It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]ADG, all the more reason to fire him. If I was him, I'd just blast away and then really see what kind of balls the Sox upper management had. They could either back him by not doing a thing and letting him chew out players in public/media, or they can wait for him to explode then be appalled by it. I don't dislike Bobby V, nor do I feel he's not a baseball guy, but he seems out of touch to today's players.
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]

    danny - True, he should blast them. I'm hoping this team continues to fail. People won't show up and the spin will start. They will vow to be back next year. Ownership is a mess.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    I admire your defense of BV, but he's not a good fit, and it's a better message to shock the nation now by firing him. Do something dramatic, call it putting in the backup goalie to shake it up. It would be almost brilliant if say Lucchino fired him and said this, "This one is on me. I fired Tito, I forced Theo to leave town, and I threw Ben under a bus so that Bobby could come in to be the manager. I'm paying for this mistake. I apologize to Sox Nation."
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]dcater please man. The team did not respond to Tito. Why are you blaming the manager? Does anyone here really think the team would be better with Tito or any other manager? It ain't BV's fault.
    Posted by EnchiladaT[/QUOTE]

    Bingo. Garbage ownership, garbage players.

    All of the players below shouldn't be in the major leagues:

    Punto - Released
    DMac - Released
    Buchholz - Should be in minors

    You can go on and on. The team stinks.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    ADG, if Bobby V ripped the team to shreds, I'd respect him a lot more than I do now.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]I admire your defense of BV, but he's not a good fit, and it's a better message to shock the nation now by firing him. Do something dramatic, call it putting in the backup goalie to shake it up. It would be almost brilliant if say Lucchino fired him and said this, "This one is on me. I fired Tito, I forced Theo to leave town, and I threw Ben under a bus so that Bobby could come in to be the manager. I'm paying for this mistake. I apologize to Sox Nation."
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]

    Why would that shock the nation? I apologize? Really? How will that fix the talent? The clubhouse behavior? And finally dannycater, the worst starting pitching in all of baseball? ERA of starters is over 6. Do you realize how bad that is? 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    I would just as soon jettison as many of the headaches as we can... and plan for 2013. I won't be buying into anything when we finally win 8 or 9 in a row... which we will do at some point. The team should finish above .500 and to do that they will have to get hot at some point. I just won't be one of the ones wetting my pants when it happens.

    Thus BV can keep the help for the season... if they want to replace him in the off-season so be it.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]lloyd, it doesn't matter who comes into manage. It's a year that already is basically over. You can call it a learning curve, whatever, bring in a stopgap guy, or bring in a young buck who fires up the troops. Something needs to be done from a leadership standpoint.
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]
    I get where you're coming from, and lord knows something needs to be done. If they do fire him, it wouldn't bother me -- as I said, I was against his hiring from the start. I was hoping he would prove me wrong, but alas ...

    Still, given all the team's issues right now, Sparky Anderson couldn't help.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Guys, I agree about several players who probably need to find another city to play in, but again, it's hard to dump 8 or 9 guys. So you dump the manager. At least its addressing something, maybe it would help some of the pitchers....or maybe they should fire Bob McClure.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Actually, maybe that's it. Fire the entire coaching staff, the manager, and all of his coaches. Now granted maybe it's for shock value, but again, this team needs electroshock therapy like no other.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    I like this thread, this is fun discourse.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime


    We need George Steinbrenner now for a little team 'pep talk'.

    Unfortunately, I can't visualize Mr. Milktoast, John Henry, doing it.
     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from summerof67. Show summerof67's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    I am not the first to say this nor the last, but this is not Bobby V's fault.

    He is a good manager - eccentric, egomaniacal, frustrating-  but he is highly intelligent and knows his stuff.

    This fall squarely on the players and their conditioning, and on the medica staff that evaluated them year after year.

    We are just a few days away from a point where we will be able to tell if they can right the ship and make the playoffs.

    Doesn't look good now but wait. Just wait.  Give it a few more days.

    And no jumping off the ledge! This team is not worth that; nothing is, in fact.

