like both sides of the same coin.
    btw, i do agree that as a field manager tito is weak; but as a clubhouse manager, he may be the best in the game.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]what exactly did Tito do during this stretch besides fill out the lineup card that was responsible for getting the team a win? anyone...anyone...
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]

    Well apparently he managed the team.  You know decided who plays, which pitchers start and relieve, the order that they do so.  he dealt with whatever morale and personal issues that came up.  You know, he did his job.  What is your point?  What is he supposed to do?




     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from the_yazzer. Show the_yazzer's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again :  I believe two Umpires made a couple of moves, Tossing two Pitchers (Paps & Kyle) when clearly Tito wouldn't have taken them out of the games, even though it was clear to just about everyone watching the game, that wasn't preoccupied with chewing gum and seeds, that they were through. I'm thinking the Sox may have had two more losses if not for those Umps !! And for what it's worth... Didn't Tito kinda leave Lackey in for like 7 runs before yanking him in the only loss in the last 10 ?? Anyway, Who could remember every botched move by Tito ??
    Posted by ALaGatorAL[/QUOTE]

    in other words, if i read your comment correctly, the umps are doing a better job of pitcher management than tito. makes sense to me because, unlike tito, the umps are watching the SOX pitchers very closely.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BOSOX1941. Show BOSOX1941's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : My answer to that is, show me any wins in baseball history that were the direct result of the manager.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]

    Exactly..........thanks.
    Watch closely to see the the losses or potential losses(games won in spite of) that can be attributed to any manager. They all have contributed to their teams loss total. It's just that Francona does it on a regular basis. As far as this latest winning record, he's done an amazing job. He's pretty much stayed out of the way. It's when he tries to manage that he gets in trouble. Buffoon is a perfect description of his field managing abilities.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimdavis. Show jimdavis's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : when the SOX are winning consistently, like now, the tito praisers come out; when the SOX are losing the tito bashers come out. sounds like both sides of the same coin. btw, i do agree that as a field manager tito is weak; but as a clubhouse manager, he may be the best in the game.
    Posted by the_yazzer[/QUOTE]

    Nope, you are wrong.  Even when the Sox were losing, I was not on here saying Tito must go of that Tito is great.  I was saying the pitchers had to pitch...which they started to do.  What he did was insulate the team and let them figure it out.  Which they did as well.  There will be other 3 game losing streaks because the Rays, Yanks and other teams are good also.  It is how you deal with the down times that defines a team.  Tito has guided them back from where the ESPN ticker had them dead in April and May.  Tito preached patience and the team has responded.  I know all you bashers have the reasons why at the ready.  And it pains you to have to go into the anti-Tito bag of tricks.  Once again, you lose and Tito wins...crazy like a fox!
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BOSOX1941. Show BOSOX1941's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : And we all remember one time it didn't work for Scioscia in a pretty big game.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]

    Yes we do, remember the ONE time it didn't work for Scioscia.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : How does your preferred managerial style compare to what the FO prefers and what Bill James / Moneyball analysis dictates? Did it ever occur to you that Tito was hired to manage the way that he does?
    Posted by Your-Echo[/QUOTE]

    He was hired because he is a yes-man for Theo, since Epstein is the one who calls the shots.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again : Classic...Simply classic!
    Posted by jimdavis[/QUOTE]

    Thanks! I thought so too.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]So every time Ellsbury gets on he should be running on the first or second pitch?  Nonsense!  You vary everything so you get in no pattern.  What if he doesn't have a good read?  What if the situation dictates letting Pedey do what he does?  I guess if Tito was not a buffoon, the team would have been 11-0 rather than 10-1.  I love how the Sox offense is great UNTIL it doesn't fit the narrative.  Then its the other team's pitching suks.
    Posted by jimdavis[/QUOTE]

    Well, the O's do have the worst ERA in the league. The Sox offense IS good (well, for some guys anyway).
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    Maybe these examples will help some of you feel better.From a yahoo.com article:

    http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Oops-Tony-La-Russa-turns-in-wrong-lineup-card-o?urn=mlb-wp12148

    As detailed by the St. Louis Post-Dispatch's Rick Hummel, La Russa handed the wrong lineup card to the umpiring crew before Friday night's game against the Arizona Diamondbacks. He intended to give catcher Yadier Molina(notes) the night off, but accidentally wrote him on the lineup card he made out a day earlier. La Russa caught the mistake on Friday afternoon and had backup catcher Gerald Laird(notes) on the lineup card he sent to the Arizona coaches. But Molina's name was still on the card he gave to the umpires — which was then given to the D-Backs — at home plate.

    D-Backs manager Kirk Gibson noticed the differences between the two lineup cards and brought it to home plate umpire Ed Rapuano's attention after the first inning, when Laird had taken the field. Rapuano informed La Russa that he'd effectively made a substitution, so Molina couldn't come into the game.
    "No excuse," La Russa said Saturday. "Messed up, and it could have been significant."

    From Tampabay.com:

    http://www.tampabay.com/sports/baseball/rays/article1001836.ece

    Quality assurance coach Todd Greene usually inputs and prints the lineup card and bench coach Dave Martinez checks it. But manager Joe Maddon's signature is at the bottom, which means he's at the top of the list to blame for Sunday's mixup.

    "It was my mistake. … It was my fault," Maddon said. "I screwed up. Nobody else did."

    The computer-printed card had No. 5s — the position number for third base — next to the names of Evan Longoria, the usual starter who was to be the DH Sunday, and Ben Zobrist, who was supposed to play third. The program even circles the position next to the name of the DH as a reminder.