    Enjoy the season for what it is: a journey through time with people of like mind and varied backgrounds.

    Take a fresh look at the young players in the farm system.  Listen to the ball strike the bat, or hear it 'thwap' into a catcher's glove with a pop that makes your head spin around as you say, "Whoa! That was a fastball!"

    Hike up to Portland to catch a Sea Dogs game instead of going to Fenway.  Watch those young hungry kids do the simple things that so few of us can do so well.  Again, as Crash Davis says in Bull Durham: "It's a simple game.  You throw the ball. You hit the ball. You catch the ball. Simple."  Ah, but if it is so simple, how come so few of us can do it at all?

    Yes, go to Portland, or Pawtucket, and sit in the stands under an August moon; feel the warm breeze against the back of your neck and take a deep breath. Exhale slowly.  Time stand still now.  Open your eyes, and say, "This is enough. I am enough. The love of my life and my children: they are enough.  Life is good."  One hundred years from now, someone else will take their kids to a baseball gameout under a moonlit and say the same thing.  Be a part of this timeless narrative without end. 

    Remember - the game itself is its own curative.  As Annie Savoy says in Bull Durham: "Walt Whitman once said, 'I see great things in baseball. It's our game, the American game. It will repair our losses and be a blessing to us.' You could look it up."

    Baseball, not the Red Sox, will be our blessing and repair our losses.

    Enjoy the season.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Yes!  And Beckett does take to long to throw his pitches! Bobby was right. Now he is afraid to rock the boat.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from chuchos. Show chuchos's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    The team clearly does not want to play to win.  Whether it's because of Valentine or not.  Injuries alone don't contribute to the ridiculous era of the number 1 and 2 starters and when the team is struggling with offense they should be counting on those guys to carry the load. 

    I do submit that they will fire Valentine regardless.  Especially when we look at the record after they face Baltimore twice, Philly, Tampa twice, and Detroit this month.
    Someone's gotta go, and it will be easier to can the manager than pull off any trades that don't affect the future.


     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Bobby has said some dumb things and made some head-scratching moves but this debacle rests all with the players. Players win & lose gm's. Injuries have played a part no doubt but there is still alot of talent on this team for it be under achieving so badly. That said it wouldn't bother me if they cut Bobby loose.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    100% wrong.

    If you fire Valentine, you will empower Beckett, Buchholz, Lackey and the rest of the chickens.

    Dump the headcase beckett, send Buchholz to the minors.  Trade Youkilis for a mediocre starter.

    The team will play better - guaranteed.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from proftom. Show proftom's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Nah, the sox are playing half gassed baseball right now. Not much can be done, too many sacred contracts and cows. Chemsity is half empty. 
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]Valentine would love to fry these guys in the media like he should. He did it with Youkilis and people revolted against him. He wants to open up on that arrogant SOB Beckett so much, but this management group just wants to sell tickets, which they won't.  They want to claim sell out after sell out. Did anyone get a load of Sections 1,2,3? Empty. It will be a sellout though. Franchise is a joke.
    Posted by ADG[/QUOTE]

    And the team was doing well until Bobby decided to blast Youk in public. No team wants to play for a manager that hangs them out to dry on the air. You have to feel your manager has your back and believes in you. Positive reinforcement is a thousand times better than shaming.

    Is Girardi blasting his players in public? I'm sure you'd know.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from YOUKILLUS20. Show YOUKILLUS20's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime : And the team was doing well until Bobby decided to blast Youk in public. No team wants to play for a manager that hangs them out to dry on the air. You have to feel your manager has your back and believes in you. Positive reinforcement is a thousand times better than shaming. Is Girardi blasting his players in public? I'm sure you'd know.
    Posted by kimsaysthis[/QUOTE]

     Kim, that day may be the turning point of the season, he called out Youk, benched him and the team lost 5 in a row after scoring one run the day after Smear-harbor. The Sox are 8-14 since Bobby's Japanese style sneak attack on the dirt dog poster child. You make a good point about positive reinforcement,
    the take-no-*rap style manager together with his equally tough pitching coach
    haven't really moved the metrics in any positive direction, have they?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    In Response to Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime:
    [QUOTE]Valentine was a horrible hire and a horrible fit. I can't even begin to understand why the Sox wanted him or thought he was the answer. That said, this train wreck is not entirely his fault. And firing him now would be crazy.
    Posted by LloydDobler[/QUOTE]

    He was hired to be just a fill in. The guy they really needed was managing the Blue Jays.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Bobby V, I believe, apologized to Youk several times for his remarks. 