    The Indians waited until Zobrist played third in the top of the first to point out the mistake. The Rays lost the DH and had to put pitcher Andy Sonnanstine in the No. 3 spot, where he'd last hit "maybe" in Little League

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    Why should Tito take undue risks Ali? When you have a very strong lineup all the way around the right way to play/manage is a bit more conservative. 

    As for Georom, how it is possible for Tito to only lose games but never win them? Someday when you can explain that you can salvage your Tito-hating credibility. 

    It is fair to distinguish between Tito as clubhouse manager (one of the best in the game at handling the clubhouse/player relationships) and onfield strategist, where there are differing opinions. I think that's fair to separate the two a bit, and the onflield side is where we can have a bit more debate. 

    However, I'd like the folks who bash Tito's onfield strategy to wrap their heads around the fact that Tito manages differently in the postseason than the regular season. You may not agree with that approach, but that's very different than calling him a "buffoon" because he doesn't follow your armchair basement philosophy. I happen to agree with that style, the baseball regular season is a grind and it's more important to come out healthy and with a playoff spot secured. Tito is pretty darn good at that. In the postseason Tito has outmanaged some of the best in the game, including several that are often hero-worshipped by Tito bashers here.


     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from saxydogg77. Show saxydogg77's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    Tito is an extension of the FO, so know that if you're bashing Tito, you're bashing the FO as well; the same FO that brought us the 2 most recent WS.  If you blame Tito for all the losses, then you MUST also give him credit for the wins.  Any other approach is committing several logic fallacies.  This team was not built for, nor should they ever play (except in the most obvious/dire circumstances) small ball.  This is a Moneyball team (high OB%, high SLG%).  Only the most ignorant fan thinks that a manager can only affect a game by calling for a hit-and-run or sac bunt.  Tito and the FO have won far more baseball games then they have lost and will have the Sox in contention every season that they are around.  How could any fan of this franchise NOT see this?  The mind boggles. 
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from toolfinder. Show toolfinder's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    Another well thought out jimdavis thread following his successful formula of

    1-Calling out other posters
    2-I told you so

    Keep up the great work friend and let it be known that you are the shiniest tool in the pouch.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from trouts. Show trouts's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

     I think that Tito is a good manager and I suspect he has improved his craft since Philadelphia. He makes alot of good moves and some you can critique. Certainly noone is perfect except, it seems, some of the self-styled pundits on this site. You make any comment other than flattering about anything relating to the Sox and you are labelled "a hater" by some pom-pom waving posters. Unless you toe the party line as spewed by these "experts" you get ripped. How tiresome! We then have posts where they pat themselves on the back for being so clever. How boring!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimdavis. Show jimdavis's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]Another well thought out jimdavis thread following his successful formula of 1-Calling out other posters 2-I told you so Keep up the great work friend and let it be known that you are the shiniest tool in the pouch.
    Posted by toolfinder[/QUOTE]

    Way to turn a phrase, whoever you are.  And, I did not call anyone out.  I asked the bashers to step forward.  After some Tito defenders laid down nice covering fire, they were overrun by those who don't like him.  However, an interesting debate ensued.  My question is, what is wrong with that?  If you can't personally handle it or don't like it, don't read the thread.  By the way, I did tell you so.  I told you the Sox would recover and I told you that Tito would be around during the process.  What's your formula?  33 posts as "toolfinder".  How original.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jimdavis. Show jimdavis's posts

    Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again

    In Response to Re: It is Time for the Tito Bashers to Step Forward Again:
    [QUOTE]Maybe these examples will help some of you feel better.From a yahoo.com article: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/blog/big_league_stew/post/Oops-Tony-La-Russa-turns-in-wrong-lineup-card-o?urn=mlb-wp12148 As detailed by the St. Louis Post-Dispatch's Rick Hummel, La Russa handed the wrong lineup card to the umpiring crew before Friday night's game against the Arizona Diamondbacks . He intended to give catcher Yadier Molina (notes) the night off, but accidentally wrote him on the lineup card he made out a day earlier. La Russa caught the mistake on Friday afternoon and had backup catcher Gerald Laird (notes) on the lineup card he sent to the Arizona coaches. But Molina's name was still on the card he gave to the umpires — which was then given to the D-Backs — at home plate. D-Backs manager Kirk Gibson noticed the differences between the two lineup cards and brought it to home plate umpire Ed Rapuano's attention after the first inning, when Laird had taken the field. Rapuano informed La Russa that he'd effectively made a substitution, so Molina couldn't come into the game . "No excuse," La Russa said Saturday. "Messed up, and it could have been significant." From Tampabay.com: http://www.tampabay.com/sports/baseball/rays/article1001836.ece Quality assurance coach Todd Greene usually inputs and prints the lineup card and bench coach Dave Martinez checks it. But manager Joe Maddon's signature is at the bottom, which means he's at the top of the list to blame for Sunday's mixup. "It was my mistake. … It was my fault," Maddon said. "I screwed up. Nobody else did." The computer-printed card had No. 5s — the position number for third base — next to the names of Evan Longoria, the usual starter who was to be the DH Sunday, and Ben Zobrist, who was supposed to play third. The program even circles the position next to the name of the DH as a reminder. The Indians waited until Zobrist played third in the top of the first to point out the mistake. The Rays lost the DH and had to put pitcher Andy Sonnanstine in the No. 3 spot, where he'd last hit "maybe" in Little League
    Posted by mrmojo1120[/QUOTE]

    If Tito ever did this, he would be killed.  Since it was done by geniuses...crickets.
     

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