    This team has the second worst ERA in the AL, which is mostly due to the rotten starting pitching top to bottom.  The manager can't fix starting pitching.  The one place where his decisions do have an effect is in the bullpen, and, after a rough start and despite the absence of Papelbon, Bard, and Bailey, and the problems of Melancon, the bullpen has been outstanding for like 17 straight games.  Francona never came close to handling his bullpen as well. 

    The lineup is what it is.  AGon has struggled for parts of this season.  Ells and CC and Youk (ably replaced by Middlebrooks, however) are on the DL.  While the lineup has in fact scored runs, I think they struggle sometimes because they not only play so many righty hitters, but righty hitters--Pedroia and Middlebrooks are exceptions--who don't hit with consistency.  It's the old RISP disease.  Last game in KC, Aviles has 2 hits, but not with men on base and left I believe 6 men on in that game including his final at bat. 

    Ultimately, managers do get sacked when teams play badly because that is the FO's only recourse.  But I absolutely do not blame this on Bobby V. 
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Not sure that firing Valentine will accomplish much given the state of the roster. That said, if things continue as they are and the noise from the clubhouse get's louder and fans fanned by the media start booing and heckling him and more importanly stop going to the park and turning on thier TV's to watch. He may have to become a sacrificial lamb to appease those that can't see the obvious issues with this teams performance. Like it, or not, the guy is managing with one hand tied behind his back...

    />Our Lineup is compromised due to the injuries of Ells, Crawford and Youk...Who when healthy each are impact players. Tough to compete when 1/2rd of your lineup in on the DL. Cleary it's Bobby fault....

    />Our Starting Rotation in particular Lester, Beckett and Buccholz have all gotton off to horrible starts and in the end. This team and in particular our starting pitching staff was built around Lester & Beckett...I guess Bobby V and McClure both are to blame forthe lack of quality starts by both...I won't even mention Buccholz...

    />The Pen New's flash we lost our closer to injury before the season started and the cause and effect of his loss is that we had to use Aceves in that role...it also doesn't help that Melancon started the year so badly that he had to be sent to AAA...In effect we've lost 2 key guys out of 7 and have had to replace them with AAA talant...

    All in all, I get that Bobby Valentine is the guy that's responsible for fielding the team that gives us the best chance to win...Don't you think his cause would be greatly helped if one of our "aces" pitches to the backs of thier baseball cards...

    Beckett last night gave up 7 in 2 2/3rd...CC Sabathia put up a goose egg through 8...Is that not what we and the Red Sox expected from Beckett...

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc44. Show MadMc44's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime



    Bobby V is not the problem. He can't control injuries. He can control who he puts on the field. I think he needs to have a long talk with Ben and Larry and explain the facts of life to them. Move unproductive players and give me a fighting chance.

    1. Whether Lavarnway hits .100 or .500 he needs to be the starting catcher no matter what you have to do. I love Salty as a person--he does not inspire confidence. For those that say Lav needs more time--he's better than Salty now!!!

    2. Iggy has to be the starting SS--move Aviles to the OF.

    3. Ciriaco needs to be up here.

    4. Padilla to the Rotation-Buch to AAA.

    5. DMac and Punto need to go. 10 more at bats for  Punto, without a hit, and he is batting .100. He might be able to walk, if he's lucky, but Ben you made a mistake--cut the losses. He might make a good minor league coach.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: It's Time: End the Valentine Regime

    Seems everyone is on BV's tail. I can't say I am, I still believe nobody could manage this team.
     

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